Petticoat Junction?

...no. You've obviously never been graced by Her brilliance. A day will come, my young uninitiated friend. A day will come.

The only initiations I take part in either involve lots of beer or secret globe spanning organizations that practice long forgotten rituals of religious significance. Um . . . Anyway what ever your selling take it to the next door down.

Oh? You're a member of Wal-Mart's Sam's Club too?

BJ's Wholesale actually. No pun intended.

No no, shush, this is an interesting discussion, it doesn't need to die -just- yet. :/

Sorry

Thankyou, Melanchthon, for explaining yourself so intelligently.

I suppose my disagreements are rooted fundamentally in our understanding of what Taint is. If it is in any way aptly named, and the 'dark' side of Lusternia is not just a huge distortion and exaggeration of perfectly happy, healthy but different lifestyles, then I believe the arguments raised here are completely valid.

I -detest- the arguments that take an absurdist view on 'isn't everything Nature?', because any expansion of the definition beyond a certain point renders the meaning of 'nature' classes and organizations null, and open to any inclusion whatsoever.

The point is as far as the taint itself goes is it was a piece of Kethuru that corrupts all exsistance in an attempt to weaken and control it. Before Kethuru was re-sealed after the backlash that worked akin to the slapping of the hand of a child found stealing from the cookie jar. Now it's just a dark cloud that SLOWLY warps and messes with stuff...At least that is my understanding of the current taint versus what it was when Kethuru was attached to it.

The current Taint is the result of what happens when the Soulless god Kethuru tries to eat everything and fails.

Taint becomes the absolute sign of Life and victory against the the soulless gods.

Since room descriptions don't really change in any form of cycle, my understanding of the glomdoring before the commune existed was that it was a living breathing forest that appeared all nasty to people. Words like Starving, and sickly and twisted are adjectives that are subjective, they are not facts. Just as a Human fines 90% body hair coverage to be some sort of desease, Aslarnas I'm sure find 90% hairless bodies to be a disease amongst them aswell.

A "Dark Forest" means that everything is hidden and deceptive.

The aspect of Crow which is called Thirst, is the idea that the more hungry you are, the better off you are. It turns the Metaphysical idea of Hungry for power into a real life, Hunger. The Carrion skill in Crow, feeds you, but does not reduce your hunger level, but rather allows you to use that increased hunger for other purposes.

Its the dark side of the moon, the other side of the coin, and opposite to what would be of a Light forest community such as Ackelberry. Serenwilde is not its opposite which is the main reason why Glomdoring has no problem with being cousins with Serenwilde and sees no reason to be at consant war with them. Ackelberry however, I can't really see Glomdoring getting along with except in times of crisis.


If your definition of Nature is cyclical then the Taint is very much a part of nature, as has been statted many times, Taint is mutation and increased evolution. Now that Kethuru is gone, there is nothing about the Taint that is outside the scope of nature.

Its just not a valid argument, Daganev. Do we say that demon lords are really just viewed in a skewed perspective because they are tainted, but in reality they are actually enlightened, benevolent and caring aspects of the Light? Of course not.

Do we abandon all distinction between city and commune and call Magnagora an equally nature-based organization because the taint is actually part of nature, so that they are obviously serving an aspect of the nature spirits? Of course not.

Taint is something we know is foreign to Nature (of the Basin and planes), and it is something that all the Fae including the Great Spirits have opposed. Remember that the Fae -are- Nature, they don't resist natural change and evolution, they and the Serenwilde encompass all aspects of the natural cycles - growth and decay, life and death. For them to oppose it means that Nature itself opposes it.

The only time a spirit has not opposed it was after they were altered by being subsumed by the taint. This also caused a conflict amongst the Spirits themselves that had not existed beforehand.

Why might they oppose it?



I think the fact Glomdoring is expecting Serenwilde to be anything other than its most passionate opponent is a bit pointless. Glomdoring is the antithesis of everything Serenwilde believes in, regardless of whatever it tries to call itself.

ok, first off.

Demonlords ARE enlightening beings that no longer follow the Light.
You think the creatures in the Vortex and whatever the other place is are going to follow the Light? No, the Light is a Celest thing only.
The Emenations of Shallamar followed Truth as far as I can tell.

And I don't know why you would say Magangora is following a part of nature because it has taint? Magnagora is very clearly a city, and has the same goals as a city. The Fact that Celest has pretty gardens and potted plants doesn't make it nature based.

I like how you say that Serenwilde is the end all and be all of nature while Glomdoring isn't. :boggle:


As for the quote.. the soulless gods were poisioning the earth, that is an active thing the soulless gods were doing, just as a Viper poisions it's prey. Many aspects of nature poision other aspects of nature.

The fact that fae can be bound in shadow in the first place and not die, but rather come back to LIFE! shows that the Taint is not antithesis to Nature like you keep wanting to make it.

Magnagora is tainted, Glomdoring still thinks its bad based purely on the fact that its a city, and was an empire and actively tries to take over the world and act all city like.


Oh, and Just because Crazy uncle Harrold has gone nuts and doesn't talk to the family anymore, doesn't mean he is not family and isn't invited to the reunions as a chance to mend broken ties.

Now I'm starting to see how IC and OOC are mixing too badly. It's starting to sound like some of the arguments are trying to convince Glom or Seren to change their views (i.e. what Taint is, what is 'nature'). That realy is an IC issue. If the Seren believe that nature is 'the fae and elfen' then they are allowed to. If Celest believes that they are nature there's nothing OOCly stopping them from doing so and realy neither is the idea of Seren just deciding that Mag isn't so bad after all and that all elfen girls need to be married off to Mag nobles. What the cities/communes RP as is realy up to them, so long as they do RP.

So the fact that Seren and Glom are killing each other regularly, and the reasons for it, realy can't be altered, at least not in here. What questions we can bring up are:

1. Is everyone on both sides enjoying themselves OOCly (ICly..blah, go suffer) and.

2. If not, what technical aspects can change to help both sides?

oh yah, and

3. Why in the WORLD would ANY faeling willingly go to shadows? You replace your butterfly wings with those ikky bat wings. The stat bonuses are just not worth it.

I know if I turned shadow, I'd tear my wings off and just live on the ground. It might explain why they are all so suicidal

I don't completely agree with you Cwin, What Nature is, and what the taint is, can be argued and a conclusion can be met. However, that in no way should change the fact that some charachters don't make decisions off of facts.


To make an example of medicine, there is no 100% proof that "alternative" medicines work, however people still pay lots of money for the cures with the assumption it does work. IF people get up to 'heavan' or OOC land, and learn that the medicine did not work, they just got lucky, well then they will have come to a conclusion that shows that thier charachter didn't live based on facts all the time.

I don't think Serenwilde is the end all and be all. We do, however, revere all of Nature as sacred, death and life, the cycle of growth and decay. I expect Ackleberry will do the same. The differences between us will be in how each commune approaches the task of expressing that reverence, and how we choose to approach the outside world.

But Glomdoring? Yes, I believe Glomdoring is the bane of the nature-worshipping organizations, and that is how it was originally set up.

I personally just hate labeling. I think people should pay more attention to thE RP going on and not the labels they wish to stick on it. Mhaldor in Achaea said it best when they based the Seven Truths and much of their teaching around the fact there is no 'Good' and 'Evil' there is no labels of which to stick on masses of people and make it so. Such a mentality could serve well in many places cause its same as stereotyping people in real life.. it's not only stupid it makes an ass of yourself. Glomdoring came out and said it was not Tainted and wasnt going to support Mag as some kind of Taint brother.. but people wouldnt listen they just HAD to be some convinced Glom is Tainted and ignore the RP and stick a label on it..

How could we NOT stick a label on it? You ARE Tainted. That's not a moral label, it's a physical fact. If you're going to pretend you're not, that's a different matter entirely, but for everyone else to just go along with that is rather stupid.

Celest may as well pretend it's not a city and try to curry Serenwilde's favour that way.

No, the Bane of Nature-worshiping organizations would be cities....


You know, the whole Plow the land, kill the animals, plant the Stones and bricks, we are building a bypass here people!

You mean like Glomdoring and Serenwilde do? Kill the animals, build towers, have gardenish areas?

Tainted is a moral label, it means dirty and not the way its suppose to be.

Its a label the game mechanics gives us so we understand as players what our charachters are viewing.


If you are calling someone Tall, and to them they are not tall because they are the shortest person in their family, then calling them Tall is no longer a fact. Its a Subjective opinion based on the surroundings.


EDIT: gahh, why is the edit button right next to the quote button *peer*