Ok simple topic.. but one lacking guiding in this case.

Simple question, how can you make Hexist Nihilists workable without making tarot users absurdly powerful?

Theres no rules so long as your answer is serious and possible. Some things wont be accepted but at the very least this would be a good pool to gather from to make ideas of later.

So mention your suggestion, debate as needed, dont use personal attacks, and only comment if you are either poitning something out, giving a suggestion, or disagreeing (with reasoning) on someone else.

Thanks in advance and I hope the ideas are plentiful and workable!

The problem is that since Estarra doesn't like tert skillsets altering primary ones, and I somehow doubt specialisations are on the cards, anything that goes into hexes also has to be balanced for wiccans. I don't think there is any way you could possibly improve it - hexes will keep being the red head for Nihilists, despite my fantasies of it mysteriously becoming SUPER AWESOME.

What makes it so much worse for Nihilists than Wiccans? That'd be a good place to start, I'd think.

Lack of aeon.

This is more of a problem than it sounds, though, because adding aeon would make it hideously overpowered.

the most powerful thing about hexes in my opinion is sleeplock. I also believe that aeon is required for any sleeplock. but all this just says what SHamarah did, hexes is useless without aeon or a form of it.

Why not just a one second aeon then?

... what?

On altering, the problem is, the only things I can think of involve aeon, or altering the skillset radically: Conspiring with Malarious to turn it into evileye as a spec for Nihilists, as it'd be slightly better if you didn't have to draw it and could just hurl out affliction after affliction to hinder them. Less of a time investment lowers your dependancy on aeon. But as much as I adore evileye/mentis, not going to happen.

That, or te idea Estarra apparently hates, tert skillsets altering primary, to give hexist Nihilists a retarded form of aeon in Nihilism, astrologers some way to warp nativities at random, and tarot cards to paralyse or give a chance of a random affliction on hit.

To be honest, the task is flat out impossible if you have to balance it for wiccans too. Hexes is superduper for them. Especially you bastard Shadowdancers. Hexes isn't going to get a spec, or alter primary skillsets, so to be honest, there isn't much point in pursuing it.

Well, in a few months, Estarra might decide something has to be done, I guess, and tear it up and make it hideously overpowered for Nihilists and crappy for Wiccans, but it isn't exactly likely.

they probably also have much bigger things to work on, constant events and mini events which have all been fun. they were trying to fix bards and helped with glamours and i heard there's another special envoy for them. and they've got monks. I mean as bad as nihilist hexen is, it doesn't destroy nihilists cause they have the other options of tarot and astrology. the only only possible way to even make hexes work with nihilists is damage. stupidity, anorexia, sensitivity, addiction, stacking multiple coltsfoot cures to stick anorexia or stuff liek that. and then omen and quickening and or crucify if you're a titan and can refresh. course all of that is 17 power minus omen which i don't know the cost of. It'd be easier if you could carry more than six hexes, but that would of course help wiccans too much...i'm bad at this brainstorming stuff.

Actually, I've found the easiest way is to just single toss paralyse hexes. Hey, it's a small mana drain. You can dump six hexes onto them via doublewhammy and you'll have a few seconds, but you definately run out of help as you start drawing them. Face it, Nihilist Hexen are boned. Astrology or Tarot is really the only option, as much as I love all the afflictions I can give with hexes and the way the raw malignance works as a lich.

This may be a stupid idea, but what if darksilver striped quicksilver or gave aeon instead of stripping quicksilver or insomnia?

With harrow or scourge, you've got 1 or three guaranteed aeons they can't defend against, then.

You may create skills and ailments that go into Nihilism to solve this issue. It doesnt have to be a change in hexes itself.

Heck investing -a- hex into a demon might help but it might also be horrendously powerful.

New ailments and things that go into nihilism as skills would work, so long as they can be balanced.. if needed presume tarot users wont have access to it.

Demonmark, etch the form of one hex into your demon. You won't have to draw this to cast it, it can be cast directly from the mark, so you MARK DEMON and that one hex can be done without drawing. 3p to invest.

Make it two for 5 and you'd have a winner.

I would be afraid it would be OP.

If you could invest two... invest asthma anorexia... doublewhammy stupidity impatience. not uncurable since its still applyable but still nastyish

confused about this whole "you need aeon for hexes to be useful"... as ive used them plenty of times without it and without choke and usually its fine, just look for alternate strategies there are quite a few available with hexes..