Heh... this cracked me up actually. Its just odd when the Ur'guard have a better sense of personal honor than the Paladins. I thought Thorgal's in keeping his charges in line were right, then snickered when I guessed the reasoning for his GDF verbatim. Rafael tackled Silimaur out because the duel didn't have his permission, Silimaur regained any lost honor and gained status with those Ur'guard that watched for coming back. He has their respect now for holding his honor higher than his life. Knowing he was going to die and still coming face to face with the situation he gained more than I think he realized.

yay! More complaining!

...

wait, this isn't the Idiots! forum. Get a life.

PS - Not talking about Davrick.

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Since apparently people can't catch on, this was the post I was referring to with my previous post.

I removed Silimaur from the room because he was going to do the duel under the impression that he -had- to. I stopped keeping him out of the room when he understood it was his choice, and decided to go on through with it on his own accord. Nothing to do with my permission.

Also, the Ur'Guard hold personal honour above other things foremost because they're all about personal gain, which is something you can likely see in honour. Personal respect gained from your peers, if you catch my drift. However, the Paladins serve something more, and while honour is important, making sure that higher objective is met is entirely more important than personal honour. You seen this when they half-hazardly went into the Faethorn realm and slew fae because they thought it would aide the Light, even if the act was none too bright.

Funny this is Rafael, thats like GR3 title as well. My GR1 title was 'piece of fodder' rather funny.

As far as i'm concenred those from the light oppose us in the worst possible manner, however I show honour not as a means as a person gain but its what I feel right. Being tanted doesn't mean you lose sense of what is right and wrong from an honour sense.

And you rafael show honour all the time in the anual duels, so saying that no-one should show honour to the tained (as much as you may hate the taint) is kind of hypocritical in my opinion, something that the light is infamous for in a lot of scenarios.

I just posted cause i wanted to show an event which I thought was in the spirit of honour.

Hmm, don't get me wrong. Honour is a good thing to uphold, but I'd get mighty pissed if I ever seen a Paladin throw aside a goal that would aide the Light in favour of honour.

I remember the days long ago when no Ur'guard even understood what honour meant. It's good to see them trying to embrace it atleast.

Stuff about honour aside - kudos to Rafael with sacrificing his life to bring back Silimaur. Looks good RPwise.

And about honour... I don't see why honour was automatically factored in to every Warrior class in Lusternia by all the players.
Yes, they have a skill-set called 'Knighthood', but even in its help file - it talks about combat prowess. Knighthood isn't Chivalry, and it doesn't have to be related to some of our historical ideals of the 'honourable knight'.
The archetype is Warrior, don't forget. Not Knight.

Always confused me with the Infernal Knights in Aetolia. Dark knights, oppress the weak, rip out the hearts of the fallen... But be respectful, dammit!

Oh, and does it bother anyone else the constant use of 'rez' and 'rezzing' in-game? Personally, I find it a real RP-crusher. But I'll take that and rant on a different thread.

What a keen observation.

The word 'Honour' is terribly overused (or better yet abused), mosty misplaced and misguided and is by far the #1 killer of young RPers who wish to cultivate a character with "character". I have rarely seen (not saying this is the case here, I dont know Murphy's or Silimaur's prowess) a duel request by someone who thought losing was even remotely possible. Also, its mostly a trait that is turned on and off when its suits personal goals best. not really honour that...

I second that notion. Second it most strongly.

This statement is false.

Begging to differ.
Seeking example when Ur'Guard have done something that gained them nothing, and gave much to another.

It seems that many just have a different opinion on what honour is

I doubt that the concept of honour is about altruistic deeds. You're probably mistaking with compassion or something alike.

I do agree though, if you meant that honour is a code chosen by a group of individual that have agreed upon an arbitrary way for solving their problems, sometime independently of logic itself.

But again, you , guys have to agree on a consensus and before trying to force it upon each other.

The ur'guard are based on an idea of an army. Many in the ur'guard give their lives for the raid and don't look for personal gain from the experience.
I know I play daganev that way, and have seen others in the guild do the same thing. Infact, I'm actually at a loss of the names of the many people who do that because they don't bring attention to themselves, and I'm not one for names.

Daganev often attacks people with no real thought that he will win, but merely because that person is ment to be attacked because they are the enemy and are doing stuff the leaders don't like.

At the same time, I don't call it honour.

I intentionally play a character who has never asked for nor expected anything in return for what he does for the city and guild. I've influenced for ages on end, died again and again with no complaint. Everything I have done, including gaining of levels and gathering personal gear, has been for the express purpose of serving the city. If you don't know who I am, that just proves my point...I don't yell or shout or demand attention, I don't lead the parties per se or come up with grand strategy. But if you ask the people who influence a lot, and lead war parties, I always follow, do what needs to be done, and never complain.

Now, I'm not saying we're universally altruistic, but failure of such altruism does not imply total selfishness.

There. You have your example. Want to point out a time I have asked or expected anything for my personal service to my city or guild? Yeah, I didn't think so.

Ahh yes the duel request. I see it happen people ask for a duel when they think they can win. It many cases this happens but in this case it wasn't the case. (too many cases?)

At the time of challenging, I wasn't sure i was going to win All i knew of silimaur was his combat ranking (a fair few higher than mine) I've probably run into him at times, but i wasn't too sure. Personally if someone does something becoming of a duel challenge, I'll lay it down (and on that point I'll also accept any challenge, especially from a warrior) regardless of the combat prowess. For instance I'd accept a challenge from valek knowing full well that he has over double my health and I'd have miniscule chance of beating him, in cases like this just putting up a good show would be enough for me.

In Valek's annual duels I always offer a duel with Saraxus or Rafael, or whoever wants to (In my experience they are in the top couple of paladins in terms of combat ability) Knowing full well that I may (and often do) Lose. You get better from losing (but I swear if Saraxus shieldstuns me over and over again I'm going to insert shield A into orriface B.)

In terms of prowess I know im getting better but I am no means the combatant all knowledgable, or even close. Especially up against someone of say Valek or Rafael's combat experience (in other muds at least)


I hate seeing honour turned off and on, personally I value RP over XP, and I'll try to be honourable wherever possible. To me, honour is not only fighting with dignity and 'fighting fair' which i opposed to fighting dirty.... but being able to acknowledge when you're wrong and apologise (as i did with narsrim when i accused him of being cheap when it was my own stupid fault, he got a public apology)

IC and OOC nothing pleases me more than to see acts of honour and respect, Silimaur accepting my duel was one of those things that earns shitloads of respect.

Amaru on the other hand snubbed me, called me dishonourable (yeah i helped imadis against him, Ill always help a citymate out, and accept any consequences for it including duels) and when I offered him a duel to settle our differences(not a challenge, but an offer) it was ignored, but I accept that most angelmongers aren't too honourable (how could you be when one of your mains attackes is entanglement?) so I left it at that. Maybe its wrong of me but I expect more honour out of knights than guardians? Just my opinion.

Okay, wait, stop right there. This is exactly what I, uh, thought I talked about here, but in fact talked about in a different topic entirely. Who the heck says it's honourable to gut someone with a sword, smash them in the head with a shield, or cripple their legs, but not to use cosmic matter to web someone up? The whole point of both is to stop people being able to hit you. That thing just there is the arbitrary part of honour that annoys the heck out of me. It's all very well having a code of laws, but to call it honour and someone else dishonourable for following THEIR code of laws instead of yours is just really lame.

Apologies if you were being sarky and I just got narked for no reason.

doublepost

Rexali doesn't care about knights and their 'honor'.

His code of honor is whatever gets him ahead .