I'm sure it has been said before but I only just noticed that credits are ludicrously expensive. 1000cr costs more than an Xbox 360 with several of its best games, and that gets you...what? 3 trans skills or one good artifact? Anyway, having played IRE games for free on and off for years I'm looking at putting a little money into a character for once. I've reconciled with the rampant extortion but I would probably only buy 300cr at a time, so I wouldn't be at modestly full potential for a few months.

So, what I'm not looking for is the best bashing or no credit guilds, I played a free monk in Imperian and felt that while bashing was easy, that was all I was good for. A better template is a guild that can be fun and playable for a while with only equivalent to one trans skill, but will play well at the higher end as well. I'll want to PK eventually and don't want to be a one trick pony. Also, I will only ever want buy reasonably priced or good cost/effect ratio artis such as pipes and vials.

So, efficiency is the word...any ideas?

1. One trick pony is every guild, really. There is very little offensive difference in players once a working tactic is found. You pretty much find that tactic and that's your endgame.

2. Least expenditure for maximum gain I would say bard. You can get enough skill in there to do bashing or influencing easily enough (spiritsinger your best option here, it is also a fun guild with little to no drama llama invasions, IMO.) which will get you in game funds for in game credits to pursue further advancement.

3. I have a 360 and about 10 - 20 games. I haven't touched the thing since the last time I shot Aliod full on with my shotgun in L4D months ago. I play IRE games daily. It may seem like a large sum of RL cash for credits in comparison, but it comes down to what do you use more. If you are like me, spending 300.00 on an Xbox you use once a month hardly seems like a good investment.

I would think wiccan guilds to be fun with little investment, but it's more of an outsider opinion than actual experience.

I have a 360 Elite with about 60 games, and I play it all the time. I have that, in part at least, because I don't spend money on credits. It's all about financial priorities and what's fun for you. (Gregori, get on XBL more. Heh.)

Monk offence works fine with only your kata specialization at trans. Good for bashing, too.

That's the thing. Without turning this into an Xbox discussion, as someone who likes video games I consider them a highly desirable item and they provide a ridiculous amount of content for the cost. In comparison an 800 credit artifact for a similar cost gives you a slight statistical boost to one weapon. It just seems that, unlike most games where a token of support earns you the right to play the game at its best, IRE games foster a Food Chain environment where really rich people will still murder you even if you break the bank by your own standards. I guess the small playerbase leaves them no choice.

Thanks for the input so far, I'll have to play around with the Spiritsinger I started. I'm not completely sure I like communes though, they've never been my style.

Instead of buying straight up all the credits you need, I think it's better to supplement what you buy with what you earn in game and through bardics and artisinals.

I've probably spent ~$100 on Lusternia, (and most of those credits were split between two people), but I have a lot of trans skills and some artifacts, like pipes and a rune of absorption.

I would have to agree with Vey that monk is probably the cheapest for entry level fighting and excellent bashing.

And unless I'm forgetting something, you can probably kill someone with just the Druidry skill, which will also make you useful in group fights, if that's your thing, but bashing will be terrible. Druids are definitely a one trick pony, though. All you'll ever do 1v1 is go for a sap lock. But group fights would be more interesting, as you would be running around trying to keep a meld up.

edit: And yeah, spending credits on things definitely has diminishing returns. Once you have all the skills you want, artifacts provide very little given how much they cost.

Don't make a warrior, whatever you do. Monks and bards derive almost all of their offense from their primary skill, so I'd say one of those would be your best bet, followed closely by druids. I like druids because the power of their demesne makes defensive skills (combat/resilience/magic) a lot less important, because as long as your enemy is getting hit by it and you they're unlikely to get their offense going. Also, a druid's main kill ability, sap, is actually found in druidry, as are saplings. You won't be getting any kills as a mage until you've maxed your mage specialization, your tertiary (runes/psionics) and probably also phantasms, which also contains the mage equivalent of saplings.

Also, any class that relies on low-mana or low-ego kills (guardians and mages) is going to almost require you to reach 50% mythical in discernment, so steer clear of them.

I buy a video game, play it for a month or two, and I've gotten my money's worth. However, I may never put that game in again, so it's usefulness is over for me.

Skills and artifacts in Lusternia are cumulative and longer lasting. I can play with all of them at the same time for as long as I wish. And, the game gets easier with every credit invested into a character, if done properly.

This isn't entirely true. It's true that there are a number of guilds that are one-trick ponies in terms of their actual kill conditions (eg. inquisition->soulless for celestines) but the variety is in how you achieve those conditions. Take nihilists for example; their only viable kill condition is sacrifice, but the class greatly rewards creativity and there are a lot of ways of accomplishing it. The only archetype that I'd say is truly linear with no room for innovation at all is Druid.



Guardian mana instakills are complete garbage and you shouldn't touch them with a twenty-foot pole anyway, so it doesn't matter if you have contemplate for those. For mages, it only matters if you're a telepath, and IIRC there's a skill in psionics now that checks ego anyway, although it does cost one of your balances. The class you want to watch out for with regards to this is wiccan - wiccans actually do rely on their mana instakill and have no way of checking mana without getting contemplate (the high-level discernment skill Azoth is referring to).

Anyway, I'd go for bard, monk, or druid for low-investment classes.

I think Azoth is referring to discern, which is at 50% mythical, which you need for ego kills.

For mana kills you just need contemplate...which is at 0% Fabled.

Right, but fabled discernment is still a lot of credits in a tertiary skill for a guild that also needs all three guild skills and discipline transed.

Monks are a good class if you don't want to spend too much credits. I've never played around with the class myself since I wasn't as enthusiastic about learning the loops of katas than I was with the bard songs. My sole monk experience was a faeling shofangi who basically hunted at the Nexus although I occasionally risked aslarans/krokanis. Faeling monks aren't incredibly tanky but they allow you to influence quite well in Tosha because of their high charisma. When it comes to bashing speed and efficiency, monks are the way to go.

Bards are also good (Harbinger faelings, Spiritsinger elfens, -and- Cacophony faelings/viscanti,sorry never tried playing a Cantor) if you go the influencing path. Transing your specialization isn't a requirement if you mostly influence - there are quite a few music spec skills that help improve your influencing(improved regeneration, increased charisma, etc.). Earning experience and climbing the level ladder will be a breeze until you hit the 70's, but hopefully you've sold a lot of esteemed things and stocked a lot of gold by then to help you improve your skills in acrobatics and glamours(I never took tarot) to help you bash. You should get up to contortion in acrobatics and illusory self in glamours if you want to bash, though, as they serve to make your hunting trips safer.

EDIT:

I've never tried playing a Cosmic Guardian, although I can tell you this much about Wiccan Guardians: you have to be tri-trans(guild skills) plus contemplate if you want to pull off a successful toadcurse, but the thing is, it's not an assurance that it's -you- who gets the kill. It's interesting to play guardians, I might play a cosmic guardian when Gaudifax releases theirs or maybe I'll alt!

Huh. Really? I always thought Wrack was a lot easier to pull off than Sacrifice, but I was working as a pre-speed nerf mugwump here, so I might be blinkered.

I would have to agree with monk for a good, cheap choice. If you have enough to trans your Kata specialisation, you can do very well with minimal investment in your other guild skills. I usually advise Tahtetso novices to aim for avoid in acrobatics (gifted) and regeneration in harmony (adept). Or, if they have enough lessons, harmony up to krakphet (gifted + 50%).

Choosing a monk also allows plenty of leeway when choosing a race for roleplay purposes.

The best advice I can give is to buy your credits when a sale is on. If that +20% deal is still happening, buy now!

There's just no way to get anyone decent under 50% mana and entangled while also actually having 5p to use the skill.

Well, your demon can handle entangling while you quickening-amissio-amissio-amissio... or, isn't there a better mana drain in necromancy? Might work in a group situation, but not if you're getting wailed on or against a demi with high int.

As far as I understand, sipping outpaces quickened amissio.

You can only get four amissios in one quicken, which isn't nearly enough to drain anyone's mana below half considering they're entirely free to sip/sparkle/scroll/regen it.

This sounds like a job for a Guild Envoy.

Neither guardian guild really needs buffs, though, so I think Wrack and Absolve are just doomed to wallow in uselessness. Maybe one of the upcoming guardian guilds will feature a viable manakill.