Greetings

I've been having problems keeping people out of my manse. These are my perms currently.

People who meet the following conditions may enter your fulcrux:
is not an enemy of the Grand Province of Magnagora
OR
is not a member of the Free Alliance of Glomdoring
OR
is not a member of the Commonwealth of Hallifax
OR
is not a member of the Commonwealth of New Celest

Tynghall says I should use EXCEPT to keep people out, not NOT.

Any help would be appriciated.

I could be completely off, I just looked at HELP PERMISSIONS.

He's got it right. Everyone can get into your manse, because, for instance, everyone is either "not a member of the Commonwealth of Hallifax" or "not a member of the Commonwealth of New Celest" (since no one can be in both cities!). Where it's saying OR in between those lines, it means exactly that, OR. You can get in if you meet any one of those lines.

The main problem that makes this a little tricky is you haven't said anything about who you do want in, only who you don't. To make this work, you want one thing that says "these people can come in," and then a bunch of EXCEPT lines which subtract. Here's one way to get it done the way you want:



This is saying "any non-enemy-of-Mag can come in, as long as they're not Gloms, Hallifaxians, or Celestians too". To achieve this:



That'll be $1.99. I'll send you my bill.

I hate setting up permissions. They make me feel like Cletus the Slack-Jawed Yokel.

from what I have seen, you you use

Is not a member of Celest
Is not a member of Magnagora
Is not an enemy of magnagora

Basically, what this is saying/doing is, anyone who is not a member of celest can enter the manse, then you add magnagora in there so that magnagora can enter as well. The reason I use these is to allow rogues into my shop and also no enemies. The problem with this then you could say

Is Arimisia

If I am an enemy, this bypasses the is not an enemy, it is a loophole to allow enemies in. However, if you use except enemy of magnagora - there is no loophole, except means NO exceptions what so ever. So you can leave your permissions with not a member of celest and mag but it seems like you do not want to allow all that many people in, so if you do not care about rogues then just use

Is a member of Magnagora
Is a member of Serenwilde
Is a member of Gaudiguch
Except enemy of Magnagora

So, saying I wish to allow one Gloom, and no other Glooms, how would I go about that?

He means he wants to allow me. Someone help him with this!

That one's easy.

MANSE SET FULCRUX PERMS PECTUS

unless he has an except member of glomdoring perm, then we will need to see all his perms to determine if it is possible.

There's no way to have an exception to the EXCEPT clause.

If you only wanted "everyone except Glomdorians except Pectus" you could get pretty close with:
Is a member of New Celest
OR
Is a member of Magnagora
OR
Is a member of Serenwilde
OR
Is a member of Hallifax
OR
Is a member of Gaudiguch
OR
Is Pectus

but that wouldn't allow rogues, so it's still not precisely right.

@_@ We need parentheses. So we can go
Pectus or (not enemy of Magnagora and not citizen of Glom and not citizen of Celest and not citizen of Hallifax)
which is equal to
Pectus or not(enemy of Magnagora or citizen of Glom or citizen of Celest or citizen of Hallifax)

Or make it more in list form. I.e.

ACCEPT Pectus
DENY Member of Glomdoring
DENY Member of Serenwilde
DENY Member of Celest
DENY Enemy of Magnagora
ACCEPT Member of Magnagora
DENY ALL

That way, when Pectus tries to enter, it sees she's accepted, and voila. Members of Glom, Seren and Celest are banned (but still not Pectus, since she was accepted beforehand). Enemies of Magnagora are denied, even if they happen to be members of Magnagora (if that's even possible). After that, all members of Magnagora is accepted. Everyone not mentioned before would be denied.

Actually closest is:

- not a member of glomdoring
- is pectus
- except enemy of magnagora etc

But this only works if there is no other exception on an exception

-edit- actually reading the first post as well

Not member of glomdoring
except member of celest
except member of hallifax
except enemy of magnagora
is pectus

I feel there's a market for a little application (or client plug-in) that accepts user-defined parameters for manse permissions, all at once, then outputs the proper list of game commands to get the exact permissions settings you want.

An application with a user-friendly frontend that simply lets you check and uncheck various boxes (for orgs, guilds and etc.), as well as add or remove people to and from various pre-defined exception lists, generating the proper list of commands, would probably be ideal. Maybe I'll look into it. I just need to learn to program first!

Also, I'm kinda glad I don't run a commercial or intentionally public manse, and can simply maintain a list of people permitted to enter my manse, adding (and removing) names as necessary.

There is probably a better market for an expansion/overhaul of the permissions code, although I imagine this could be as big a project as releasing an org since permission code is embedded everywhere.

The biggest problem is likely that many combinations aren't (feasibly) possible at the moment. For instance, the issue with allowing Pectus above.

I don't think there's a format I could ask you to give a computer program your intended permissions in that was precise enough to figure them out, and flexible enough to account for everything you might want to do, that'd be any easier to work in than the actual language they're already in. The problem isn't in writing the statements, it's in figuring out how to express what you want in a computer-readable language. Inserting a second computer program in front of the first won't change that. Best you could do is make a "wizard" that could help you figure out certain common combinations, but it wouldn't be able to do others, and I don't think it'd really help that much. Particularly when I and several others are always willing to help figure them out for people on the forum here.

What's lacking, I believe, is prioritization. Unless I'm misunderstanding something (a condition I still suffer from frequently, I fear), a character must pass every single permissions criterion in order to enter the manse. Therefore, MANSE SET PERMS PECTUS will be ineffective if Pectus fails even one of the other permissions settings. Right?

If so, I think the system would work much better if PERSON overrode all other permission settings, so that if someone is listed on PERSON, they can enter the manse regardless of any other permissions.

Well, kinda. There's the ALLOWs (the first bit) and the DENYs (the "except"s). If it matches any line in the first bit, it checks the excepts. If it doesn't match any line there, they can enter.

Yeah. Adding exceptions to exceptions is really the best solution overall — although, as has been said, probably a pain in the rear to code.