....my point is, you have 14 seconds to see it happening, and get yourself to a place where you aren't trapped.

What stops you from simply following them, rubbing till you get 7, trapping them, then flinging?

Wether you have 14 seconds (a lot less with quickening) or not to see it coming doesn't matter, the rubs are there, and they won't go away with running, like I said, soulless is at least as effective and easy to pull off as chasm. If you think chasm is overpowered, soulless is as well, cause it's the same .

You can put it any way you like. Here's a good comparison...

Soulless : Achaea's Death Tarot.
Chasm : Achaea's original jack-in-the-box.


Which one got downgraded for being too strong?

Both! What's your point?

Well that shows how long it is since I've cared about Achaea. I thought of a new argument. I use soulless, so it's not overpowered.

..

Well, the main reason that they downgraded Death Tarot because it was nearly impossible to escape within a spand of 6 seconds with the gremlin hitting at twice the speed it should be and Tower Tarot + Tentacles. But I don't see that kind of problem here with Celestines and Nihilists, but Angel being able to kneel/paralyse or Demon shackle/paralyse while you're throwing Soulless or Judging is a bit much, considering you also have Carcer on top of it all. Back to chasm, I think it should be more along the line of Judgement so it's still possible to stop it without you having to leave the room or forcing your target to do something.

Not to mention, of course, that the Celestine can web/trueheal/fling all at once with soulless, while the angel kneel/paralyses, the carcer sits there, the rubble from fall sits there..

What Amaru's saying is this: Anything that can kill him is overpowered. If a knight can kill him with venoms and damage, it's overpowered, if a mage can kill with chasm, it's overpowered. All hail Amaru the mighty =p

Flow's just annoyed she left the Celestines before I invented that technique, cause we all know she only cares about how strong the class is.

*nudge*

So true, Amaru. Flow's been in every organization in at least two IRE games now. Heh heh... *flees*

Damn right. Who joined the Shamans because they felt their character really fit in with the guild ideals?

Oh dear. Have I been "pwnt" now?

Amaru, you are freakin' amazing. In a bad way. In not one of your logs do you show yourself actually doing a move to try to counter chasm and failing and dying to it, you just spore out or in the log against me try to pick up a flamed monolith several times before you die. You probably don't actually know if it is or isn't stopped by what, you just enjoy complaining.

Nah I tried it in a FFA. Web and sleep. Neither worked, and Ravin won the FFA. It was a while ago, can't be bothered to dig up the log. And no shit I don't die to it, when it's common knowledge nothing stops it I'm not exactly gonna wait around doing futile web and hangedman so I can give you your log, am I?

Maybe it's been changed since then, if it's so long ago that you can't find the log? Complaining about how "nothing stops it" while posting logs of you not trying to stop it is completely retarded.

It was probably about 3 RL weeks ago, but I log every second of playing time, and don't title them unless something important happened. And it isn't like experience is the only way you can find out information about abilities, is it? You really need to think about what you're saying- and don't be so eager to label me 'retarded'.

Just snort your spores Amaru,its not like they can be countered. I havnt really fought geomancers, but can you just fly?

I nearly always try flying first. Sometimes it's impossible because of winds, other times because of inside locations or Carcer rituals, which also knocks me off balance and could result in me dying to chasm.

Ok i'd like to correct you on that Vesar. Ravin isn't killing everyone who enter his demesne. I let the majority of people through unharmed. Mostly serenwilders but i let a lot of celests through as well. As a rule i summoned and killed all aquamancers in delport who were trying to unmeld the demense (useing the fact i had status on them to see if they were unmelding, if there was doubt i kiled them anyway) and certain celests that I Wanted to kill. Mainly angel-mongers because of ethelons actions in the last village influencing with the summoning and also his summoning into statues before the delport went into plat. It was a bit of revenge on my part except i wasn't using a statue. Note to self - get a statue on a road next time and summon people into it. now -that- would be cheap and nasty. chasm when the statue hits they have trouble getting away. I did think about that but its a lot more interesting when people have the chance to kill me.

So ICly ravin was defending his demesne in delport from the aquamancers, and also seeking some revenge for ethelons acions, if anyone had bothered to ask me thats the answer they would've gotten.

And on a sidenote, Amaru, How bout you think before you post. I had triggers off when you came into the room for chasm, and didn't turn them back on till it was too late. I didn't cure Aeon either because i was messing with the trigger to heal it to recognise and cure sap as well.

if you look at the log youll notice how i hardly did anything, and when i turned my trigs back on my aeon healing died because i messed something up. Dont go around saying i cant heal you retard, who are you to judge whether or not someone can heal?

By the way, carcer and the rubble is almost as bad as stonewalls, at least with stonewalls you know straight away that you can't escape and then try to fly or something else. With carcer and rubble it takes a while to try and often youll get knocked back into the room, wasting time you wouldn't otherwise have. both have their pros and cons, but if you want chasm nerfed, then be prepared to have soulless get the nerf too. sure you need 7 rubs but after you fling it, you have your anghel hitting them for 2 afflictions. Judgement also has the angel in there stun-paralysing them. Do you hear me saying nerf the angel? hell no, i think celestines are one of the strongest classes in the game for PVP but i dont believe they are overpowered.

As I've said before, Sure nerf the chasm, but give me a beasty demesne in return that stuns, and you can nerf all you like. if your gonna nerf chasm nerf soulless too while you're at it, cause whether you like it or not, they are very similair and you can't except to have everyone else downgraded while you stay the same.

Its unrealistic and if you think that way you have no clue of balance.

EDIT: On a side note, Id like to say again that spores should be changed so that only forestal can use them, having people like amaru with them just furthers sways out the in-game balance that they provide.

I agree on your last edit, Ravin. Spores should be limited to Stag/Moon users alone. Magnagorans using them pissed me off, which is why I motioned for the law. Celestians shouldn't be using them either, hence why Amaru was fined 10k.