And we'll have done all of about 200 norm damage to Daevos. Who's got a max of, what, 6k?

You're also assuming most druids can take the hits necessary to be slinging, etc. And not every druid is a rune user.

Lets say we have a knight with 4k health, 1.5k mana, fullplate, etc.

I shoot him for maybe 400 damage, and let's be generous and say 150 bleeding (armour I believe cuts bleeding as well). He sips for 700 on average, and sparkles for 150 mana and 400 health. He can clot 2.5 times per sparkleberry and have no net mana loss. So that's 50 bleeding, plus whatever kingdom clots for him. And if he has perfection, he can clot even more. Hell, with the damage he's taking and his sip, he can probably afford to sip mana. Chervil doesn't even factor into his curing at all in this case.

100% cutting has to be the easiest type of damage to block in the realms, and the bleeding doesn't make up for it unless you have someone stuck with sap.

A knight with surge, unafflicted with all defenses up won't die to a Geomancer or Aquamancer either.

That wasn't really the point. I was pointing out that bleeding damage doesn't put cudgel up to par. And it only gets worse if I stop to rune first, because then he can easily sip mana for whoring clot instead of health for the damage.

Jello once again you are also assuming that everyone is kind enough to stop and let me demesne and fuse a rune. It has already been stated that Cudgel is way under par both in and out of a demesne. If Cudgel is fine in a demesne then I demand that everyone who fights me only does so within my demesne and should they jump me I get to make a demesne and fuse runes so that my cudgel is fine.

The fact is niether mages nor druids should be expected to always fight within their demesne, they are already weakened when not in a demesne however aqua and geo staff can easily make up for that damage wise, whereas cudgel cannot and never could.

To lazy to edit...

Note that I am not asking for some big upgrade. I am asking that it be realised that our Cudgel does damage which is heavily biased in defensive measures and against anyone from either city overall protection can exceed 80% of the damage we do. If Druids are supposed to newbie kick their opponents then fine, at least tell us that so we can shut up and stop talking about this. If we were given a skill to use though, then look into the skill and see if maybe all the people who use cudgel might actually be onto something here.

Cudgel's damage is laughable, then again, I have high cutting with drawdown. They should make it half cutting, half magic at least, so you can at least do some damage.

Arilyon destroyed Daevos in her demesne several times in a row using only universal druid effects, without using anything from Crow or without using scarab...your cudgel is just fine.

Against Daevos there's no way in hell I'd touch my cudgel, except for staffsling. Sickle does the same amount of damage (sans bleeding), but of a harder to defend type.

She did use the cudgel, which is part of why she won...she killed his mana by stacking cudgel bleeding and paralysis, sapped and paralysed again, locked the paralysis with impatience and assorted afflictions..and by the time he got out, the fight was over.

no need to give them fighting tips thorgal

any other tips?

Lynx stole my god damn +1 jar of necroage

sorry, didn't mean to

The fact that Daevos has only 9 Int and level 2 sip penalty helps her win as well.

Yea. +1