Yea... but I have to wonder... now the declare system makes the Avenger seamless, is there really any need for karma? I've seen it used to bring health to ridiculously high levels, or make bashing easier, but to my knowledge karma has not restricted excessive PK one bit.

You just have to start cursing people

Well, look at some of the threads regarding people like Munsia who camp out on Avechna's Peak and attack indiscriminantly even with declare/defend. Players obviously aren't taking it upon themselves to RP discouraging this type of behavior, so, yes, I see a need.

Look, I know some of you really abhor the slightest thought of Karma even after we've bent over backwards to address several legitimate issues. I still believe it will be a dynamic system that brings an added dimension to the game when we institute karmic curses. And I still believe those who are complaining aren't giving the system a chance or just giving a kneejerk reaction to any thought that PK may be made more difficult on attacking opponents on the prime in non-enemy territory.

Before you jump on the opportunity yet again to lambast Karma, I'd like to share with you my personal thoughts:

(1) I find it hard to take seriously complaints about a system that no one has even experienced.

(2) I expect 99% of players, even those who PK a lot, to rarely have karmic curses for any length of time--certainly not before they become truly debilitating. The 1% who may experience the really harsh side of karma will undoubtedly be those who do stunts like camping out on Avechna or the roads for the sole purpose of killing as many people as possible. Yes, we could make roads and Avechna and many other places safe zones but we'd prefer not to.

(3) Contrary to what some people are assuming, karma isn't meant to be the end-all or be-all or even to come close to being the perfect system to address PK. It is mainly to give an option for non-combatants to retaliate against those who attack them on the prime in non-enemy territory if they so choose to invoke a curse (remember, it will remove suspect status and open them up again for PK). There are a ton of potential enemy territories now, especially with denizen recognized areas, so to think we're trying to banish PK from the prime is obviously dead wrong.

If the system is a bust, will we consider removing Karma or making curses more difficult to inflict? Of course we will. Now the question to those of you in the anti-karma club is, will you even give Karma a chance to see how it impacts Lusternia or will you just continue on your campaign to complain as loud and hard as you can without even seeing the system fully in operation?

I appreciate the work you've all put into this, and the level of service we get as customers... it isn't the curses I dislike. As you say, they aren't being used. It's the blessings... I just don't see the need for them. The recent episodes with, say, Ixion having 10k health, or Gorgulu being slain by two people, would have been impossible/very difficult if it weren't for these blessings.

I know what I'm saying won't be a very popular viewpoint because people see the blessings as helping them, and what harm can come from that, right? It just seems... a bit too much. Combined with things like the Tosha blessing (to increase max hp) which is being done regularly by some people, it seems like everyone is being powered up and up.

Upgrades make people many happy psychologically, and only frustrate those who seek to bring down others, downgrades frustrate the whole, and please those who seek to bring down others. Best to upgrade everyone, than to downgrade, neh?

This isnt Achaea, this is Lusternia, Age of Ascention. People are going to be legendary in strength at the higher eschalons of power and knowledge. Here knowledge is power. Anyone with the knowledge and patience can procure great strength, not just those with spare cash, or amazing combat systems. Here, power goes to those who plan, and gather their strength first.

I rarely find anything to bitch about when it comes to the admin's handling of game mechanics, because it has been more than superb thusfar. Even the RP things I occasionally bitch about are usually tempered once I see the greater scope of what is in store.

I don't have any personal complaints. I just feel bad for the knight and Mage classes, because they fight using damage. How can they hope to kill someone with 10,000 health?

Thats funny, I've seen both knights and mages that can do over 1k damage in one round. Thats alot of no damage.

And I've seen people who can heal 1k damage in one round.

But...10k would heal more than that in one sip, WITHOUT mercy/sparkleberry and all that. Wouldn't they?

EDIT: What Silvanus said.

Yes.

Silly Buho.

But then you leave out other side effects, such as mages with demesne which can do extra damage or slow you down. If having 10k health made you so unkillable, why did I see Ixion die in the last FFA?

To get back slighty on topic.

I do believe the idea of killing demon lords and such would be that you need a large group, and some if not most people die, yet in the end you get the job done. Its for city/commune tatics and affects. Its not suppose to be something just one rogue can do. I mean a political rogue, not the normal definition of the word in IRE games.

Ixion just stopped using java not too long ago.

Even with 10k health, using Java would put Ixion at a major disadvantage when fighting classes that quickly give many afflictions or conditions that inhibit a person's sipping.

Indeed it would.

.

It's perfectly easy to die with 10k health. Instakills.

Like blademaster/bonecrusher instakills? Behead and brainbash? :/

Ever thought that if there weren't blessings available, there would be a lot more curses going around? What else are they going to spend their karma points on after all? While I could be wrong, I got this niggling feeling that your suspect list is fairly long, so... between fighting people with blessings, or working 24/7 to get rid of curses on you, which would you pick?

Oh, I can't be the only one who really does like being able to retaliate with just suspect instead of vengeance status, especially when it comes to people who like to kill once suspect disappears right? (Whether or not the ability is actually used is another matter of course.) No reason to be a doormat anyone can walk over once every 30 days per person.

Don't forget Chasm and Guardian's instant kills. It does suck for Druid and Aquamancers that they both don't have instant kills, but seeing as how good two classes have gotten after demesne upgrades, they can't complain that much.