So, I'm new to Lusternia(not new to Muds/text games) and I've been having some charming discussions with Shayle about theft and why she says I as a Shadowdancer am not allowed to steal. Some of her main points being 'Mother Night doesn't steal, so it would be bad RP to steal.' But, does any Divine steal, and as IC mortals we can't live up to everything that the Divine, or in this case Mother Night possess(Yes, I know Mother Night is not a Divine.) Anoter reason being why we can't steal is, "The player base doesn't like it." Well, I'm sorry but, selfishness is available and we don't live in Seaseme Street Game, conflict does, and should exsist. Also, she argues "The other leaders have had a no theft rule, so I'm not going to change it." Some of the charming tells I've gotten are:

Shayle tells you, "I disagree."

Shayle tells you, "And I'm not changing my mind."

Shayle tells you, "No matter how many different ways you come at me."

Shayle tells you, "Because I'm right."

I've tried talking about this ICly but that is the type of responce I get, so I'm interested in your opionons why do you think theft should be forbidden, or do you think it should be allowed?

I've argued that I have no problem with it in the past; it makes for a more real environment. I totally understand why people get so frustrated by it though. It can take many hours and a lot of gold to aquire some items in the game so people are going to feel slighted when that is taken with such ease.

Yes, it should be forbidden, because it's not IC punishment, it's OOC griefing.

It is obviously meant to be possible with the skills that are available, but it is also an action that can cause greater loss to a player than you would expect from the proportionate loss to the character.

So yes it should be allowed mechanically, but if you use it like that, expect extreme negative IC reactions. From your own organization or any others.

That's representative of stealing in RL. :shrug:

Edit: So yes, I think Shayle's stance is valid. (Just thought I'd make that clear)

Shayle is right, even if that does sound arrogant (I'm guessing you missed the part of the log where you kept repeating your only point on purpose.)

Theft's too cruel to the victims' players to be allowed IC. *ninja'd lots*

Agreed.

And not to mention, I remember putting that law. Glomdoring as a whole is a rather small community, no one can deny that. The Shadowdancers are a small guild within that community - this may have changed since I left, but either way it doesn't matter. The reason why it is forbidden is that it caused grief for the Guild itself, it can get the entire Guild in more trouble than they need right now, or at least, that is why I put it in there.

First off, in Glomdoring, the Shadow Court is right, even when they're wrong. It's incredibly IC for her to demand fealty without explaining herself. Had Xavius been there, we'd've probably demonstrated how conglutination works for you.

Second, theft causes unnecessary attention to fall both on you and your organization. You'd be better off killing a Moon Avatar than stealing Munsia's pack. As the smallest organization, we tend to discourage things that will get all of us killed.

Third, this really isn't an OOC question. It is allowed by the OOC rules governing Lusternia. It is only properly dealt with in game. In game. In the game. It's like bug reports. In game. Not forums. In game.

Shayle is the leader of your guild and her word is law, don't like it? Contest her.

That aside, I hate theft in general and one of my main attractions to Lusternia was how hard it was to steal when I first started. Considering Pooka and Dominate in Nihilism weren't instant and if you fell for that you pretty much had to be AFK.

heh...exactly.

Don't threaten me. And as I showed in my first post, there was no responce in game. And I opened up the conversation with 'Can I talk to you OOCly?' Meaning she is no longer a member of Glomdoring Shadow Court or whatever, she's just Shayle, and I'm just Pawzik.

Not sure if Shorlen's changed the laws yet, but Moondancers theoretically allow theft (thus being one of the only guilds that do). You just gotta manage it in a way that isn't going to make the half the guild turn around and go... Oi, you shouldn't have done that!

Edit: I like to bring up this because it's one of the things that lets me go, "Here's a reminder for you all: we aren't the good guys!"

>.>

Regarding an IC law, in fact, it would be wrong to address it OOCly unless you already know her OOCly. It's an in-character fact of life, and Shayle's very good about seperating IC from OOC information. No changes could be made based on an OOC conversation.

A law is extremely, incredibly IC. There is absolutely no reason to discuss the changing of a law OOC.

Yehah, plus you joined the Shadowdancers, Shayle's word is law

Edit: <3 Shayle

S'why I can't fight this topic much IC. Anyways, I just wanted opionons. And since you all think theft is some horrible punishment I know now.

I don't think it's changed but there is more internal attention on it. Or at least there was for a while. Perhaps a few things were clarified, but theft can still be used. It doesn't seem to happen much as far as I know though. Do you hear of it often?

Nah, but then I never heard much of it before that guy robbed Jad's shop either.

Most organizations don't like people stealing for the sole fact that it makes them 'look bad'.

And he was punished for it, and she was sent her things back. However, the perpetrator abused an obvious situation he should not have - this didn't happen only because he stole.

Even if it's stealing from lifetime enemies who deserves it...