Lich and transmigration do not count as deaths.

As all other defence stripping abilities do not include vitae, I found it reasonable for inquisition to follow the same rule.

I think it's fine. It still strips lich, which is of course >>>>> vitae.

But when someone is killed as a lich or before transmigration, they actually... die. It appears on deathsight and they become a soul.

When you vitae, you don't even become a soul. So surely the opposite is true? Vitae is less death-like than those abilities, it seems to me...

The other defence stripping abilities aren't really comparable. No other ability strips -all- defences.

Inquisition costs 13 power, almost three times as much as Sacraments' death ability, judgement. It is harder to pull off than judgement. It takes longer. It is supposed to be worse than death: a true fight finisher.

Just as Lich is an amazing ability which allows people to elude death and never lose experience, so Inquisition is supposed to be an amazing ability which -prevents- anyone from eluding death.

This change creates an imbalance.

the ONLY problem with inquisition was its use in teams, and I told them to tone it down but they used it relentlessly to make mags pray on prime. I don't make many people pray and i generally try to return corpses....no one should have to pray I don't believe

If you kill a lich by ordinary means, you can chase their soul or trap it and kill them again, therefore making a real death.

The same applies to transmigration.

High level Magnagorans will just use vitae instead of lich.

Although it appears on deathsight, they lose no experience, and the Avenger justice system does not record the event as a death. Mechanically, they are not 'real' deaths.

If you kill someone on prime again after they have vitae'd, you will bear vengeance status, because the Avenger counts it as two deaths.
And Inquisition strips all methods of preventing death. I don't see the issue.

Edit: One other thing... for Magnagorans, why not use lich -and- vitae?

Praying is the only counterbalance to the insane experience that people can earn in Lusternia.

Now you can stop bitching about lich.

I'm going to approach this from a purely objective, balanced angle. Please judge my posts by their content, and you'll see that I am being neutral here.

Why was inquisition downgraded so that it no longer removes vitae?

For this change:

- Inquisition is too strong. It should be specialised to make liches have to pray, but there's no reason why it should strip vitae, this is too far.

- It is making too many people have to pray, which is fun for no one.

- Whether vitae hits or not is an admin issue, not one for players to decide, because it involves boycotting suspect, experience etc.

Against this change:

- Necromancy and Sacraments are a perfectly balanced set of opposite skills. This change was made with no corresponding downgrade to Necromancy; and no corresponding upgrade elsewhere in Sacraments; this is not balanced.

+++ No.

- The decision was made with no Sacraments Envoys at the summit, so it was a biased summit.

+++ I agree in your distaste for the post envoys summit. I'm rather disgruntled at some of the results of it.

- Neither of the Sacraments Envoys are fighters, or use inquisition.

+++ Your fault for not training your envoys, or getting an envoy who is a fighter.

- Inquisition is now not worth its 13 power tag and huge mana cost.

- This will make Magnagorans start to use vitae instead of Lich, which is turning players from roleplay specific abilities to general abilities; IE bad.

+++ I doubt anyone would do that, and I sure wouldn't.

- It will make the game more dull, as Sacraments users now lose their most potent weapon. People will once again die and then walk off safe, smiling at their killer and nursing a tiny experience loss. It will therefore discourage PK.

+++ This assumes the death is on the prime plane. Think outside the box. On other planes you get MORE experience because you can vitae them, then kill them again.

- Experience loss has already been reduced so much that it barely matters. Hardly anyone ever has to pray anyway. This change will reduce it even further. The main effect this will have is a psychological one; people can get inquisitioned, die, and walk away.

+++ Again, only on prime will it have any negative 'psychological' effect.

- Not being able to make their enemies pray will increase the experience disadvantage Celest has against its enemies. This essentially consists of (1) Lich meaning no experience loss for Magnagoran bashers, (2) The catacombs, a Magnagoran bashing ground. Etc. (Evidence: half of the top 20 for experience are Magnagoran, only 1 is Celestian).

+++ Selective memory? How could you forget the substantial effect sacrifice has on experience gain/loss.

- Finally, it just does not make sense. Why make it strip lich and transmigration, two unrelated abilities, but not vitae, which is supposedly the least specialised of the death avoidance abilities? There is no roleplay or balance basis. Inquisition was originally an instakill. Then it was downgraded to this. Now even further. Necromancy has only been upgraded.

+++ Wrong, necro has been nerfed before.

I can only conclude that the change is a result of vested interest in the conference.

What do you all think? Am I missing something?

Firstly, I think your argument is flawed. Liched and transmigrators DIE. Their corpses fall to the ground.

When you vitae, you get a message 'blah blah, saving you from certain death'. So it's less 'deathlike' than lich or transmigration, or equally so.

Secondly, you can't lich and vitae because it's impossible. Doesn't work.