That makes perfect sense. Damage should be less dependent on strength so Faelings can show off their level 3 balance and be more effective than Brood Viscanti.

Actually, I was talking about offensive capability other than damage, you know, the wounds that nobody really worries about.

I'm talking about creativity and stuff, speed is just a different statistic as far as I can see.

Still right, mind.

That's a moot point. It costs 900cr to trans all three guild skills. If you cannot come up with the credits then you won't have the abilities and you probably won't get too far.

In other matters, sacrifice is damn near impossible without trample (300cr), Absolve/Wrack/Toadcurse pretty much require you to have contemplate (~200cr into Discernment), etc. A knight (Ur'guard aside with respects to sacrifice) doesn't need contemplate or trample... but they need runes. It all evens out in the end. And for the record, anyone who wants to stand a chance against a knight also needs trans resilience (300cr).

And while Narsrim is a Moondancer, yes, you have no idea what sort of experience I have with knights and specifically knights in Lusternia. I certainly did and do test out the Ur'guard in my spare time because I think they are a cool class.

God, lets not let this thread to degenerate into a rune bitch thread... and as someone who can get 22 strength and has 160+ damage weapons, I can assure you I do NOT do enough damage to make someone sip health, you should know, after lash and sparkle I do exactly 0 net damage to you and you have told me as such. And by loudest I meant loudest, as in the most loud, as in being the most active in posting threads commenting on his greatness.

You don't worry about mangled legs? That's amazing.

To end the hijack, I was simply stating before this all degenerated that if wound afflictions are going to improve then there needs to be some serious counter balance to raw damage. It simply would be too powerful to have Knights doing huge damage, charbydon hidden afflictions every now and then, and then have kickass wounds (one crush from Murphy already does over 40% wounds, goes through stancing and parrying, and does massive damage with a chance to give an affliction).

Whereas everyone may not have the skill, talent, credits, etc. to achieve this, a great of people do and we shouldn't balance from the bottom up.

The problem with knights is too many random chance occurances. 50% Venoms, and some random percent chance to do wound afflictions. We need reliabiliy. Our damage isn't amazing anyway, and now for it to be split into two categories seems like it would make it hard to maintain decent damage in both areas, which a non-artifact knight needs to be successful.

I don't see how spreading out the damage we do into different categories matters. There's so many RANDOM chance things in Lusternia, and a ton of effects based on statistics to boot. I just hope we get some form of reliable way to hurt people, afflict people, whatever. Also, Puissance as a trans skill should just die.

You're right, I don't unless I'm going against someone who has spent $200 on runes, because otherwise I can shield, smoke faeleaf, use waxing, sparkleleaf, and just tank the damage while I apply health.

Affordablity is NEVER moot. We're not all 6 figure tycoons. Some of us, in fact most of us, as demonstrated in repeated polls are students who would have to work pretty damn hard to make a 5 figure income. I might be able to afford to trans all 3 guildskills once, but I certainly can't do it twice, and then spend 200 more dollars on runes so I can get good damage, and then blow 100 more on combat so I can have decent accuracy (BTW, set accuracy, sounds great, make it high). You have to trans 2 guildskills (Since Hexes is just bad and healing isn't useful offensively), Narsrim. Where's the balance?

I don't understand how your damage is "bad." Any person can drastically increase their damage with careful and wise racial selection. Whereas this may not appeal to some people who want to be a Lucidian Warrior, that's how the mechanics work. Do you think I truly wanted to go from human to dwarf? Hell no, but to become better in combat, it was necessary so I made a reason to go dwarf. The same applies to all classes.

And in its current form, wounds + afflictions are icing on the cake because knights with good weapons and a good race can do some serious damage (and let's not forget skills like knockdown to help out).

I went from Brood Viscanti Lich to Shadowlord Faeling Ebonguard...My damage before was little to worry about, and now I'm fast so I can try to make more options...but regardless. To many people assess knight damage with guys like Murphy in mind, runes are horribly unfair and imbalanced in my opinion because of the enormous difference they make. On a pvp scale, I'd place a warrior roughly at a 5-6, and a runed warrior at a 10 hands down. That's drastic, however, normal knights can't do that.

You mean if you go Ur'Guard and Viscanti? Because otherwise you're only going to get 16-18 strength, and it still caps at around 900 damage over 4-5 seconds, unless of course you want to spend 200 extra dollars. Factor in four methods of stopping an attack against a knight, and our damage over time declines by a large amount.

I would agree, but I think you will agree that at this stage of the game, we cannot just "ignore" those runes and upgrade. Murphy can already kill 80% of Lusternia in a single pulp. Does that need upgraded? However, I do agree completely that someone without such is at a disadvantage... however, my advice to you is bash on astral and buy some runes. If I can do 300cr for trans resilience, you can get 350 for runes.

I wish I could agree with this. However, we don't JUST need those skills. We need a measure of combat and resilience to cope with warriors, we need trans discipline to avoid getting nailed in druid demesnes and by allhexes and Celestines, etc. etc.. So it wouldn't apply across the board.

Good luck doing that against Inquisition, Omen + Sensitivity, etc. And quite frankly, I'm in the same boat as you. I'm a college student who is double majoring and I have to pay ridiculous of money for library fees in a building I've never been in... but that's life. My financial situation shouldn't influence game play. Overall balance just overrides such.

Narsrim, my idea for a long time has been something as such. Murphy can kill 80% of Lusternia. He paid to be able to do that, that's fine. Alot of IRE games seem like that, paying for artifacts makes you better than the vast majority, it's common place. Now, I think runes need to be changed and toned down to keep roughly the same advantage, keeping him quite the fighter, but cutting the bridge from 5-6 to 10, more like maybe 7-8 to 8-9... because it's ridiculous that the 95% of us knights without artifacts have to suffer because a few people bought them.

I hope someone deletes all of your posts, as you've both stated you know you're hijacking yet don't stop doing it

I hate to break it to you but Paladins in Aetolia/Achaea cannot kill 80% of the general population when they have ~8000cr worth of artifacts in a SINGLE ATTACK. It can be done in Lusternia with under 1k.

In fact, I used to beat many a paladin with artifact swords as a Consanguine Vampire, which was rather nerfed at the time and a crappy class (Imagine having absolve and your only mana draining attack drains 10% mana and that's it).

I knew an Aetolian knight for awhile who was really good and killed tons of people because he had asp, and asp was amazing. People couldn't keep up with it. Knights in Aetolian weren't damage based, if you wanted damage you looked to Tekura users. Knights had 100% chance venoms, which would create much strategy and depth, rather than relying on some random chance. They could afflict enough and just behead... or like the perticular knigth I'm thinking of, get enough damage through artifacts and have asp, that all you have to do is type your attack alias over and over with semi-decent healing and noone can live past you.

Ok, fine. Calin was Tekal (level 99) in Aetolia last time I was there. With all his arties (we are talking the works, +3 str, level 3 knuckles, etc)... he still could not kill me in a single combo (took him about 4-5 actually)