I don't know how much more of this thread I have to read.. but I have to say something to this.
The game has been going for what? Two months? How long do you want it to continue? Three months?
I know a lot of people wanted to quit playing before, but now they're not, or they're not yet.
The gods don't just need to balance the "Good Vs. Evil" or the skills. They also have to balance things to make sure people still want to play.

Since none of us know what the Quest to raise White Hart is, we have no proof it is able to be performed in Serenwilde. For all we know, it could involve Glomdoring for the entire thing expect for performing the ritual, rite, whatever.

Dumihru-
I have no idea. I think at one point I accidentally had myself empressed, which would of course remove me from the area.

And in terms of stealing the colts from in the city. If you actually gathered a huge force, all you needed is for -one- person to get in, give the colt the grass and snort a spore out. Sure, people would die, but it was definitely possible.

There's no way to win, and I feel badly for the Divine, because I can't even imagine how hard it is to try and do things when people are accusing you of being unfair. I'm pretty sure that things aren't being changed to favor the weaker organizations.

And also Elryn, I don't think anyone is pissed off because we've worked so hard and feel like no one else has. I don't think any of us are THAT arrogant or naive to believe that we're the only ones working. Telling us to get over ourselves is, in my opinion, a little silly, considering the people I've talked to or some things I've seen that say that Serenwilde deserves any changes making it harder for Magnagora because they're in such a rotten position right now, and that it's only "fair". I've also seen other people complain about changes. Honestly, I think people are just unable to look at issues objectively. There are a few who can, don't get me wrong, and I don't blame anyone for thinking that way.

I know exactly how White Hart is raised. I've studied all their relevant quests.

Acknor was 'wild' for what? 30 minutes? Wow, real hard work there.

So you are complaining that we influenced well, with no competition, and crusading on everything. You are also forgetting the hours and hours of tediousness that was the influencing season after the first change to the system. We won almost every village there but Dairuchi, which we gave to Serenwilde.

Yeah, 30 minutes, with -no- contest. Contest it next time! Heh.

Who said I was complaining? No one wanted Acknor. I'm just saying, you REALLY broke your back out there getting that one.

Plus, you're not the only ones who go through hours of tediousness, but since you have Laewhatever, you'll likely always win.

Oh no Jalain, we have a Laetitia equivalent. It's called Light... and it regenerates 50 ego every 9 seconds. Yep. Takes three people with high Moon to do it too.

Edit: My bad, not high moon, but you need the specialization and then two abilities prior to it.

And that is what BROMIDES, and BEAUTY enchantments are for.

After that one huge pile of villages revolting, I took on Acknor almost by myself - about half of the time I had someone to chant for me. The other half of the time, it was my own work at influence, sip bromides, MOVING if I got too low on ego, regaining it, and moving in again. At that time, to boot, I was only cr3, so, I only had ONE City influence skill.

We all work hard for what we earn - don't try and pass off that hard work as just 'chanting Laetitia'.

Ok, finally finished reading the eleven-page megathread. I feel like I'm on the Something Awful forums. *temples*

Have to agree with Magnagora on this one. About the most infuriating thing the Divine can do in any situation like this is to blatently change the rules -right in the middle of the conflict-. I mean, what is the point of even trying to understand how things work when it's just as likely that some entirely new element will enter the game without warning?

Imagine if you will that you are playing chess. You have the upper hand by far, you've narrowed your opponents holdings down to little more than his king, queen, a few pawns, and maybe a rook or two. You move your knight into a check position, knowing that the only move available for your opponent is to take your knight with their queen, opening her up to an attack from your bishop that should seal the deal for you. But just after you make your move, the door opens behind you and out steps God.

"God? Well, it's an honour. How may we be of service?"

"Oh, well I was just stopping by to comment on your superior play style!"

"Thank You, Lord! I am glad you can appreciate it."

"Oh, and while I'm here, I'm introducing a new rule to the game! Any time a queen takes a piece, that player gets a consecutive turn!"

"..."

"Have fun!"

"Go to Nil."

"Playing too much Lusternia I see."

And off He disappears in a poof of logic.

The absurdity is all too readily apparent when boiled down to its base elements, but all the refutation I've heard so far has just been trying to justify some unseen injustice that, quite honestly, doesn't exist in this situation.

You could same the same both ways, Rhysus. The rules were changed midway, to allow Magnagora to even steal colts. Then they were changed once more to balance the prior change. Now things are neck and neck. Magnagora has the New Moon coming, and it is the last one they need. If we manage to make them fail, then a Full Moon will be next, which is all we need.

The rules weren't changed midway. The rules were -created- in the beginning. The whole colts thing just popped up out of nowhere to facilitate an RP event. The whole thing got blown way out of proportion by the Divine and everyone got thrown into this huge mess that really no one wanted to get this far. But things should stay as they are in the initial implementation, provided there is no glaring default, which I don't think there was. Even still, if there -was- a glaring default, this wasn't the way to go about correcting it.

I almost never have laetitia chanters in village influence. I don't need them. Ever.

Minor sidenote, we need two more New Moons. So all and all, it takes 112 hours at the very least, to finish it all.

Veonira, just to clarify... it was to these sentiments I was responding:


Edit: I just noticed this Daganev, but I'm afraid not every complaint from a Serenwilder has used that reasoning. In fact, only a few have done so.


Again, I would point out that I personally don't understand why Magnagora should have an equal footing in pro-Crow quests, when it is only our commune, not anything to do with Magnagora, that is affected. (Well, unless Celest also gets some advantage in the whole crow scenario.) Furthermore, I have held very strong reservations about Magnagora being able to steal colts, who are part of the Serenwilde ecology. Can we steal any of your useful city creatures, just for fun? Maybe we should be able to take the creatures that help taint the sea of despair and guard them in Moon lake?

If your use for Crow arising is tangential to the harm done to Serenwilde, then why not work with the quest the way it was originally set in motion?

You very well could do that you know, if you if you showed some initiative and planned it out to where doing so had a point and the gods felt it should be allowed?

I once knew the entire process of raising the White Hart; it was leaked to the DoC and posted on our boards. I forgot to take it with me when the clan disbanded, sadly, but I remember that all of it takes place in the Serenwilde, or at the very least, the majority of it.

Good GOD this thread is HUGE.

Since the only thing that could really solve the questions, accusations and complaining that abound on this thread would be the words of a divine, and that doesn't seem to be rather forthcoming, I would have to say that they have enough necessary information to be garnered from ELEVEN FREAKING PAGES that they would be able to make any necessary changes that they deemed a necessity.

A Ghostly Centaur warrior shouts, "Siiiiiiiiimbaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa"

A centaur colt sings, "Hakuna Matata!"

guys you dont need to tell them you know how its done... you guys should already know most of the people here dont know what they're talking about...

side note : crow quest... magnagora was set to raise during chades reign even before visaeris but we didnt follow through because one chade wanted to keep good relations with serenwilde, two we kinda realized theres no way we could follow through (that was visaeris' mistake). There was an event then when serenwilde asked for mag help... maybe you guys can remember that one... I even remember people trying to talk to Rowena that day heh funny stuff .

Serenwilde : "Rowena... tell us what you know!!!"
Rowena : "alger they're bothering me..."
Alger : huh? *shoo!*


----

to zhaine -
dude thats a sex scene!