Faelings have a level 3 balance bonus. Mugwumps have a level 3 equilibrium bonus.

What do you think?

If you feel there should be another option, feel free to say so.

I think that level 3 equilibrium is more unacceptable than level 3 balance, for what it's worth. It's possible for speed knights (the only class to use balance extensively) to have a low STR etc. so that they don't hurt that bad, but it just doesn't work that way for equilibrium classes. Especially not mugwumps, who get high INT (the only stat you could conceivably lower to balance their offence in any meaningful way, although since INT affects comparatively few abilities even that doesn't really work) as well.

EDIT: And if they're toned down, they shouldn't get anything in recompense. Even with L2 eq, mugwumps are fine. Yes, they haven't gained anything since last time, but that will have been because they didn't NEED anything else.

Hmm, do you think I should redo the poll with balance and equilibrium separated then?

Don't think it matters, looking at the 66% of people who are saying both are ridiculous and shouldn't be compensated anyway.

Well, I think if the level 3 balance is toned down to two, Shadowlords might need some sort of sweetener, maybe an extra point of strength or con in their specialization.

Eh. I don't think they even need that.

I remember us toning down those bonus... and lots of complaining about it...

Oh? Was that before the race updates?

That was because you toned down the L1 and L2 ones as well.

Which really didn't need it.

This is because we as Lusternians feel a need to no matter what happens, bitch, whine and moan about it.

Like Shiri said, lvl3 needed toning down, but lvl1 and lvl2 didn't in the slightest.

As to the poll, I voted that they need toning down without compensation, though I wouldn't mind if faeling just kept their balance. I've yet to fight an overpowered faeling, except Murphy, but that's because of Bonecrusher, not his race.

There's a reason all the other games had lvl2 faster balance, but only lvl1 faster equilibrium. Mugwumps with lvl2 faster equilibrium are already better than any other mage race, lvl3 is just whacko. Kaervas often staffs in under 2 seconds.

I haven't fought you as a faeling yet bro.

also, I would trade my lvl 3 speed for lvl 2 if I got a bit more cutting resistance, or something to make me tankier. more str even.

why not a lvl 3 sip bonus?

Also thorgal, BC is no longer overpowered. Its actually harder for me to get a bashbrain now than it ever was before, due to the new wounding tables etc.

Wounding tables haven't changed one bit..

For the brief time I was faeling, lv3 speed was good, and then they changed it, and I went back to human. *shrug*

It's still decent, but it really doesn't need any more slowing.

Two swings of a rapier = 152 damage against Gregori. You don't even want to watch me taking on rockeaters.

Don't nerf the balance!

Lyco does only 250 a swing with his rapiers (pssst murphy get him better ones or tell him to switch swords)

Make faelings (slightly) tankier - one or two extra strength, say, or one or two con - and nerf their balance bonus to level two.

Mugwumps, on the other hand, should be downgraded to level two EQ with no recompense. Have you -seen- mugwump bashing? It's easy as hell to just beat the living crap out of mobs at insane speeds, and the loss of tankiness is almost entirely alleviated if you're a class with good defensive buffs (e.g. Moondancers - drawdown, Shadowdancers - nightkiss, Celestines - honour, Nihilists - putre).

'Cause one or two strength is gonna be so helpful for a faeling. Our speed isn't all that insane right now, if we take advantage of that speed with fast weapons we do next to no damage. If we use high-damage weapons, our strength makes it still do... next to no damage, and even two points isn't going to fix that much. We aren't MEANT to be running around with broadswords.

And it's nowhere near as deadly as Mugwump-speed nightkiss/moonburst/etc.

I have to agree that faster balance has considerably less overall impact that faster equilibrium. Although Tarot and the like certainly factor in, one thing you have to consider about faster balance is that it primarily affects the effectiveness of knights. There is a large misconception that just having the faster balance will make you swing faster. That's patently untrue. It has to be viewed alongside weapon speed stats, as I can show you several speed totals that swing the same at each and every different level of faster balance, and more that swing faster for some and not for others. When you get down to it, any weapon with enough speed to fully capitalize on faster balance is usually crippled in one or both of its other stats. This mechanism balances balance more than may be apparent at first glance, though it also highlights how equilibrium has no such in-built restrictions.

Edit: Darn you, Xenthos!