Conflict and Balance in Lusternia

by Estarra

Back to Common Grounds.

Unknown2005-06-15 18:07:56
QUOTE(Estarra @ Jun 15 2005, 07:03 PM)
What of a (hard) quest that peaces the world for a game month? And an opposing quest to take it down?

(BTW, talking about 'adding quests' is a lot easier said than done.)
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Now isn't that an idea... that would be interesting indeed. I LOVE the idea, but I forsee a lot of problems with it. When the quest becomes available to do... it'll probably end up with more bloodshed than the quests completion would prevent. Also it would allow killing those working for peace, and those working for war perform it in peace, kind of contradictory. It's only the outline of an idea I know, but it would require a great deal of thought.

Rhysus's words earlier should be adhered to though... try not to make the game move more towards a game, but towards a world. East said I know, but... well... let's see how the responses come out biggrin.gif
Estarra2005-06-15 18:08:08
QUOTE(Amaru @ Jun 15 2005, 11:04 AM)
What IS definitely biased about the politics system is that Angkrag and Acknor are tainted, and it would be bad roleplay for Celest or Serenwilde to take them.
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Glomdoring can take them. Speaking of politics, there's nothing to stop Glomdoring from allying with Serenwilde and Celest to help them with, say, Dairuchi and Estelbar, in return for helping them get Angkrag and Acknor.

evil.gif Politics, after all, makes strange bedfellows.
Estarra2005-06-15 18:10:20
QUOTE(Angel @ Jun 15 2005, 11:07 AM)
Rhysus's words earlier should be adhered to though... try not to make the game move more towards a game, but towards a world. East said I know, but... well... let's see how the responses come out biggrin.gif


Rhysus has some interesting theories, but it'd help me more to see specific suggestions.
Ralshan2005-06-15 18:10:26
Eh. Celest could (if it weren't made impossible by game mechanics about influencing undead in the case of Angkrag) take those villages in an attempt to convert them. Serenwilde could attempt to... I dunno, cleanse them with the power of Moon? Whatever it is they do. It could be argued that it's just as bad RP for Magnagora to try and take Estelbar, a village full of snuggly furrikin vegetarian orphans, except they do try and it's not bad RP at all.
Estarra2005-06-15 18:12:14
QUOTE(Ralshan @ Jun 15 2005, 11:10 AM)
Eh. Celest could (if it weren't made impossible by game mechanics about influencing undead in the case of Angkrag) take those villages in an attempt to convert them.


It is possible by game mechanics (rather recently).
Unknown2005-06-15 18:12:34
One thing I'd like to see now in this new political structure made by the creation of Glomdoring is shifting alliances. We already have Celest and Serenwilde against Glomdoring and Magnagora... Taint versus non-Taint... but also having City versus commune... Magnagora and Celest against Serenwilde and Glomdoring? Difficult to achieve perhaps, but if the communes took their anti-city stance that they used to be so high and mighty about in the early days, it could prove an interesting scenario.
Desdemona2005-06-15 18:14:33
QUOTE(Syrienne @ Jun 15 2005, 10:52 AM)
Peacing things would seem to much like a punishment to some people in my opinion. Forced peace is not really playing into player ran world in my opinion, its more like the Gods doing the running. One thing I suggested in the past is that villages be 'upgradeable'. What do I mean by this.. well certain things could be bought, using power, for your village.. suchas.. cobblestone streets that prevent burrowing.. upgraded barriers to stop flow/catacombs things like that.. Town Guard upgrade to make guards in the village better outfitted and thus more potent.. things like this. I think you should be able to directly affect your villages level of 'technology' if you will, if a village is being ruled over by Magnagora this huge Empire whos bound to be technology rich the villages should prosper from such affects.. whereas Serenwilde being a large commune could affect it in other ways perhaps.. give them some basic upgrades that're universal then some unique to each community.. sort of like influencing itself having special city skills.
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I love this idea. Upgradable towns...
Syrienne2005-06-15 18:15:14
Celest/Seren cant ally with Glom because they is the tainted! Taint must die! die die die die! heh.. people forget Glom -tried- to atleast seek a neutral peace with Serenwilde based on the commune common ground idea but they cant keep reigns on their fighters for 2 seconds.. you want to ask why does Magnagora do so well then look at the leadership.. how many people in Mag do you see running rampantly unchecked.. Yrael maybe? One guy whos not even that oppressive.. Now what Celest has Amaru and Malicia running all over, Serenwilde has Munsia, Narsrim and Tuek running outside any law. These are the people who prevent alliances or peaces happening in my opinion..


and to ninja anyone who goes Malicia is from Seren! I know this but Malicia doesnt instigate without Amaru, so I group them as doing more work on Celest behalf than Serenwilde.. she'll fight with her mates but she dont go singlehanded raiding like say Munsia will.
Estarra2005-06-15 18:15:16
QUOTE(Angel @ Jun 15 2005, 11:12 AM)
One thing I'd like to see now in this new political structure made by the creation of Glomdoring is shifting alliances. We already have Celest and Serenwilde against Glomdoring and Magnagora... Taint versus non-Taint... but also having City versus commune... Magnagora and Celest against Serenwilde and Glomdoring? Difficult to achieve perhaps, but if the communes took their anti-city stance that they used to be so high and mighty about in the early days, it could prove an interesting scenario.
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There's absolutely nothing stopping that. (Don't tell me that RP prevents it because it is just as valid for the communes to conclude that the cities in aggregate are overpowered and combine their forces to combat their dominance.)
Estarra2005-06-15 18:18:01
QUOTE(Syrienne @ Jun 15 2005, 11:15 AM)
Celest/Seren cant ally with Glom because they is the tainted! Taint must die! die die die die! heh.. people forget Glom -tried- to atleast seek a neutral peace with Serenwilde based on the commune common ground idea but they cant keep reigns on their fighters for 2 seconds.. you want to ask why does Magnagora do so well then look at the leadership.. how many people in Mag do you see running rampantly unchecked.. Yrael maybe? One guy whos not even that oppressive.. Now what Celest has Amaru and Malicia running all over, Serenwilde has Munsia, Narsrim and Tuek running outside any law. These are the people who prevent alliances or peaces happening in my opinion..
and to ninja anyone who goes Malicia is from Seren! I know this but Malicia doesnt instigate without Amaru, so I group them as doing more work on Celest behalf than Serenwilde.. she'll fight with her mates but she dont go singlehanded raiding like say Munsia will.
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All you say may be true, but the point is that these are decisions made by players and it is hard for me to muster sympathy to a city or commune that cuts off their nose to spite their face.
Gregori2005-06-15 18:18:45
QUOTE(Syrienne @ Jun 15 2005, 12:15 PM)
Celest/Seren cant ally with Glom because they is the tainted! Taint must die! die die die die! heh.. people forget Glom -tried- to atleast seek a neutral peace with Serenwilde based on the commune common ground idea but they cant keep reigns on their fighters for 2 seconds.. you want to ask why does Magnagora do so well then look at the leadership.. how many people in Mag do you see running rampantly unchecked.. Yrael maybe? One guy whos not even that oppressive.. Now what Celest has Amaru and Malicia running all over, Serenwilde has Munsia, Narsrim and Tuek running outside any law. These are the people who prevent alliances or peaces happening in my opinion..
and to ninja anyone who goes Malicia is from Seren! I know this but Malicia doesnt instigate without Amaru, so I group them as doing more work on Celest behalf than Serenwilde.. she'll fight with her mates but she dont go singlehanded raiding like say Munsia will.
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Yrael
Ravin
Stangmar
Murphy
Revan
Alger
Daevos

Shall I continue?
Estarra2005-06-15 18:18:55
QUOTE(Desdemona @ Jun 15 2005, 11:14 AM)
I love this idea. Upgradable towns...


But would city/communes purchase these upgrades knowing that they'll eventually lose the village? I rather like the idea myself.
Desdemona2005-06-15 18:19:07
QUOTE(Syrienne @ Jun 15 2005, 11:15 AM)
Celest/Seren cant ally with Glom because they is the tainted! Taint must die! die die die die! heh.. people forget Glom -tried- to atleast seek a neutral peace with Serenwilde based on the commune common ground idea but they cant keep reigns on their fighters for 2 seconds.. you want to ask why does Magnagora do so well then look at the leadership.. how many people in Mag do you see running rampantly unchecked.. Yrael maybe? One guy whos not even that oppressive.. Now what Celest has Amaru and Malicia running all over, Serenwilde has Munsia, Narsrim and Tuek running outside any law. These are the people who prevent alliances or peaces happening in my opinion..
and to ninja anyone who goes Malicia is from Seren! I know this but Malicia doesnt instigate without Amaru, so I group them as doing more work on Celest behalf than Serenwilde.. she'll fight with her mates but she dont go singlehanded raiding like say Munsia will.
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Yes, one sidedness seems to be deeply imbedded into people's minds. Partially due to the things that are simply around, that upon like for example... Serenwilde bedding with Glomdoring some would consider it a complete and utter betrayal of role. Sleeping with the enemy, who carries the poison and who carries the dagger?

Edit: To even think of Glomdoring and Serenwilde allying over something like nature v. civilization... The cities would actually have to even think of harming their alchemy providers and such, also they would also have the capacity of spreading forest fires and... take a deep swallow and be willing to also sleep with their enemies. Taint and Light, that's something I'd even pay to see allying. I mean, Taint and Light are even more opposite that Nature/Tainted Nature, imo.
Shamarah2005-06-15 18:20:45
QUOTE(Estarra @ Jun 15 2005, 01:08 PM)
Glomdoring can take them. Speaking of politics, there's nothing to stop Glomdoring from allying with Serenwilde and Celest to help them with, say, Dairuchi and Estelbar, in return for helping them get Angkrag and Acknor.

  evil.gif Politics, after all, makes strange bedfellows.
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Except that there's no villages like that for Celest/Serenwilde. Now, if there were an angelic village, so that only people with Emissary could influence the angels there, it'd be a different matter. But as it is, it's incredibly unlikely that Celest or Serenwilde will ever ally with Glomdoring and thus Acknor/Angkrag will always be Mag's/Glom's. There is no other village like that.
Syrienne2005-06-15 18:22:26
Hah no I dont think so Gregori.. Yrael is only one who griefs even close to comparison to peoeple like Munsia in Mag, they control their fighters if something is going on.. proble mis theres really only been -one- peace negoiated with Mag and that was by Celest.. which recently ended.


As for Estarra.. I agree entirely. I got no sympathy for anyone who refuses to grow a set and put down some laws on their own people, even if they are your best fighters. Course thats been one thing that bugs me about alot of MUDs is how if you can fight your suddenly excused from everything.. I hate that sort of logic. If you say We got a pact with so and so to not fight for this amount of time, and someone does it anyways, umm take action, not a slap on the hand after 5 times ..
Estarra2005-06-15 18:24:28
QUOTE(Desdemona @ Jun 15 2005, 11:19 AM)
Serenwilde bedding with Glomdoring some would consider it a complete and utter betrayal of role. Sleeping with the enemy, who carries the poison and who carries the dagger?


That's Serenwilde's choice but, really, it's in no way a 'betrayal of role'. Politics is all about tough choices and compromise when making alliances and treaties.

deal.gif The enemy of my enemy is my friend . . . at least for now.
Syrienne2005-06-15 18:26:49
I think people would buy village upgrades if they helped stem raiding <> thus extending village life length and productivity.. I mean right now Amaru can slip into our village, kill 3-4 guards and be gone by time we get there, Now if you could upgrade your village with potent guards, barriers to stop easy leaving and stones to prevent burrowing.. Yea it'd cost you but in order to save dwarves or farmers or whatever is it worth it? I'd say so.


Plus not only is it good for defense it's good for RP in my opinion.. I think it plays more into how a village benefits under the rule of certain nations.
Terenas2005-06-15 18:26:52
I'd actually like to see two cities or communes be able to share power or comms produced by a single village. So it would give each organizations more incentives to work together. That way, you can afford to have more guards defending a particular village, player or mob guards.
Estarra2005-06-15 18:29:07
QUOTE(Syrienne @ Jun 15 2005, 11:26 AM)
I think people would buy village upgrades if they helped stem raiding <> thus extending village life length and productivity.. I mean right now Amaru can slip into our village, kill 3-4 guards and be gone by time we get there, Now if you could upgrade your village with potent guards, barriers to stop easy leaving and stones to prevent burrowing.. Yea it'd cost you but in order to save dwarves or farmers or whatever is it worth it? I'd say so.
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My concern is that we added the nexus powers to help combat raiding but it seems like they're not used much--so why would we think village upgrades will be bought?
Syrienne2005-06-15 18:31:38
What like distortion? Distortion rarely stops anyone from walking out.. I think Narsrim just burrows out even, something that could be prevented as I mentioned by one upgrade.