I don't think it was a fair test, seeing as the peace started after Magnagora already had a huge lead. Lets revolt Estelbar again and start over.

From an RP point of view, the organizations may want to kill each other but are prevented if there's a peace spell.

Anyway, although we KNOW there are those of you who will never like peaceful village influencing, according to the polls both in forums and in-game and feedback we've had, there appears to be a MAJORITY who want peaceful influencing at least some of the times. Thus, we've responded to player demand and Estelbar was our test run to see how things work out.

No, we aren't going to have all villages be peaceful, and the fact is that probably it will be combat zones most of the time. But, for those who do want some peaceful influencing at least some of the time, we are willing to give it a try.

I honestly perfer the violent village influencing more, but it might be nice for a change to have some villages non-violent, and some violent. Please don't make ALL revolts like this one, it would take away a large part of Lusternia that I like - large scale PvP that matters a lot and only lasts a specific and short amount of time. This was certainly not BAD, just much less interesting than normal revolts, since half the skills/tactics are removed, with nothing interesting put in in their place.

Also, 2/3rds of city dwellers can help immensely, even if they are CR1, and even if they are pure fighters, even if they're complete newbies - they can Chant. I would love it if some of the younger Commune members could help similarly, with maybe some Coven ability in Moon and Night that helped in a similar manner, though different enough to be interesting. I know we have Light in Moon, but Light is hardly the same, and only has to be done once - it doesn't give the young something to actively do to keep influencing interesting for them. I have no idea what Night has regarding influencing.


EDIT: Half-ninjaed by Estarra
Estarra

Well, I kind of think that's the point. If we aren't fighting, we're going to be debating. You -should- have to debate other people out to get them out of the way so you can have the villagers to yourself. I don't really think there's anything wrong with divert, or ever has been as it's been that way from the beginning. Not everyone has it, so you won't need to debate every single person out.

Just thought I'd mention my views on that, people were talking about it in IRC also.

My rumored person who killed lots of people with debating said it was the most boring influencing ever, and they don't like to fight normally.

There should also be times when only violence is allowed, Skull for example.

I quite enjoyed the peaceful influencing, made a nice change.

Daevos just posted what I was going to say also, heh. It should be like, sometimes it's all peaceful, sometimes only violence, then sometimes the combination. That way it's random and would make influencing interesting for everyone, because you would need different strategies for each planetery alignment or..whatever.

CR1s can debate. Learn to debate if you want to help with village influencing.

Edit: Wow, didn't refresh for a time, so it's a delayed response to Stangmar.

While I wasn't there for Estelbar, I like the things I'm hearing about it. I also do not want fully peaceful, nor fully violent, but I would like a way to influence the way the village will be set up for the next round. (Meaning we can do quests of some sort to get the village to peacefully revolt, or not. However, the quests themselves can't be altered by violence, else the whole issue is nul)

I quite enjoyed it. I would like to see perhaps an increased gain, and maybe an added pretty for when a comm quest is done. "Ah, I'm so glad the Serenwilde is showing dedication to our small village!" Perhaps in various levels. "Hmph, so the Serenwilde thinks it can win us over with a few (cows/chickens/pieces of meat/vegetables/fruits/pieces of iron/gold/coal/silver/platinum, etc)? Hah! You'll need to do more than that, tree-dweller!" "Ah, my thanks, ! Perhaps the 'Wilde is not so bad, after all!" You know, things like that. Because, as stands, not all cr1s can influence, and I'd like to see some of them feel like comm questing is doing something - even if it's just a placebo. Some novices need that.

To my surprise I really enjoyed the peaceful revolt, even though I can't debate worth beans. I think it should only be occasional though so that those who enjoy the violent aspect of it can still have fun.



Interesting, that was actually my favorite part. The rush of debating, influencing, and diverting all at once. It was cool.

Also, from an RP point of view, the people who are wounded, die, and the people who die, stay dead. If you're going to try to argue from real-world history, you might want to keep in mind that that factor absolutely changes everything... so you really can't.

Stangmar, the Crusades aren't a good example. They were what begot Indulgences, and the latter Crusades were fought over greed and pride, nothing honorable involved.

i semi liked the peaceful influence it was interesting, i should bone up on my debating skills, aside from that, i agree with daevos we should have a violence only one to, where again no sanctury/crusades can be used and its influence and fight only. debating should not work in it either, but that might be a little much.

Except that from a IC RP point of view we do come back when we die thanks to the grace of the fates and the like.

But to just throw in my two soverigns, I personally mostly disliked the peaceful influencing, though I did like parts about it. On the negative side, I personally feel like influencing is the one time in particular where I can get out there and make a difference with my skills, to try and do my best against the other sides fighters or influencers. With the peaceful influencing I felt like the one area I was training for and get to excerise mainly during influencings was taken away, but just my thoughts.

On the plus side, I did think it gave a different feel to the influencing, and it was facinating to watch the change of tactics going on and the coordination when it changed over to 'ok, now its only debate and influence, so get at it' and it was fun, though I did feel a little useless at the one time I'd been debated out wondering what to do now.

Overall I think it'd be an ok change in rare circumstances, I definately wouldn't want to see it as happening often.

Two soverigns of the senile old dog

But there were whole armies of people instead of 10-20 individuals. Killing for goals has less meaning because of the fact you cannot truly eliminate anyone so it should happen even more often, whenever it can help the killer.

You don't need a whole lot of skill to influence. Gregori is only Master Influence. It his CR6 that makes the difference. If you have CR then you have the skills you need. Some people say the higher you are in influence the better you do it. I am not so certain of that, as I haven't had a problem influencing at all other than when I am being debated at the same time as I am influencing.

Eh.. from my experience the CR makes more of a difference. SuperEgo is a nice help if you're really into it, but that doesn't affect influence strength at all.

And actually.. after reviewing the file I don't think the Influence skill helps when village influencing in terms of power boosts. Rather, CR2/4/6 are akin to Begging/Supplication/Wheedling differences where the denizen would get bored of one constant and need an occasional switch to keep interest (Which is why rank is important and it seems like villages take to higher ranked influencers more).

The reason death meaning something matters isn't solely the opportunity to take an enemy out of the action permanently. It also has some impact on what death means. And it affects what you're going to do because your life might matter to you. And to other people. And so on.

The point was, the Crusades is not a relevant comparison; no more and no less.