Aebrin2005-02-07 23:18:34
Anyways, I'm off to bed 
My parents are literally drawing their knifes to killing me if I don't go to bed 
I will bid all adieu and I will think I have a lot of reading to do tomorry.
My parents are literally drawing their knifes to killing me if I don't go to bed I will bid all adieu and I will think I have a lot of reading to do tomorry.
Rhysus2005-02-07 23:19:17
QUOTE(Alyvia Gladheon @ Feb 7 2005, 06:17 PM)
Dinosaur were big lizards, things, including people grew to be quite large in those days. The Bible itself says, "There were giants in those days."
Why was that? The layer of water above the earth filtered the UV rays. People could live longer, grow larger, so could EVERYTHING.
The neanderthal(sp?) man is nothing more than a man that was able to live the 900 or so years that people could live. Did you know that as you age, your brow becomes more defined? A 900 year old man would have quite the protruding brow ridge, wouldn't you think?
Dinosaurs were called dragons in the Bible, the term dinosaur is actually quite recent. They lived among people, they are a part of the art of early men. Their images have been painted on pottery and walls that have been found among bones of...wow, "modern man." Not, the missing link.
Why was that? The layer of water above the earth filtered the UV rays. People could live longer, grow larger, so could EVERYTHING.
The neanderthal(sp?) man is nothing more than a man that was able to live the 900 or so years that people could live. Did you know that as you age, your brow becomes more defined? A 900 year old man would have quite the protruding brow ridge, wouldn't you think?
Dinosaurs were called dragons in the Bible, the term dinosaur is actually quite recent. They lived among people, they are a part of the art of early men. Their images have been painted on pottery and walls that have been found among bones of...wow, "modern man." Not, the missing link.
44412
No dinosaurs have been painted on the pottery of any man. But please, keep talking, you're making my work easier.
Daganev2005-02-07 23:19:38
Heh, want me to blow all your minds away?
Who am I? Am I my body? Obviously not. Am I my thoughts? Maybe, but often I have thoughts that I did not think of thinking, and often I reject my thoughts as bad ideas. What rejected my thoughts? My soul? Maybe, but often I'm suppose to go do homework, which will satisfy my soul's need to grow, but -I- really don't want to. So my soul has an "evil inclantion" and a "good inclanation" my own little personal devil and angel on my shoulders. Am I two people in one body? Maybe, but it appears that this angel and devil are not arguing with eachother, but rather both arguing -at Me-. So who am -I-? I am apparently that diny Divine spark which exists inside all Humans. So Who am I? I am a part of G-d. But G-d is indivisible and has no parts, G-d is One, with all the ramifications of that....
I have based this little mock question and answer session on a lovely book called "The Secret Life of God" which deals with the meaning of Pananthism.
Who am I? Am I my body? Obviously not. Am I my thoughts? Maybe, but often I have thoughts that I did not think of thinking, and often I reject my thoughts as bad ideas. What rejected my thoughts? My soul? Maybe, but often I'm suppose to go do homework, which will satisfy my soul's need to grow, but -I- really don't want to. So my soul has an "evil inclantion" and a "good inclanation" my own little personal devil and angel on my shoulders. Am I two people in one body? Maybe, but it appears that this angel and devil are not arguing with eachother, but rather both arguing -at Me-. So who am -I-? I am apparently that diny Divine spark which exists inside all Humans. So Who am I? I am a part of G-d. But G-d is indivisible and has no parts, G-d is One, with all the ramifications of that....
I have based this little mock question and answer session on a lovely book called "The Secret Life of God" which deals with the meaning of Pananthism.
Shiri2005-02-07 23:22:17
Who am -I-, though? One of those chemical & electrical & so forth masses of...stuff. As far as I can tell, there's no real reason to believe a soul exists. (And I did watch Ghost in the Shell. ) That ain't gonna blow our minds away Daganev, we've all heard that one.
) That ain't gonna blow our minds away Daganev, we've all heard that one. Unknown2005-02-07 23:23:43
QUOTE(Alyvia Gladheon @ Feb 8 2005, 10:17 AM)
Dinosaur were big lizards, things, including people grew to be quite large in those days. The Bible itself says, "There were giants in those days."
Why was that? The layer of water above the earth filtered the UV rays. People could live longer, grow larger, so could EVERYTHING.
The neanderthal(sp?) man is nothing more than a man that was able to live the 900 or so years that people could live. Did you know that as you age, your brow becomes more defined? A 900 year old man would have quite the protruding brow ridge, wouldn't you think?
Dinosaurs were called dragons in the Bible, the term dinosaur is actually quite recent. They lived among people, they are a part of the art of early men. Their images have been painted on pottery and walls that have been found among bones of...wow, "modern man." Not, the missing link.
Why was that? The layer of water above the earth filtered the UV rays. People could live longer, grow larger, so could EVERYTHING.
The neanderthal(sp?) man is nothing more than a man that was able to live the 900 or so years that people could live. Did you know that as you age, your brow becomes more defined? A 900 year old man would have quite the protruding brow ridge, wouldn't you think?
Dinosaurs were called dragons in the Bible, the term dinosaur is actually quite recent. They lived among people, they are a part of the art of early men. Their images have been painted on pottery and walls that have been found among bones of...wow, "modern man." Not, the missing link.
44412
First time I've heard that before. Can you provide some evidence?
I know you think carbon dating is totally unreliable, but do you know how it works? That the carbon in question (i forget which specific type) has a very defined half-life meaning that over time we can test the age of a substance containing carbon by testing how much/man carbon molecules remain?
Science isn't perfect, but it's much better than a book.
Raan2005-02-07 23:23:44
QUOTE
No dinosaurs have been painted on the pottery of any man. But please, keep talking, you're making my work easier.
Once again you have to attack others to try and prove your point. If you want to prove something, prove it without attacks, then perhaps, you would hold more credibility in the eyes of those you are trying to convince. All you do now is make the entire thread resentful, and the topic loses all value because NO ONE wants to hear you contentious replies.
If you want to debate this, do it without stepping on others.
Unknown2005-02-07 23:24:20
As I said earlier...
Even IF the earth was only 6,000 or so years old.
Even IF humans were able to live to the age of 900.
Even IF dinosaurs and humans coexisted.
That would do nothing to support the theory of creationism. It would only serve to disprove evolution.
Even IF the earth was only 6,000 or so years old.
Even IF humans were able to live to the age of 900.
Even IF dinosaurs and humans coexisted.
That would do nothing to support the theory of creationism. It would only serve to disprove evolution.
Rhysus2005-02-07 23:25:55
QUOTE(raan @ Feb 7 2005, 06:23 PM)
Once again you have to attack others to try and prove your point. If you want to prove something, prove it without attacks, then perhaps, you would hold more credibility in the eyes of those you are trying to convince. All you do now is make the entire thread resentful, and the topic loses all value because NO ONE wants to hear you contentious replies.
If you want to debate this, do it without stepping on others.
If you want to debate this, do it without stepping on others.
44421
I'm not trying to attack others for the purpose of making an argument. I'm trying to attack others to weed out their tendencies to make stupid points, like this crap about dinosaurs in the bible. If it's getting you upset, it's working the way I intended it to.
Unknown2005-02-07 23:27:16
Perhaps not pottery, wall paintings. Things that evolutionists say were made by the missing link.
I'm trying to be respectful to you, you could at least show the same respect. I don't believe you are "ignorant" as you have said I am, I just believe you were taught different things than I was. Every person believes they are right, or there would be no reason to debate, but there is no reason to talk down to anyone as you have been doing with me every time you mention my name.
I'm trying to be respectful to you, you could at least show the same respect. I don't believe you are "ignorant" as you have said I am, I just believe you were taught different things than I was. Every person believes they are right, or there would be no reason to debate, but there is no reason to talk down to anyone as you have been doing with me every time you mention my name.
Daganev2005-02-07 23:28:50
Rhysus, I'm not sure who those people you quoted are. I do know that the debate between "creationism and Evolution" does not exactly exist on the college level. The debate exists in highschools, and what is being taught in a public school.
In Highschool, your basically just taught Darwinism as the basis and apparently true theory of Evolution, which not only doesn't make all that much sense, but also appears to actively teach against almost all religions ideas. (not just christian, it just so happens that most other religions get taught so much other crap in school also, that we are use to telling our children that they shouldn't believe everything they learn at public school)
With all my years of Listening to NPR, I still havn't heard any explanation that makes sense and is consitant with what I see in my world that explains how you go from multicellular organism to fish to land animal to bird. I've seen links and similarities, but links and similarities only tell me that they have the same basic design structure, and whatever made them was pure genious.
In Highschool, your basically just taught Darwinism as the basis and apparently true theory of Evolution, which not only doesn't make all that much sense, but also appears to actively teach against almost all religions ideas. (not just christian, it just so happens that most other religions get taught so much other crap in school also, that we are use to telling our children that they shouldn't believe everything they learn at public school)
With all my years of Listening to NPR, I still havn't heard any explanation that makes sense and is consitant with what I see in my world that explains how you go from multicellular organism to fish to land animal to bird. I've seen links and similarities, but links and similarities only tell me that they have the same basic design structure, and whatever made them was pure genious.
Unknown2005-02-07 23:29:00
Can they really tell that the wall paintings were dinosaurs and not just drawings of the reptiles that came after the dinosaurs? Basic lizards, that is.
Rhysus2005-02-07 23:30:51
No, that's exactly what I am saying. You were taught different things than I was. The fact that I taught myself the vast majority of what I base my arguments on isn't really relevant, but it stands to be noted. Regardless, I feel it anything but insulting to tell you that you are ignorant of certain facts when you are -ignorant of certain facts.- It's just the truth. If you don't -know- enough about something, you can't hope to refute it in a coherent fashion. It's become obvious that you were never taught enough to refute modern evolutionary theory in anything approaching a reasonable fashion. That isn't your fault, necessarily. Just the path your life has taken.
Rhysus2005-02-07 23:33:05
QUOTE(daganev @ Feb 7 2005, 06:28 PM)
Rhysus, I'm not sure who those people you quoted are. I do know that the debate between "creationism and Evolution" does not exactly exist on the college level. The debate exists in highschools, and what is being taught in a public school.
In Highschool, your basically just taught Darwinism as the basis and apparently true theory of Evolution, which not only doesn't make all that much sense, but also appears to actively teach against almost all religions ideas. (not just christian, it just so happens that most other religions get taught so much other crap in school also, that we are use to telling our children that they shouldn't believe everything they learn at public school)
With all my years of Listening to NPR, I still havn't heard any explanation that makes sense and is consitant with what I see in my world that explains how you go from multicellular organism to fish to land animal to bird. I've seen links and similarities, but links and similarities only tell me that they have the same basic design structure, and whatever made them was pure genious.
In Highschool, your basically just taught Darwinism as the basis and apparently true theory of Evolution, which not only doesn't make all that much sense, but also appears to actively teach against almost all religions ideas. (not just christian, it just so happens that most other religions get taught so much other crap in school also, that we are use to telling our children that they shouldn't believe everything they learn at public school)
With all my years of Listening to NPR, I still havn't heard any explanation that makes sense and is consitant with what I see in my world that explains how you go from multicellular organism to fish to land animal to bird. I've seen links and similarities, but links and similarities only tell me that they have the same basic design structure, and whatever made them was pure genious.
44427
I would be happy to provide you with a range of texts you may read that should clear up a number of matters that are generally difficult to wrap your head around from the standpoint of a High School class on evolution or an NPR broadcast. Given, the language in most of them is relatively technical, but should you be interested definitely let me know.
Unknown2005-02-07 23:33:07
QUOTE(Quidgyboo @ Feb 7 2005, 03:23 PM)
First time I've heard that before. Can you provide some evidence?
I know you think carbon dating is totally unreliable, but do you know how it works? That the carbon in question (i forget which specific type) has a very defined half-life meaning that over time we can test the age of a substance containing carbon by testing how much/man carbon molecules remain?
Science isn't perfect, but it's much better than a book.
I know you think carbon dating is totally unreliable, but do you know how it works? That the carbon in question (i forget which specific type) has a very defined half-life meaning that over time we can test the age of a substance containing carbon by testing how much/man carbon molecules remain?
Science isn't perfect, but it's much better than a book.
44420
I've learned everything I know through lectures, through people, I don't have links that I can paste, I do know the website of the man who does a wonderful set of seminars, which is drdino.com.
And I'd think that carbon dating a doggy who is still wearing his collar in the hundreds of thousands of years is a bit off.
Raan2005-02-07 23:34:47
QUOTE
If it's getting you upset, it's working the way I intended it to.
No, Im trying to moderate between to parties. You may have noticed I said my peace otherwise, and no argument changes it, and I dont argue back after I have done so.
This however is nothing more than trolling to help weed out those who you dont want to hear from. So grow up please. Alyvia intended for this to be an adult conversation, and if you cannot act like an adult when dealing with others viewpoints, you should not be a participant.
Daganev2005-02-07 23:34:51
In many sciences you have what I call the "Wham affect." For example in biology, you look at the tiny cell and how complicated and well structured it is. Your shown how all liver cells basically do the same thing. Then you ask your teacher "How does the liver know when to stop growing so that it gets its unique shape?" And the teacher properly responds "It just does ok!" Or they will be more fluent and say "There is a mechanism on the cell that physcially forces the cell to stop growing." So you ask "why does the edge cell have that but not the inner cells, how does it know its at the end?" You ask these questions and in all sciences (save maybe physics (well not quantum physics) and math) the answer, boiled down to all the nice lingo is "It just does ok!?"...
How is that any different than the answer "G-d made it that way."?
How is that any different than the answer "G-d made it that way."?
Unknown2005-02-07 23:36:03
Ok, who am I? Why do I wake up and do what I do? What gives me meaning?
I'm Gavin. I don't know why I'm alive or why you are alive, but I think that we are. I think that the world is full of too much pain and too much fear and I think that the best way for me to give meaning to my own life is to try live and treat others in a way in which I would like to be treated.
I do have my own religious beliefs. I believed the world is made up of energy 'layers' constructed at different vibrational levels. I believe that there are forces and beings that exist which humans cannot or do not comprehend. I believe there are divine beings - manifested as singular animate entities, or perhaps as a creative projection of a single or collective want and or need - I believe these beings can influence, help, guide, condemn, punish and love us as mortals. I also believe these beings are friends rather than divine masters. I believe life is intrinsically sacred and that people are capable of anything.
Do I have proof for these beliefs…None that you would accept. I have only my own experiences - isn't that all any of us has?
Can I accept I might be wrong? Yes. And no, that does not bother me overly much.
I was Christian, accepting what mummy and the scripture lessons told me without too much question. But then, I grew older and smarter. How could I accept a doctrine shrouded in provisos, hate and threats. How could I accept a religion with a history of so much blood; so much degradation of women? How could I take responsibility for something someone apparently did many eons ago? How could who I love make me a bad person?
That’s a small synopsis of that which I am, why I believe and do what I do believe and do.
I'm Gavin. I don't know why I'm alive or why you are alive, but I think that we are. I think that the world is full of too much pain and too much fear and I think that the best way for me to give meaning to my own life is to try live and treat others in a way in which I would like to be treated.
I do have my own religious beliefs. I believed the world is made up of energy 'layers' constructed at different vibrational levels. I believe that there are forces and beings that exist which humans cannot or do not comprehend. I believe there are divine beings - manifested as singular animate entities, or perhaps as a creative projection of a single or collective want and or need - I believe these beings can influence, help, guide, condemn, punish and love us as mortals. I also believe these beings are friends rather than divine masters. I believe life is intrinsically sacred and that people are capable of anything.
Do I have proof for these beliefs…None that you would accept. I have only my own experiences - isn't that all any of us has?
Can I accept I might be wrong? Yes. And no, that does not bother me overly much.
I was Christian, accepting what mummy and the scripture lessons told me without too much question. But then, I grew older and smarter. How could I accept a doctrine shrouded in provisos, hate and threats. How could I accept a religion with a history of so much blood; so much degradation of women? How could I take responsibility for something someone apparently did many eons ago? How could who I love make me a bad person?
That’s a small synopsis of that which I am, why I believe and do what I do believe and do.
Daganev2005-02-07 23:36:05
I'm interested.
Unknown2005-02-07 23:37:22
QUOTE(Rhysus @ Feb 7 2005, 03:30 PM)
No, that's exactly what I am saying. You were taught different things than I was. The fact that I taught myself the vast majority of what I base my arguments on isn't really relevant, but it stands to be noted. Regardless, I feel it anything but insulting to tell you that you are ignorant of certain facts when you are -ignorant of certain facts.- It's just the truth. If you don't -know- enough about something, you can't hope to refute it in a coherent fashion. It's become obvious that you were never taught enough to refute modern evolutionary theory in anything approaching a reasonable fashion. That isn't your fault, necessarily. Just the path your life has taken.
44429
Ok, we've been doing a lot of talking about what your knowledgeable in. Why not talk about what I'm knowledgable in? Why is creation not possible? What is the evidence against it? Is there enough factual evidence that you don't have to call upon faith to believe it?
I forgot I asked this a long time ago. I don't know what sarky is, but I'm sure it wasn't that...B.I.B.L.E means Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth.
Rhysus2005-02-07 23:38:28
QUOTE(raan @ Feb 7 2005, 06:34 PM)
No, Im trying to moderate between to parties. You may have noticed I said my peace otherwise, and no argument changes it, and I dont argue back after I have done so.
This however is nothing more than trolling to help weed out those who you dont want to hear from. So grow up please. Alyvia intended for this to be an adult conversation, and if you cannot act like an adult when dealing with others viewpoints, you should not be a participant.
This however is nothing more than trolling to help weed out those who you dont want to hear from. So grow up please. Alyvia intended for this to be an adult conversation, and if you cannot act like an adult when dealing with others viewpoints, you should not be a participant.
44433
It's not trolling. It's a standard debate tactic, as anyone who's participated in serious discourse should be well aware of.
