Because of the headache-inducing nature of moderating an event-level wargames, this post is created to outline future wargames so that rules and progression are always clear to all future participants, moderator and contenders alike.

For wargames involving an even number of teams, it is fairly straightforward. Teams pair up and progress single elimination-style, determining the champions by those who never lose.

For wargames involving an odd number of teams (and, as well, for a wargames of six teams wherein three win and thus progress), the team bye and round-robin rules get applied.

As an example, for a wargames consisting of five teams, a preliminary round is used to determine the winner's and loser's brackets, with one team getting the bye towards the winner's bracket.



Winner's Bracket

A C E

A vs. B C vs. D E

B D

Loser's Bracket


The winner's bracket enters a round-robin competition while the loser's bracket duels, with the losing team of the loser's bracket altogether out of the competition.

Of the winner's bracket, the team who wins the most progresses to the finals.

To visualize this using the example above, assume team A won against both teams C and E during round robin. Team A is in the finals. In the loser's bracket, Teams B and D duel, with team B winning. This means that Team D is out.



Winner's Bracket

A

A C E

A vs. B C vs. D E

B D

B

Loser's Bracket


At this point, only one of the final slots is left to be determined between the last three Teams. Single elimination begins (as each team has won once and lost once), with the winner of the remaining three Teams rising to take the final slot. The two losers duel to determine 3rd place overall. With the final match up set, 2nd and 1st place overall can be determined.


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A glitch occurs, however, should a tie persist in the round-robin contest of the winner's bracket (in the example above, if teams A, C, and E have won and lost once against each other). Should this occur, the survivor of the loser's bracket gets a bye, bringing all four teams to one side and a tiered competition of even numbered teams can commence.

Oh, and concerns about the amount of time it would take to progress through this outline were mentioned, and my best recommendation is to do what we did earlier today: hold multiple wargames across the arenas of the cities and communes. This will address clumping together in the Avenger only, though wargames camping is something that can only be addressed, I believe, by some suggestion that combat must be initiated or something within 30 seconds of the Wargames starting.

This would certainly give the prep classes a few seconds to get ready, but hopefully dissuade team A camping in their meld on the opposite side of the arena from team B's own springtrap chain into pits.

Hm. That makes me think we should simply say one team per city can compete in the final challenge, and it's up to the cities to pick their Champion (who would be the only person eligible for the Seal), who then picks his teammates.

Ensures there's an even number of teams in the final bracket (6), and addresses the time problem a fair bit. Really at that point, we'd be able to cut the War Trial down to one day.

Also, it'd let the cities pick them however they wish.

After the event, I also wanted to sit down and think of a pre-defined way to handle this. I think Viynain is close with his proposal, but I've found a few flaws in addition to the tie he mentioned, and generally it seems unnecessarily complicated. I'll explain why, if someone is curious, but for now I'll just give my own take on how it should be run.

Each round, opponents pair off. If there is an uneven amount of teams, one team will randomly be selected for a bye. A team cannot be eligible for more than one bye in the tournament; the bye team should fight in the first match of the subsequent round. Teams are paired off until there is a definitive winner or there are three teams standing. Here are some examples of the number of teams in the tournament, and how the matches would play out:

4: 2v2 -> 1v1 -> winner
5: 2v2, one bye ->3
6: 3v3->3
7: 3v3, one bye -> 2v2 -> 1v1 -> winner

Any number of teams, greater than three, entering the tournament will eventually funnel down to these four finite scenarios at the end. In the two definitive winner scenarios, first and second are determined by the 1v1 match; third is determined by a match between the two losers of 2v2.

The two scenarios where three teams are left would go like this.

5 Teams Left
1) AvB, CvD, E: two teams win, E byes
2) EvA
- If E wins, then next match is EvC (3a)
- If E loses, then next match is AvC (3b)
3a) EvC
- If E wins, E is tournament winner and CvA determines runner ups
- If C wins, CvA determines tournament winner and second place; third place will be a match between E and the winner of BvD
3b) AvC
- If A wins, A is tournament winner and CvE determines runner ups
- If C wins, C is tournament winner and A is second; third place will be a match between E and the winner of BvD


6 Teams Left
1) AvB, CvD, EvF: three teams win (ACE), three lose (BDF)
2) AvC: one team wins (A/C) and then plays E
3) A/CvE:
- If A/C wins, then winner is tournament winner; E plays loser from 2) for second and third place
- If E wins, then E is tournament winner, A is second, C is third


The "flaw" with the "6 Teams Left" scenario is that one team gets a bye in a deciding round. However, if you consider the possible outcome where the bye team wins, A beats C, E beats A, then E would have virtually beaten C. I think I had a better way to do this yesterday in my head, but when I went to write it down it just didn't pan out, and sleeping on it didn't help. So other suggestions are welcome! I don't like BvDvF to get a fourth team because those teams are eliminated and shouldn't have a chance to win (see heartburn over the past where the same match occurs twice, and especially when the outcome is overturned - see Morbo winning Justice seal).

As a random thought, what if we added a new tournament system for these types of events. It would be set up to run for x number of hours (IE 48 for the War Seal or something). Everyone who enters receives x amount of points.

Every time you enter a fight (duel, war games) the victor receives y% of the loser's points or z of the loser's points, whichever is higher. If you have 0 points left, you're removed from the tournament and you've lost completely. In tournament war games, only those in the rankings can compete.

When only one person remains in the rankings system or the time is up, whichever comes first, a winner is declared.

Would probably need to do things like set minimum level and put a heavy gold cost on joining.

Thoughts?

My biggest concern with it would be that people might try to 'farm' points (ie "Everyone in Celest sign up, and then duel Kelly repeatedly so she gets all our points so she can win!"), but we can track duel times and handle accusations of cheating appropriately. Similarly, such a tactic might yield some points, it does mean any actual fight she gets in she'll lose them very quickly, since she can't fight for beans. Or maybe you can't gain points from city mates unless certain conditions are met (only X number of people left, or the loser is above Y point threshold - where Y is maybe also the amount you start with).

Don't know, don't know. Hmmm! Just a random thought.

Yep, I would farm the poop out of those peasants. :D

But really, I don't see how this would work, because it would be entirely based on a voluntary system. Naturally you wouldn't fight in matches that you didn't think you would win, and if you are already at the top, you wouldn't want to risk your spot by playing a more fairly matched team. Maybe a bit cynical, but the honor system doesn't tend to run well.

Other ideas might be interesting, though. Maybe an event more like a domoth or something with a tangible goal. I'm on my way out the door, but I'll think about it some.

Byes are unfair if we assume evenly matched teams where the fights could have gone either way. I propose the following 100% fair, drawless, byeless system:

If the number of teams remaining is even, singly eliminate half the remaining teams. If the number of teams remaining is odd, singly eliminate half the remaining teams (rounded down) and then randomly select one team eliminated this round to fight the final team instead of being eliminated.

10 team example:

Round one:
A fights B and wins.
C fights D and wins.
E fights F and wins.
G fights H and wins.
I fights J and wins.

Round 2:
A fights C and wins.
E fights G and wins.
C is randomly selected to fight I and wins.

Round 3:
A fights E and wins.
E fights C and wins.

Round 4
A fights E and wins. A is given the War Seal.

Yeah, but that's got the nasty random 'free pass' element.

It's no more random than giving someone a bye and it's much more fair.

Make the bye team one of the other successful teams. You still have to win against a team, that team just doesn't worry about losing. It's much more fair for everyone in the final rounds to have fought and beat an entering team. You don't get to pass by having less chances to fail than anyone else.

That is unfair against the odd man out. As a trivial example, if you have three teams, A, B and C and C ends up as the odd man out, then the probabilities of each team winning are:
A wins: + = 0.5^3 + 0.5^2 = 0.375 = 37.5%
B wins: + = 0.5^3 + 0.5^2 = 0.375 = 37.5%
C wins: + = 0.5^3 + 0.5^3 = 0.25 =25%