Okay, so I have absolutely no chance of understanding anything you guys throw at me with dimensional physics involved, but I've always been fascinated in planar travelly type things. Thing is, unlike with D&D, there doesn't seem to be any set definition for the nature of the Lusternian planes.

The main thing I'm wondering is, are they coterminous or coexistent? That is to say, are they actually like seperate lil' worlds which just touch ends and you can walk through the gates like doors to the next room, or do they all exist in the same place but on different dimensions, and the gates actually put you in a different dimension? There seems to be evidence both ways - if they were coexistent, that would explain the exact same timezones, and the way you can see Father Sun and stuff from the Water plane, say, but if they were coterminous, it'd explain why the sceneries are different - that is to say, the Earth isn't just a rocky equivalent of the Prime. Anyone got any theories either way? I rather prefer the coexistent idea, myself, since it makes them seem REALLY planar, and not just like an extra continent, but there you go.

...What? No... What?

Hmm, well, I'd think that they are coexistent, and certain things exist on more than one plane, linking them together, like the Pool of Stars or Megalith of Doom. It would seem to make sense.

My other impression is that they're all like planets or something in proximity. The diagram on the site just gives me that image.

Yeah, another thing is though, the coexistent thing doesn't really work with the "layers" thing. Then again, having Water, Earth, Air and Fire surround the entirety of the Ethereal and Prime planes seems a bit iffy too.

I think they would be coexistant also. They layer thing has to be split up a bit in order to get it to work out, a bit. If Prime is the 'core' plane, at the center, then the Ethereal lies atop and around that one. Being that close, it mirrors it fairly closely. The Serenwilde and Glomdoring, and the Ackleberry also, all have analoges there. Up to the elemental planes, you go outwards another layer, but this one is split up into four (or so...) planes, that don't touch each other, but DO have analogs on the Prime; namely the four nexuses in Magnagora, Celest, Hallifax, and Gaudiguch. As you move up, the similarity between the planes fades: since Elemental is two removed from prime, it only bears slight resemblence. Cosmic is the same, with at least four seperate, non-touching demi-planes, with even less resemblence to the Prime. Finally, the Astral is the outer sphere (that we can reach) and is divided into moving demi-planes within the overall structure of the Astral plane. But its all one big interconnected ball. Thats what I think, anyhow.

Well.. Here's how I view it.

The Planes are both individual entities and coexistent. There's some traits which suggest they are coexistent:

-When a city is linked to an Elemental Plane, its nexus appears there.

-When something on Prime is Tainted or changed, it's reflected in the Planes it's connected to.

-The gateways you go through to get to other Planes are dimensional rifts, implying that the Planes are different dimensions in the same world/universe.

And some that suggest individual entities:

-Each Plane is drastically different, and the Prime Material Plane is basically where all of the Planes collide and mix together. You don't see much in the way of clouds on the Earth Plane, as it's catacombs, and nothing even remotely resembling fire on the Water Plane. They exist as an extreme of a concept or element, and they all blend together on Prime.

-You can't travel directly from one Elemental or Cosmic Plane to another, due to the fact that the energies in those Planes conflict too much to allow a stable gateway.

-You have to travel through 'layers' of Planes. There's the Prime layer, the Ethereal layer, the Elemental layer, the Cosmic layer, and the Astral layer. They aren't all mixed together into one layer.

So though I'm leaning toward the individual option, I'd have to say it's a blend of both.

I'm pretty sure someone, I think it was Hiriako, said you COULD actually go between planes like Celestia and Nil. With the planarsight ability. It is actually a single layer, to an extent, and I think you can gateweave between, say, Water and Nil, too.

And how do those thar Aetherways fit in with all this?

The aetherways are the 'spaces' between planes. A manse is a house or other structure/anything that is located in a 'bubble' between planes.

Yeah, I got that, it just confuses the "coexistent" side of the thing a bit more, since surely if they're adjacent, you couldn't have something that exists next to EVERY plane if it was coexistent, whereas it works better if they're coterminous...I think? Since it would put the Aetherways as like...a vast space...with the "bubbles" of the other planes within it. It just doesn't seem to work as well that way if it's coexistent.

I think it has something to do with all the dimensions. Like, if each planar level was a piece of paper, and they're stacked on top of each other, many things between planes could match because they're next to each other, and there would be things like the nexi that would be like thumbtacks holding it all together. There is some space between the planes, but the majority of the space is taken up by the planes themselves. However, if you want to make space between the planes, it can be done because you could push between the planes to make more space. So, really the planes exist in a three-dimensional world of their own, while within each plane lies another three dimensions. To follow with this, you can see how the elemental planes for instance would all be on the large ethereal plane, but they would be little pieces of paper that wouldn't touch each other because they are so far away. That's also why planar travel is instant while it takes a long time to travel in a plane. So, that's how I think it.

From a strictly geometrical stance, it works just fine provided you have enough dimensions in the space. If you limit yourself to three-dimensional "plane" objects in a three-dimensional "space", it doesn't work, but there's no reason to limit yourself thus.

Edit: Archthron and I are going in the same direction here, it seems. I have to remember to refresh the thread before replying in case someone's replied since I opened it up.

An easy way to think of it - each plane is a billiard ball. Some touch each other, others don't. Everything between them is an aetherway.

That's not exactly how it works, but it's a good way to picture it.

Well, I guess you could support the coterminous theory...but...that wouldn't explain why it's day in the same time in every plane at once, or why certain points exist on multiple planes, like the Pool. Unless aforementioned billiard balls have random spikes on them.