I don't normally go out of my way to kill people in Celest. Rafael and some others decided to raid Southgard yesterday, so I decided to return the favour and raid Celestia. My job in the guild revolves around fighting so it's pretty hard to avoid, and even more so when people try to jump me while I'm out doing stuff, not like I'm going to stand there and not defend myself.

This is not Valek this is Chade, Valek doesn't use forums so I post for Valek, Mag had a big meeting about not flogging Celest but looking for an IC way to calm down the fighting, occasionally Celest just pisses us off so we go raid.

We actually don't raid or kill anywhere near as often as we did in the earlier days when it was more equal, now it just takes longer to uproot us or for us to get bored, as we don't get chased out often. It'd be nice to have an RP event which gives us a forth force, one which everyone must combine against to save Lusternia, like having to raise a Vernal god.

Chade

There will be a 4th force to this conflict, its going to be one of the said cities, but back on topic...

simple, they dont ppiss us off, we wont turn them into mush.

In other words, at least make yourself stronger beforetrying to annoy us?

I think a nice easy solution here would be beefing up city defenses, really. As it is, we could stomp through guards, and from what I saw, they didn't hurt unless they outnumbered us, or all entered at once. Statues are nasty, but in other IRE games, totems just stopped a person so they'd die to guards, or, stopped several. Here, the guards seem to be weak enough that that never works on anyone who can cure.

Those who are saying the system is working fine are right. The problem isn't how Avenger works or how much people like to PK. It's that Magnagora and Celest are designed to conflict with eachother, and Celest hasn't been able to keep up its end since opening. I've heard it said that it's a case of the strong getting stronger and the weak, weaker. And it's true.

Listen to the people who are saying the cause is just the IC world at this early stage. There are three pieces on the board; one is powerful, one is weak, and one keeps largely to itself. Unfortunately, the only thing Magnagora has to focus on is Celest, thus they get 100% from us. This will change as soon as the other cities open up.

One, they will cannibalize Magnagora of citizens who just don't have a place they see as better to go. Two, it won't just be Us and Celest any longer.

Aside from these new cities, a stand-alone quest or emergency directed at Magnagora would be as bad as changing the mechanics of Lusternia to help. The emergency would eventually be overcome, and then we'd be back where we began.

I love the RP here, and I love the conflict built into the system. They are both major wins for the realm. Personally, I'm not here for the fighting, and I would be starting from scratch if I ever changed my mind on that. My only experience with PvP here is that it's entirely avoidable unless you seek it out in some fashion.

I feel i should comment that during my last post I was suffering from a hangover brought about by the worst alcoholic substance in the world, even worse than meths, Baiju.

This has now largely disappated leaving a much happier Chade.

Celest is a "Mag Stomping Ground" as someone put it, for now, it sucks, we lack a challenge, we sit on Celestia until we get bored and decide to just go home, we raid Celest, and leave after 4-5 group situations because by that point enough Magnagoran's are venom locked through statues that we have to go take a breather, and cure the ones who don't have all the cures.

I want Celest/Mag conflict to die down, I swear I'm heading to an early grave with the stress of trying to run a city which is supposedly the best in the realm, deal with all my "spies" say yes you can join, no you can't join, give reasons, constantly explain myself, deal with all the internal political crisis and deal with the external situations with Celest/Mag, Seren/Mag and Celest/Seren.

Serenwilde has a massive internal power struggle, Celest just got over one, leadership is being questioned and Mag is just taking advantage of the situation like any Conquest/Despotic state would do.

Did someone say political turmoil in Celest? Right then, who do I pay to join the election, who do I buy voters for, can I make it worse, can I make it better, can I get us more grain, more cloth, more steel from this, can I make us richer, do I have a spy placed in the GCA or do I have to get another one?

I play mainly for the politics, how can I make the opposition weak by exploting a situation, making it easier for us to dominate them?

I've never been a PKer before, I'm learning quickly, I enjoy it, and I take part in Valek's fun little combat events, gives Celest a bit of hope seeing Rafael beat me up twice in a fair duel, I learn and I only die a little bit.

At the moment though, divine intervention would probably cause problems later rather than now, "nerf" Magnagora now, let Celest level up, don't remove said "nerf" Celest beats Mag, roles reverse, "nerf" Celest or "unnerf" Mag, still got a situation which swings one way or another. The problem is I'm not intelligent enough to see a way out of the situation, I'm not a big PvP player but from an IC stand point, Celest anti-Taint, Magnagora Tainted, as Gol would put it, from an IC stand point Magnagora must "smush" all who oppose it.

Someone more intelligent than I, which isn't difficult, want to help me out here? Keep PvP interesting, while increasing Celest to pose more of a challenge, without stepping in and downgrading one massively or upgrading the other, because this question is driving me mad and I can't see a way out of it.

Ok, done rambling again.

Chade

I'd think best bet would be a Celest surrender. Their 'raids' only give Magnagora a true reason to attack. Again. And destroy. Again.

Who was the idiot who said 'Hey, let's go raid Southgard!'

Let me rephrase that. I believe that all cities need their guards to be more powerful and the angelic and demonic beings should be more powerful as well. it would help celest and not hinder magnagora in any such action

The problem with surrendering is there would be no reason for Magnagora to stop except out of the kindness of their heart, and since that doesn't exist, surrendering would be pointless. There is nothing New Celest can offer but to submit our lives to the Taint, because that is all we have left to give.

This problem also reminds me of Antioch and Stavenn under Jagara's reign. Stavenn never let up on Antioch, therefore Antiochan pride never let them pass up a chance to somehow return the pain. Eventually, the main way it was slowed down was better defenses for Antioch, even though most Stavennites will tell you they felt like the Gods were rooting against them.

Another note on the Avenger system, I do no think I have particularly supported it besides for newbies; the times people have had vengeance on me has been in defense of a village/city, or during battles in uninfluenced villages. It is frankly akin to punishment for me trying to step up and make some difference. However, I don't mean any disrespect if group combat and such is being worked on for the Avenger system, it's simply an idea with too many loopholes that standardize killing, instead of personalizing it.

Well, Celest's surrender would be provisional to tribute, I imagine.

I can tell you this, Celest will never Surrunder! never give up. Never Surrunder!!!

The Serenwilde/Magnagora thing is by far, the most idiotic thing I could ever imagine.


Serenwilde, Forest, Great Guardian Spirits.

Magnagora, City, Tainted.


Taint = Corrupts the land, destroys life, and twists Great Spirits.
Originates from Soulless Ones. Ellindel cured taint from Fae.


Why in any sort of semblance of thought, would Serenwilde work -with- Magnagora?

Don't hurt us, Magnagora, we promise not to be naughty, just don't hurt us.


Hmph.


Celest, by the way, killed more than 3 fae. I think, personally, it's not even that. It's that some people want to be friends with their friends in Magnagora, and so they'll do anything to do it.


My two cents, anyway.


As for the Celest/Magnagora consistant PK problems

Guards being overall increased in damage -might- help, but that just says 'If you leave the city, you're freegame'

The Avenger system has it's benefits, but also downfalls. It's not a security blanket. Plain and simple, people need to be reigned in. Though if Celest raided Southguard, I am by far astouded. (Why in the bloody blazes would you kill dwarves that you were protecting last week?)

Ohwell, rambling a bit here.

The actual solution isn't going to be a matter of black and white, it'll take thoughtful consideration, and something a lot of PK-savy people need to realize is that if they don't stop being bullies, that it'll hurt everyone, all around.

I agree that increasing the guards ability to fight is only part of the solution, however it could also help more then you think. Chade has said once already that him and his group when they raid celestia they sit there at the pool and wait for hours until finally growing bored and returning home. If guards had the ability to fight better then things like that wouldn't happen. taint<---- :cm:------>light

Correction, it could happen but we would be able to put up a better defense with guards. theres the difference. when your on the defensive you have guards and celestia angelic beings to help aide you but at this weaken state, is even if they do aide you they do little to nothing to help o.o

I think you've gotten the taint and the light smileys very confused there, Shiro. But, with guards, it might stop things like that. Celestia was like Val's private bashing ground for days, seriously, and I've seen Valek and Daevos (I think, there might have been more) literally just sit at the pool sucking up guard attacks, it was ridiculous.

Well with regards to guards, the biggest thing is that Lusternia has beefed up stats.. There's a lot of races with 15+ con, and with abilities it's easy to hit 16, 17, 18 for a lot of people. So damage is on a whole seperate scale than other games.. But guard attacks seem to still be on the Achaean scale, so they simply don't do a thing.

Now see, I don't understand this. Celest says their sick of fighting, or most of the citizens anyhow, but still Celest citizens go out and kill Magnagoran novices for being around Celest, when they are not even enemied to Celest.

What the hell does that have to do with anything? Someone call the ambulance!

You have people like Brona and others who decided to summon people out of celest and kill them. so both sides have problems

Well, lately I've hardly been playing Lusternia because I seem to be on the 'Kill whenever you see her in the game' list for all Magnagorans... what, did you guys hold a meeting about killing me at all times possible? ;p

The other day I logged in and two minutes later a Magnagoran tries to summon me...

And a few days before, I log in and I hardly have any time to think and Rexali is on top of me.

Personally I don't like a game where NOWHERE is safe, except for a couple of rooms. It makes me not want to log in or do anything...

I even stopped defending, and stopped going on raids (all of which I did for RP purposes, but now I realized that none of it is even RP involved so why should I go die?) but Magnagorans still like to kill me... I think it is just because I am extremely easy to kill? Or do you all just hate me that much?

But, I'm not going to give up, because I know it will get better. I've never been a PvP type person, and I'm not going to go on any raids or do any defending (except maybe to defend Celest itself) anymore, because Celest just dies endlessly. What we have to do is just not fight, stay in our city and try to gain some levels.

I am seriously disappointed in all of the people who were Celestian that go to be Magnagoran... the fact that that happens so often doesn't speak well of the game.