As has been stated before, this whole event was partially motivated by the OOC realization by Magnagoran PLAYERS that the game was sucking for Celest. We stated as much here, and we massively changed our IC actions. I think this event was a catalyst to help.

Never again will I let the good of the game change my characters actions. Next time, we won't try to fix huge problems like the massive imbalance between Magnagora's power projection vs. Celest by ourselves. We'll just keep smashing them into oblivion, uncaring whether the game sucks for them, until the Admin does something. It is apparently their job, not ours, to make sure the game is fun.

You are mistaken Olan. Fain and Raezon pointed out to us before we ever had the notion of attacking Sernewilde to take pressure off of Celest.

Unless I'm misreading you, we aren't really disagreeing. The decision, whether from each person or from Up On High, was to take heat off of Celest, yes? Look where that got us. I'm saying, we did the right thing for the game, for players in other cities, and got hosed.

Whether the event was indirectly related to the change is actually irrelevant.

From what I hear they were ordered to, or step down from their positions in the city... just my little whisper on the rumor mill.

A little wrong there.

Eh, just said Id heard a rumor, didnt know if it was true or not, thanks for clarifying. In lieu of the new info, the blame goes straight to Daevos, without taking a detour at the Divine. Going along with it was a CRAPTASTIC idea, which any fool could have seen, in fact, Ak made a few comments about how stupid it would be, before it ever happened.

Since you are obviously much smarter than me, what would you have done in that situation?

I'll outline briefly everything that occurred:

1. A idea was presented to Fain about seeing if it would be possible to taint other races, namely the Elfen, without no immediate expectation of a result.
2. Fain got back to us about it much quicker than expected, but he told us that we had to attack Serenwilde, in order to attempt to create this new species of tainted beings. Most of the council immediately balked, and Brona even stormed out of the council room. The only member of the council that was for the action was Morslade. A tentative agreement was made to research everything that was required before making a full decision to commit ourselves.
3. The next day, Fain and Raezon then post to the council clan, both pushing for us to pursue the goal of attempting to create a new tainted species. Also they both commence some ritual on Nil with Gorgulu with several onlookers including Serenwilders without informing me even though I was around at the time.
4. Fain then ordered us to attack the Moon Spirits on Ethereal, and we refused him. He then true DFed me, Valek, and Brona.
5. Next day, me and Valek met with Fain to discuss our problems. While we were coming to a understanding, Kaervas raised Crow, and Serenwilde/Celest starting to attack any of our citizens in Glomdoring. I immediately went to assist, and truthfully I lost my temper a bit.
6. War commences, and after a long and tiring struggle, we fulfill every last one of the prerequisites that were required. But instead of gaining what we sought, we accomplished nothing but to kill three of our own demon lords, and gain a new enemy. Havent even seen Raezon since, and I have barely spoken with Fain as well.

In hindsight, it is obvious that we should have defied them. But that begs the question, if you cant trust your patrons to have your city's best interests in mind, who can you trust?

I see a major difference between Celest in the begining of the game, and Magnagora's sitaution now.

In the begining of the game it was large groups of magangorans killing people, working as a unit.

Now, all I see is few people working together, during the time of day that nobody in Magangora is around.

The only time I have ever seen a raid on Magnagoran things was when I've been half asleep or on java. And even then, there are barely 3 or 4 people around who can even pretend to attempt something.

Thirdly, I think this has very little to do with the war. Crow has been blown way out of proportion by people who like Celest and don't like the taint. I think its just good political manipulation on the part of certain Serenwilders.

Certain Serenwilders? Like who? Anyways, we just killed Gorgulu again with Daevos, Kaervas, etc. all about.

Which is, as I said in the other thread, Complete and utter bull .

Oh, and we couldn't tell that Gorgulu had been attacked. Isn't that handy?

I can see why Brona stopped playing and, quite frankly, I'm beginning to agree with him.

Edit: Language censored. (Elryn)

I would have to say Merloch was probabbly the most pivotal. Ofcourse, I have no charachters in the Serenwilde so its all outside info.

But considering the behavior of both Celest and Magnagora, and the disctincly different behavior of Serenwilde, I would have to say it has more to do with politics than any "event."

Anyone have figures on the number of Beta-testers (Closed Beta) who went to each city once Lusternia opened to the public? I was under the impression that most of the original Beta-Testers (At least the ones who were into combat) went to Magnagora. If the information I have is true, then people have to realize how much of an immense advantage that was to Magnagora in the beginning.

As far as I know, neither Daevos nor Valek where closed beta testers.

That is certainly the impression I got when I was a Magnagora citizen (I wasn't a closed beta tester).

One thing people kept on saying about closed beta was that none of us knew how to fight or anything like that. Most people in closed beta spent time trying to find bugs and typos. The only thing I gained from being in closed beta was knowing the various affects of Common skills and which ones I would want.

/end hijack.

As far as I'm aware, when celest was losing, they weren't doing quests 24/7 that got destroyed by one person in 3 minutes.

While finding bugs, you were using abilities. You were also seeing afflictions messages. You were checking quests for bugs. I hope you are not sitting here and trying to tell me that experiencing the game before anyone else did not help you.

I've Beta tested in MMORPGs and I know how being there first can give you an immense leg up on those who come after you. So please do not try to blow smoke up my pipe.

Have you ever seen my ability to fight?
If you look at all the closed beta testers maybe 3 of them had any combat or real quest ability. In magnagora atleast.

It was basically visaeries telling people things.
And you wouldn't believe how many things changed between closed beta and open beta. Tae'dae were soooo much cooler. (and unbalanced. Tae'dae had level 1 regen)

There were probably more alpha and closed-beta testers that I was aware of in Magnagora than anywhere else. Having said that, there were many who have never revealed their new characters to any of us.

Being in the beta test also means you had the opportunity to learn about quests before others. You had a chance to learn the lay of the land before anyone else. Just because you can't fight, does not mean that you did not benefit from being a Beta-Tester. Still, if it were your desire to learn how to fight, you could have taken full advantage of the advanced experience you had.

All it takes is a few people with a bit of knowledge to pass it on to the rest of the group. If your city had the benefit of having former Beta-Combatants and Beta-Questers while Celest did not, would not that be a huge advantage your city had over Celest?

I was not a beta tester, nor did I learn anything from one.