Alright, how do people manage to get it to stick? As soon as you do it, the target will follow with earwort and then move away... a waste of 3p due to a single herb. And what's worse is not recovering equilibrium before they get a chance to run off.

Here's a log of what happens _every single time_ unless fighting someone who isn't decent at curing:

2522h, 3342m, 4800e, 10p, 12025en, 17482w exkb-
You play a perfect fifth on a harmonious airy crystal lyre and direct the exquisite notes towards Target.
Target gazes longingly at you.
2522h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 11995en, 17432w xkb-
Target eats a bog myrtle leaf.
2522h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 11995en, 17432w xkb-
Target stands up and stretches his arms out wide.
2522h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 11995en, 17432w xkb-
Target takes a drink from a pearl vial.
2522h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 11995en, 17432w xkb-
A blaze of righteous orange fire surrounds you, filling you with just anger.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17432w xkb-
Teammate razes Target's aura of rebounding with a blackened morningstar.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17432w xkb-
jj
Target takes a long drag off his pipe.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17432w xkb-
Target eats a piece of black earwort.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17432w xkb-
With a heavy overhand stroke, Teammate slams a blackened morningstar down upon Target. Teammate smites him
savagely in the nose, breaking it across the bridge and causing blood to splurt forth.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17432w xkb-
You must regain equilibrium first.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17438w xkb-
Target leaves to the northeast.
2688h, 3132m, 4601e, 7p, 12025en, 17438w xkb-


How is this skill supposed to be remotely useful if the target can so easily escape it? Not to mention all the various methods to force to bard out of the room. Remove the power cost, please.

My first instinct was to laugh.

So i'll just go with that. Hahaha. Learn to blanknote.

Oh, you mean blanknote with no equilibrium. Lolz. Of course, it's just that easy. Let's also not forget the massively OP stun that comes with it and the massively long time before being able to put earwort back up.

Target eats a piece of black earwort.

Trigger this to echo in bright flashing letters: EARWORT UP! BLANKNOTE BLANKNOTE BLANKNOTE!

The deafness isn't the issue. The issue is them being able to escape perfectfifth on a whim. Even if they put earwort back up and I follow them to blanknote (since they'll run before I recover equilibrium, even if they're off herb balance when hit with perfectfifth), they'll be able to run off again since the stun from the blanknote will end before the eq loss will. What we end up with is one long (well, as long as you can keep up with the power cost and they can keep up with the herb cost) string of perfectfifth, earwort, run, follow, blanknote, run (unless bard is a mugwump, in which case it might be possible to perfectfifth again... and then they'll just use earwort), follow, perfectfifth, earwort, run, follow, blanknote... and that's only if they aren't eating earwort after each blanknote.

They eat earwort. Blanknote. Perfect fifth. They can't put it back up before you have eq.

Ta da.

I've seen bards keep people in rooms through serpent with just perfectfifth. Bard really isn't hard.

Did you not see what happened? They wait to eat earwort until they've been hit with perfectfifth. Otherwise, it would've been different... but I still suspect their truehearing recovery time would've ended by the time I regained eq from perfectfifth, seeing as how the target managed to eat myrtle after the P5 and then followed with earwort and then promptly moving into another room. And if truhearing recovery is roughly 5sec... there's just no way to out-pace them.

And how long ago was that? Almost everyone with a decent system will eat earwort following a P5, and then they move as soon as possible. If I'm hit with P5, I just eat earwort and spam movement. It works quite well. But you're more than welcome to test a bard, and then we can crunch numbers to prove that it really is unreasonably difficult, if at all possible, to make P5 stick for a significant amount of usefulness.

So they take full damage from your songs but trade it in for being able to escape perfectfifth. What's your point? It's a tradeoff. To be able to escape your uberskill, they choose to expose themselves to the effects of your songs.

Oh, you mean the passive blindness/5 afflictions/meager damage boost/slightly hindered elixir sipping? That just goes to show how utterly pathetic the songs are if they're willing to sit in the effects just to be immune to a single ability. It makes an entire specialization worthless. The same goes for the Music skill. If they're willing to sit through minorseconds and whatnot, then obviously it's not that much of a threat, meaning it's underpowered.

I suggest that perfectfifth be removed and something more useful put in its place, such as something that literally roots the bard to the ground, preventing any forms of movement.

Ok you said it before. They WAIT for perfect fifth before eating the wort.

This is their choice to do. What the problem is you are fighting someone who is competent enough to choose damage over the affliction of perfect fifth. This won't happen with everyone. Try fighting someone else.

But you just sound like you want an EZ button. Combat is based around fighting people and switching tactics with different races/orgs/opponents. What may work on some may not be the best method for fighting others. What you need to do is take this into consideration. If you see someone willing to sacrifice themselves to damage to not be afflicted by perfect fifth. Use it to your advantage... stall the fifth, hit with damage and stick damage until you see them eat the wort. If they don't eat the wort before ya fifth again, just keep sticking with damage until they finally realize it might be wise to eat it. Then when they make that choice, then and only then stick them with fifth again.


This is what combat is all about, its like a much more interactive chess game. People will try different techniques and they continue to use them until the technique is stopped. But you cannot expect the same technique to work on every single person. Adapt to your opponent and try something new.

You are oblivious. With bards, it's the choice between sitting through songs (yes I know you think all that you listed is just soooo awful, but you are wrong. Passive blindess. EXTRA DAMAGE.) or getting stunned every 8 seconds with a very fast blanknote and things like perfectfifth which prevents running. Hello trade off.

Your logic hurts my head. That's like saying "people fight me in my demesne, so it must be underpowered."

That single ability can set you up for the fastest instakills in the game, so yeah. It's a matter of tradeoff.

But sure, change perfectfifth to make bards unable to move!

Only if the target doesn't immediately eat earwort and move after the perfectfifth. During the few seconds Requiem requires, the bard can not move. The target usually eats earwort before the eq balance is recovered from a perfectfifth, meaning they'll move before you can even use Requiem. Even if someone managed to get a perfectfifth after the Requiem, the target will still eat the appropriate herb and move away.

Actually, perfectfifth can freeze a bard in place. I managed to get myself stuck a few times with it. Not sure if it prevents beckoning, chaindrag, and the likes.

Here Zacc, I am going to make a little note that I want you to PM to Narsrim;

----------
Narsrim,
Ildaudid said I should ask you about how to fight as a Cantor. I heard you know how to use the Cantor skills and how to alter your techniques in a fight. Ildaudid told me about how you pinned him down in Limbo and even used that overated instakill we have on him. LOL, Ild is such a noob. But can you please give me some pointers on how to fight better as a Cantor. I know we have alot of useless skills, but I am sure combining them in different ways may prove more useful than I originally thought.

Again any help you can offer me would be great. I would be so thankful

Zacc
--------------



Now cut and paste this in a PM to him... and see if he gives ya a hand on how to better use the skillset you have combined with acrobatics. And yes, I know he isnt a Cantor anymore. That does not change the fact that he knows how to use Starhymn stuff.

Any smart person will do that though. Its really a no-brainer.

(Unless the bard is too inept to notice you've eaten the earwort, but I like to assume smart combatants when it comes to the capabilities of a class)

i dont actually do this myself.. i prefer to stay in the room as much as possible.. and i know a lot of people dont also..

however, I think the "going out of room after eating earwort" is an ethelon system setup.. and yeah, its a little bit difficult. i wasted a lot of power fighting someone because he kept doing that..

Yes, i have the "EATING EARWORT" trigger and stuff..

anyway, i dont know what to say to zacc regarding this.. but at that time, i just icewalled the entire room to prevent him from running..

maybe to get around this, use the glamour skill that induces sleep.. whats that again? maybe make him sleep first so it gets messed around.. or do a lot of colorburst to mess with herb curing.. or do princessfarewell and then immediately p5.. i havent tried all of this yet.. but there are lots of things you can try to keep people in the same room..

however, i would agree that it would be nice if p5 does not take 3power.. maybe just 1p will be enough?

It's pretty good at where it is, really.

and why is this?

a lot of nerfs have been directed at our skillset.. from triplefalsh to the speed reductions.. these 3-4months of changes have been really hard for bards.. and yet, nothing was returned in compensation..

lessening the power costs somewhat would be a big help

Because of what it does (as has been discussed above). It's got the potential to be a very powerful skill when used well. It's less powerful if you're just using it willy-nilly, but with a 1p cost that's not as much of a disadvantage. 3p is already a very good cost for what it has the potential to do, especially considering its application in group combat.

ITT an incompetent fighter points out a legitimate problem and receives the brush off.

I lol'd at Celina, though.
I don't remember bards being fine when you were one.
In fact, it was more along the lines of 'omg gaiz dont nerf bards r so weak '.
And you've said the same things about every other class you've ever been. Ever.
They're overpowered until you become one, at which point you say 'no i was wrong they r suxx'.
And then you guildhop, and they go back to being overpowered.
Like, is there any person on these forums who hasn't noticed this pattern?