Hi there,

I was researching the IRE games looking for some new place to get my RPG jollies. I have taken to putting in a considerable amount of research on any mud/mmoish game after having played so many over 10+ years of mudding/mmoing. I have already written off this game due to the poor behavior of your admins and a player or two but I just wanted to hear from the reasonable players since I'm still curious about some things. Just so you know where I'm coming from, I just recently came from Guild Wars (Rank 6 PVP'er which means I have a lot of experience in their global tournament) which I left because while it has an excellent PVP system, a very shallow PVE game and I am mainly looking for something my wife and I can play together.

From what I have seen of this game, it reminds me of a very complex Godwars system. That is to say you are playing a text version of Quake and the RP trappings seem to just get in the way of players trying to kill each other for most players. I gave up this type of game around 97 I think after having been vamp, werewolf clan leader and all that jazz on several Godwars muds. Text Quake is not for me.

The best RP mud I played was Aalynor's Nexus where they had full PVP and full RP was always enforced. The main difference between their system and this one was the players were not split into 4 different factions and so the play became primarily PVE based with players REALLY needing an RP reason to kill someone, and deaths were investigated and prosecuted much like a real society. Unfortunately the PVE system in Aalynor's was a bit shallow and ultimately not satisfying. I found there was a lot of RP there without the "You said this about my mother so I'm going to kill you." excuse for roleplaying that you find corrupting so many PVP muds trying to do RP as well. I found the differences between that mud and this one interesting as far as the social dynamics.

Probably the best PVE/Co-op style mud I played was actually Realms of Despair. Their high level mob fights with 20-30 players were pretty interesting but the asthetics and RP in that game are sorely lacking.

These days I am looking for a good game for my wife and myself to play. Unfortunately while this mud has one of the best PVE systems I have ever seen on a mud (If the newbie quest areas are indicative of the higher levels that is) I would not want to subject myself and her to random ganking and a game where you lose three months of work in a five minute gank in order to attempt to enjoy said PVE system. This is on top of even if I had not witnessed admins acting worse than any 13 year old on a power trip on a three day old diku here already.

So anyway, back to my question: what do you players still get out of this mud?

Is it PVE or PVP?

Do you still spend any time PVEing or do you just PVP now?

How easy is it to lose three months of work?

Can you compete without spending a lot of real life money?

If you had to name one activity that is the most gratifying here, what would that one activity be?

I felt that Achaea had a much friendlier environment overall. Are the admins here the same ones there? Is the PVE any different really? How about the PVP?

Does co-op style play even exist here? Like most muds, it appears you don't even need a group to do anything. Is this still true at the higher levels? Remember I'm playing with my wife too so I'm usually looking for something duo-ish.

My character name was Ulai feel free to flame away or answer as you choose.

of course

If you're going to reply to a series of long, thought-out questions, at least make it more than two words. Elaborate.

Kalas Aesyra (Female Demigod).
She is 45 years old, having been born on the 7th of Urlachmar, 84 years after
the Coming of Estarra.
She is ranked 1st in Lusternia.
She is an extremely credible character.
She holds the position of a Shield of Light in the Celestines.
She is a Planar Drifter in the Fellowship of Explorers
She is a member of the clan called 'The Golden Veradin.'
She is a member of the clan called 'The Kalas Legacy.'
She is a member of the clan called 'D'varsha's Circuit.'
She is a member of the clan called 'The Star Council.'
She is a mentor and able to take on proteges.
Her motto: 'And so a time of awakening has begun..'
She is considered to be approximately 225% of your might.
She has taken the hand of Stagar in marriage.
She was born into the Se'irim family.
She is not currently active in any family.
She freed the gorgogs from their dimensional prison.
She became the first mortal to rise to the level of Demigod.
She passed the challenges of the Tosha Monastery.
She survived the horror of Kethuru when creation was threatened.
In Acknor, she helped the orcs raise a new chieftain.
She is a Slave Master of Angkrag.
She has scribed the tales of old Celest into the Tome of Remembrance.

This person from what I heard never spent a real life dime on this game so theres your answer to that

That was one of the aforementioned exceptions. She put a LOT of time into that.

Meeting other people, making friends, and if you try hard enough, feeling like you are needed and can make a difference.

The most satisfying for me so far has been being a Guildmaster and working with politics. I don't have time for it anymore, but it was vastly different then fighting, questing, or bashing, all of which are fun in their own ways. There are so many things to do, it's not too hard to keep it interesting.

Well let's see if I can't answer some of them..



Well, the thing I like most about Lusternia is that it is always being worked on and things change or new quests/areas or skills get added. That way neither PVE nor PVP ever get really boring, nor can anyone claim to know -everything-, there's alway something more. Also, what I personnally like best is that if you interact with some NPC's you never know if not an Admin might step up and actually RP with you through that NCP.. or take a bug for a reason to do a mini-event.



I've done both and still am. Even though I'm max level now (and the only one so far who is) there's still reason for me to bash.. or there are still many quests I haven't done yet.. try honouring someone like Rexali or Kaervas to see their honour lines.. just crazy.

As for PVP.. if you mean PK there is an avenger system that protects you in -most- cases from getting attacked on the prime plane, which is also where pretty much all the neutral quests are.

If you mean PVP also like, RP'ing with players.. there are many that have some have added some kind of little quirk to their character, which can turn out really fun sometimes. In overall I'd say you will most likely interact with players more than NPC's.




I'm not quite sure how you mean that.. if you speak in terms of levels, there are certain guilds that have skills that let them 'die' without actually losing any experience, and then there is trans planar which will give you the skill to die off-plane with only a very small exp loss.




Never spend any money on the game and I'm trans in all but 2 skills ( and I actually have the credits to trans them but don't bother) and 4 artifacts. So yes it's possible, it just takes some time and dedication, using money would only be the faster way but not the only one.



That's me trying to change Celest more into the 'spanish inquisition' type of 'good and light and whatnot' and move away from the 'snuggly and merciful even if they slit your throat'. But that's just me

What I probably like most though is talking and RP'ing with players.. no it's not bashing for all those non believers out there!
EDIT: Yes Shamarah this means you as well!



Played Achaea for 3 months and gladly traded it for Lusternia.. Why? I -hate- snuggling, kissing, killing or people using smilies on channels.. it makes no sense. It makes even less sense to snuggle people who are supposed to be your enemies..



I hunted to level 100 in a team of two. I -could- have done it alone but since I dc rather often (crappy connection) it was much safer that way.

Also, there are certain mobs in game that can't be killed alone, you need a group and good organisation to beat them, especially because the other side will try to defend.



Yes I remember you, and I think I remember the incident you mentioned earlier. So to answer your question, Celest may be the city of Light but it is -not- supposed to be snuggly, merciful and peaceful. We've had that imagine and maybe still have it because many people think like that but we are trying to move away from it.

Also, shrubbing is an ooc punishment, that's why you shouldn't ask for the reasons on an ic public channel.. because the reasons will be ooc in nature. If you want to know, ask someone in tells, I doubt there is anyone who doesn't know yet. Roleplay is encouraged here, so try not to be ooc on channels -especially- if a god can hear you whose RP is definitly not to be benevolent.

Shadow = Aesyra by the way... everyone thinks we should nerf her

What's PVE stand for anyway?

Player versus enemy/mob/denizen.

Definitely making new friends and feeling like you can make a difference. Plus, you get an ideal, and you stick to it. You get to promote it, fight for it. The best thing I've ever gotten out of playing (Though this was Achaea rather then Lusternia, but it doesn't really make a difference for this) was my ability to type. I used to be one of those people who'd use one finger to type, and spend a minute looking for each key. Now I don't even have to look..this paired with the diverse vocabulary you are introduced to in the games really helped me with my english classes. While it's true, it can be frustrating, (Getting killed, Influencing--That Stewartsville Catastrophe still has me whimpering--, or even theft) overall, the good outweighs the bad. I might feel bad or upset or depressed because something happened on Lusternia, maybe Narsrim beat me down copiously, or I died to something I really shouldn't have died to..but when something overwhelmingly GOOD happens to you? It's mind blowing, and it keeps you happy for the rest of the day and then some. So Yay Lusternia!

Player versus Environment, actually

Player Versus Environment, really, but yeah.

EDIT: 'd

If I want to be honest.. someone bought 40 credits on my account just so I'd get the never-delete flag, and someone else gave me 400 to buy a gem to make sure I wouldn't get hunted right after I ascended to Demigod. Everything else I made ic on my own, and that' a couple thousand credits.

I am an example of one of those cheap people who don't spend money on the game they love and if I bothered, I could compete.

Four transcendent skills and an artifact! (Got the artifact for free, but so what?)

Thats called a freebe

To clarify, it (usually) to me means items on a mud, since (usually) items are much harder to achieve than levels....not sure how it is here. I noticed a thing on another thread here where someone was being stripped of all their items through ...vestiphobia? I guess or some other method. Brought back nasty memories of charming and being charmed with a mage in Godwars muds and being ordered to give up artifacts, etc. You can warp in and out of planes there, different rooms etc. but not much defense against it, they could even order you out of saferooms on this particular verision. I always felt like that was a bit excessive of a power so hence the reason for my questions.

In Aalynor's Nexus getting BOTH levels and items was quite a chore and so dying could have very severe penalties as you were robbed, dropped levels, and then also could have randomized stat loss. However the RP culture there evolved to counterbalance this as people then took pointless playerkilling *very* seriously.



That sounds like the kind of stuff I'm looking for. PVP that is not text Quake is good too, I like the influence system.



I can't stand snugglebunnies myself. I don't believe that Good automatically equals Weak either though. The Spanish Inquisition was obviously very hypocritical and therefore not truly Good. I can understand trying to be hardcore on that to counter some of the snugglies though so perhaps this was a source of some of the friction there.

My first comment about that incident was actually something along the lines of "might not want to talk about it on public channels then" which one Asuma...Asura??? I think it was said "not really". I've seen him on other posts so I think he's been around contrary to "everone knows this". My wife was next to me actively asking around in tells about it and didn't receive anything from players saying it was ooc. Most of the players were trying to find out themselves what was going on. I remember a Yurika as well I think talking about the shrubbing as well as a Trae or someone. I don't believe any of these people received the treatment two brand new players did that night....myself and my wife. This is because of course noobs can never be right about anything.

My actual comment that people apparently went wild over was along the lines of "is justice in Celest being dealt behind closed doors". This didn't actually have anything to do with shrubbing ...after the shrubbing the IC punishment of throwing the guy out of the city came also....and my comment was an IC, RP response to RP attitudes I saw projected on a public channel. For this I was yanked out of my zone and silenced by a definitely NOT RP admin without even a chance to give my side of the story. I don't know what an RP god had to do with that as the response I got was definitely OOC. This was the second night my wife and I had been jerked around by the admins of Lusternia without explanation or nary a hello (being jerked out of our zones and inspected for multiplay the previous night, since I NAT).

This is why I call your admins poor. They may be fine for handing out canned answers to newbie questions and such, but when it comes to an actual issue such as dealing with a stranger with common courtesy, they fail. A simple tell starting with hello I'm an admin goes a long way before jerking new players in front of a desk and treating them like criminals....for an RP comment yet.

This god may not really understand the difference between OOC and IC and your administrator system kind of promotes those muddy waters too....I understand trying not to have obtrusive admins in an RP sense but if they're going to try to enforce rules that are that obscure they might want to delineate when they're RPing, and when they're not a bit clearer before hopping on their admin account and coming down on new players.

Thanks for your comments Shadow and everyone else that replied, very enlightening.