Tainted Nature

by Daganev

Back to Common Grounds.

Desdemona2005-04-15 18:07:11
Eh, cities exploiting nature's resources, expanding at the expense of whatever was there before (praeries, swamps, forests, etc.) isn't enough reason to hate the cities? At least in an extreme aspect I think it is. Also, you could keep regarding that the cities were at fault for releasing the Taint, and also blame their current actions against the commune. There still are reasons why you can hate the cities. They don't respect the Nature spirits, above all. Regarding Taint-Nature, maybe inevitably the Nature had to carry the Taint as a parasite and become Tainted Nature, but the fact that such thing is actively against us... that means that Glomdoring doesn't match up with Serenwilde. So, one way or the other, Tainted Nature is not the same as the Nature thing we possess, which is enough to trigger we can't coexist. *shrug* Unless we become symbiotic.
Richter2005-04-15 18:10:54
Well sure, they can co-exist, but remember, the original tainting event (which is why you -used- to hate cities) twisted and scarred the land. Serenwilde is now just pulling its head out from underneath the covers.
Desdemona2005-04-15 18:16:30
Let's see how well Glomdoring-Serenwilde coexist. Hopefully, it won't be the type of "coexisting" Celest and Magnagora experience at the begining of the game...
Daganev2005-04-15 21:56:19
QUOTE(Shiri @ Apr 15 2005, 09:58 AM)
The problem is that if Elryn's right...well, fine.

But if Daganev's right, Serenwilde's screwed for RP. We have no good reason to be anti-Taint, because it coexists just fine with nature. And we can't hate the cities, because the only real reason we have to hate the cities (and that's debatable) is "they released the Taint!" Seeing as this suddenly isn't a problem...huh.gif
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No your RP is not screwed.

let me say this softly... AUSKELIS HAS SAID OVER AND OVER THAT YOU HAVE NO REAL REASON TO HATE THE TAINT!... Thats a Lisarea thing. Gods are not communes.

The only reason you hate cities is because they are expansionsit and don't respect the Nature spirits. This has always been the case, even before the Taint came about.
Daganev2005-04-15 22:00:39
This is the main website I was looking at :

http://www.dutchie.org/Tracy/dg.html


There was a few others that were of a similar vain, giving a large list of goddesses. I was looking through thier various symbols to see which ones came up the most.

The thing about the moon being a mix. As you like to put it, its a trinity of feminity. However, that trinity of feminity is a metaphor for the mixing of light and dark. You think only females can relate to Wiccan goddessess? Its the cycle of life, the cycle of forces, the mixing of goodness and baddness, light and dark. During the Full moon, the preganant mother, people focus on those things that are good and happy, like birth, during the New moon they focus on darkness and death, in the middle they focus on the mixing of the two.

Only during the night, and images of the night can you really metaphorically speak of the mixing and cycle and balance of what is good and what is bad. The Sun doesn't really allow that metaphor, because day has an opposite in night, while in night the moon and stars are a mixture of light and dark, as apposed to being opposites of light and dark.
Desdemona2005-04-15 22:05:20
The Taint is some scum that the cities released, of course we can hate it. It was thanks to this "The End of the World is Here, run away from the Cloud of the Taint", that Ackleberry disappear, Serenwilde was about to follow, and Gloriana had a facelift gone wrong. We have ample reasons to both dislike the Light/Taint, because for one, they are the powers the cities use. Two, they are not our Nature spirits and Ethereal, and other things. Also, the commune is past the "tolerate" the Taint, thanks to recent days having bad experiences with Magnagora/Taint.
Daganev2005-04-15 22:08:09
I also wanted to say that One Avatar saying no alliance shouldn ot mean anything unless ALL the avatars said that. Don't want to get stuck in the same problem Celest got in with only following one avatar
Elryn2005-04-16 01:38:07
QUOTE(daganev @ Apr 16 2005, 07:56 AM)
No your RP is not screwed. 
let me say this softly... AUSKELIS HAS SAID OVER AND OVER THAT YOU HAVE NO REAL REASON TO HATE THE TAINT!...  Thats a Lisarea thing.  Gods are not communes.

And by your own logic, Auseklis doesn't represent the commune OR nature, Daganev. I'm not following Lisaera's teachings, I'm following what is in the histories.
QUOTE(Daganev)
The only reason you hate cities is because they are expansionsit and don't respect the Nature spirits.  This has always been the case, even before the Taint came about.
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And this is patently FALSE. Please, read the histories very carefully again. Before the taint we were uneasy with cities, not sure whether to trust them, because they were acting a little too hastily and power-hungry for the communes' liking. Did we hate them? No.

They are expansionist (like serenwilde) and don't respect the nature spirits, but that is why we were a bit wary about them. We HATE them because they caused the Taint, which destroyed two communes.
Daganev2005-04-16 01:43:27
When did the serenwilde in the histories ever help the cities?

Auskelis is a Nature god, of the 6th circle just as Lisarea is. I think he knows what is and what is not anti Nature.


your OOC theories should encompass what all the gods say, not just the one god you like.
Elryn2005-04-16 01:46:15
1) I didn't say ANYTHING about helping the cities.
2) AUSEKLIS != NATURE, LISAERA != NATURE. If Auseklis and Lisaera say conflicting things, why do you only choose to accept one of them as 'divine truth'? Your character might, but surely you can see that neither of them are authoritative if they disagree.
Elryn2005-04-16 01:48:21
QUOTE(daganev @ Apr 16 2005, 11:43 AM)
your OOC theories should encompass what all the gods say, not just the one god you like.
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And I'm really tired of this snide sort of remark. Everything I have been saying is based off the histories and world of Lusternia.

If you mean OOC theory as in, objective from the point of view of the whole Lusternian mythos, sure.
Unknown2005-04-16 01:50:03
Just a minor hijack, I agree with what was said a page back, Ak really does know alot about celtic history and mythology....but his abuse of the language is intolerable and for that he must die Ak/Morri --> bop.gif <-- Me
Daganev2005-04-16 01:53:30
I said OOC not OOG tongue.gif Thats why I wrote the lexicon. These forums are OOC.

Now, Both Auskelis and Lisarea live in the same world, they are each personalities they are not gods of realms. Viravain also, has a say on how Nature and Taint are.

You have to have your OOC theory on how Taint and Nature interact that fits all three viewpoints.


If Serenwilde never helped a city in the histories how can you say it was just 'uneasyness'... 'uneasyness' is what Serenwilde has with Celest recently, but they both help eachother out when they need it.
Elryn2005-04-16 01:58:46
QUOTE(The Histories)
The Communes first greeted the cleansing of the waters with joy, but then looked on with skepticism as the mages plundered further and deeper into other planes of existence, traveling through the ethereal plane and tapping into other planes of power.

.....

But Celest could not contain all those who sought to partake of its wonders, and soon citizens of Celest spilled out to other parts of the Basin, founding other cities and researching other planes of existence. The Communes watched the inevitable expansion with a growing misgiving, for the thirst for power seemed to outpace any pause for wisdom.


And just for you, Daganev, my take on how the Gods feel about taint:

Lisaera - Hates the taint because it perverted the great spirit of Night, the 'daughter' of her fallen sister Elfenehoala.
Auseklis - Doesn't care about modern taint because it is easily removed and no lasting harm is caused.
Viravain - Insane after posession, can't see the taint at all or somehow finds it pleasing.
Unknown2005-04-16 02:13:30
QUOTE(daganev @ Apr 16 2005, 09:00 AM)
This is the main website I was looking at :

http://www.dutchie.org/Tracy/dg.html
There was a few others that were of a similar vain, giving a large list of goddesses.  I was looking through thier various symbols to see which ones came up the most.

The thing about the moon being a mix.  As you like to put it, its a trinity of feminity. However, that trinity of feminity is a metaphor for the mixing of light and dark.  You think only females can relate to Wiccan goddessess?  Its the cycle of life, the cycle of forces, the mixing of goodness and baddness, light and dark.  During the Full moon, the preganant mother, people focus on those things that are good and happy, like birth, during the New moon they focus on darkness and death, in the middle they focus on the mixing of the two.

Only during the night, and images of the night can you really metaphorically speak of the mixing and cycle and balance of what is good and what is bad.  The Sun doesn't really allow that metaphor, because day has an opposite in night, while in night the moon and stars are a mixture of light and dark, as apposed to being opposites of light and dark.
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Lifht and dark doesn't truly exist in the belief systems. There is no light and dark, right or wrong, good or evil - they are all natural and one is not better than the other. What matters is intent.

The moon cycles, waxing, full and waning are stages of growth, fullness and power, and destruction or banishment.

EDIT: Gah was going to say more but I feel ill, so I'm going.
Lisaera2005-04-16 15:08:12
Just to point something out, it's not always a good idea to listen to your spirits. If the Seren actually consulted White Hart more he'd probably tell them to immediately attack Magnagora and Celest directly and start another all-out war across the Basin. Because he doesn't like cities, and is fairly warrior-like.

Would that be a good idea for Serenwilde? No.

Also, My RP as Lisaera has to be consistent, no matter whether I think differently as an admin or not. That's not to say people shouldn't be following what She is saying, just that mortals should, in the end, make up their own minds on what to do.
Shamarah2005-04-16 17:59:12
You guys actually consult your spirits? I don't think anyone's tried talking to a Supernal about anything since, like, the beginning of the game.
Erion2005-04-16 18:40:09
Yea. =\\ Erion rarely wants to do anything without Rowena telling him to. tongue.gif
Akraasiel2005-04-16 22:10:42
QUOTE(AlyssandraAbSidhe @ Apr 15 2005, 09:50 PM)
Just a minor hijack, I agree with what was said a page back, Ak really does know alot about celtic history and mythology....but his abuse of the language is intolerable and for that he must die Ak/Morri --> bop.gif <-- Me
99290


I suck when it comes to gaelic :weep: lemme alone. Ive got the culture down pat though tongue.gif