I agree with Olan. If I were in Celest's place I'd just say '**** it' and surrender. Call it a cease fire, call it 'we're just letting them think they've won so we can regroup and strike them down', call it whatever you want, but things aren't going to get better for Celest if they keep insisting to play the part of the defiant hero.

What good would it do? What good did it do last time there was a ceasefire?

Here. I'll make one for you.

Which accomplishes what, exactly?

That's kind of what Glomdoring did. Has it helped? It hasn't changed the problem. Has it helped the symptoms, for the while it's lasted (which is not likely much longer, it seems)?

Has it helped?

I think it does help. The underlying conflict still exists, and it always will. That's a necessary part of the game design, to which conflict is central. (And the same is true of any competitive game, it's just very talked-about here)

What it does help is that it provides players a "breather" or "time-out" to the conflict. Conflict is inherently taxing, mentally and "physically" (on our Avatars) and after extended periods it takes its toll on us as players. While Magnagora is currently in a dominant military position in Lusternia, I and others enjoyed the cease-fire with Celest in the mining villages and cosmic planes. It allowed us (and Celest) time to concentrate on other aspects of the game that we enjoy and wanted to develop further without having to focus upon our ongoing war effort. An indefinite peace would surely have become stagnant and equally redundant as continuous conflict, but I think it greatly helped re-energize the situation as we were able to jump back into the full swing of things having had time to collect ourselves and refresh ourselves with other activities.

So, in a word, yes, I think it does help.

Wow. Way to go, you sound just like an ungrateful little prat, which I'm sure will inspire the desire in the Administration to try and help. This is partially about roleplay, and that is NOT THEIR JOB TO DO IT FOR US.

As for other parts of the situation, I have noticed a key point. 'It is easier for light to go to taint, but harder for taint to go to light'. I have also noticed the comments about 'Celest does not have enough players, it's not fair Magnagora has more, they should change their RP.'

It seems the inherent problem is the 'Light' being unwilling to take transfers, but then also complaining when they have none.

Nough said.

Edited, to clear up on why I brought up admin and roleplay.

OOC, I very, very much wish that the game could be city vs commune, and not light vs taint. Good verses Evil is the most childish and simple of plots in my eyes - it is NOT interesting. It is, in fact, quite boring. I would NEVER have become interested in Lusternia had I known that the plot boiled down essentially to that. What I loved, and what really, truly interested me, when I first started playing, was that it looked entirely like a true three sided conflict. It wasn't good vs neutral vs evil. It was a group of selfish, power hungry people bent on expanding their personal and organizational power at ANY cost (Magnagora) versus a group of over-zealous people convinced that THEY are right, and everyone else is wrong, and willing to do anything to convince the world of this (New Celest) versus a group of self-righteous, arrogant isolationsists who violently wanted to be left alone (Serenwilde).

To me, this is interesting. All three sides had their good, and had their evil. Glomdoring ruined all of this, in my eyes. Once Glomdoring appeared, we were no longer just a forestal commune. We were the UNTAINTED forestal commune. Suddenly, the entire game polarized - so many people left us for Glom, which immediaetly allied with Mag, that we had to ally with Celest to componsate. Suddenly, it was very clear that, yes, the taint was BAD. It did horrible things to forests. It was our biggest worry. Not the cities - they're all rubble, except for the tainted one. Suddenly, it became all about fighting off the tainted commune, since our entire purpose is to ward the Fae, and to keep our forest from being tainted.

Magnagora should be our worst enemy - they are both a city AND tainted. But there are no quests for us to harm them (well, except one, but that one is impossible now, since they have to provoke it, and they can stop it easily, and they aren't idiots). There is no history and lore that says they must be destoryed. There is for Glomdoring - and we need to answer these calls to duty. Because the game was designed that way. Don't tell me that's BS - it isn't. Once Glomdoring came out, the game was *obviously* aimed to be good verses evil. There just isn't anything apart from the old lore that supports CvC combat over GvE.

Maybe, one day, this will change. All I can say is, I am very, very unhappy with the shift from what the sides were to good vs evil.

For anyone who has played IRE games for any length of time, treaties NEVER work for long. You always have one person from either side (last time I believe it was a celestian, so next will be a Mag) who decides they are a badass and will ruin it for everyone and attacks the other group.

I really don't see how Mag is doing anything wrong, if you want grieving we could be butchering guards daily, raiding celestia by the minute, random killings, and guarding every bashing area. We dont...and this seems to be the first time in a long time where Celestia has been raided at all. It also isn't as though we are just sitting here grunting and raiding as some people think...there is a massive amount of decent planning and strategy if you ever see it on CT and clans.We usually have a main plan, then several distracting tactics which you can clearly see in another thread where Alger posted what happened with the Inner Sea. The spire was getting tainted and to distract from Celest stopping that, there was a raid planned on something else. You will see this all the time in what we do...

If you also look at top guilds, the celestian guilds seem to be getting more novices than the Mag guilds, and many times I only see 7 people in Mag when I'm around. I'll look at Help Mag and see Alger...and then I'll look at Help Celest and see 8 people. If you have numbers like that, you should mount something. Fire off with your numbers, and stop firing off from things like the forums. Plan defense...practice...you have the numbers to get decent.

Belive me, we dont have.

During this event what Alger posted, it was my trying to teleport and summon you, and it was me who was chasing Alger, it was impossible for me to be in two places in one time. Only other who would know what is going on was Ordos ans he was busy in sea with novices that he gathered and sad what they have to do. And most of our novice are love leveld without cr for skills, merian in general who will die in few hits. Avarage citizen of Celest haev around 2k health.
When Lazul, Stagar and Aesyra isnt around i would be one who have most health and then will be long way behind me for others.

Magnagora RP is very good, i dont whine stop riding us. I just would like to see more dedicated people in Celest and we will do better.
Maybe i'm not best fighter, but if i would listen to Ixion and join ur'guards who will be trying to stop you guys?
Say only those that are here often. Dont say Malicia, Narsrim, Munsia and Nejii

You could always go back and read the last 100 posts I wrote on this subject over the past ten months. Clearly, they worked a lot better, eh?

If you've got nothing to say about the content of the post, but only about the tone, then here. I suck. My tone is bad. I'm grumpy. Now that's done, and if you don't have something to contribute to the discussion of how to save Lusternia, you've got no more reason to post here.

I did add something, if you'd bothered to read MY post.

If Celest wants/needs more people, which seems to be a problem here, they're going to need to think on how to make it easier for people to come to them.

Rhysus mentioned it being harder for taint to become light, than light to become taint. I think he should have phrased it as it is harder to switch to Celest than a Celestian trying to switch elsewhere - it is just how it is. People complain about the policy all the time, how long it takes to just talk to people, in fact, to try.

I know there are people who have pondered switching to Celest, I've spoken with many of them. If Celest wants to leave it as is, being difficult to switch to them, that is their choice - but if it is, then they should not complain when they have less people due to the above situation.

I agree that if players have to choose between following their organization's fundamental goals and breaking it totally because of OOG reasons, there's a flaw in design. It ends with nobody being satisified.

I think that there might be too much pressure in Lusternia. The whole environment is very intense, there's constant state of conflict, but it's always the same boring conflict again and again, always for the same reason, which is not even really interesting. Taint must die, Light must die... pah. It makes me look back at tainted fae incident with nostalgia. If only Light and Taint were more questionable... shades of gray, not black and white.

What does really happen? Influencing and raids. Again and again. That would be it.
There should also exist some reasons for everyone, or even at least for two organizations, to work together. But I don't mean treaties in case of war, I mean some completely other goals that does not include harming everyone else in the process.

For example, nobody remembers that Seals are not infinite. We all jump at each other's throats constantly when the most powerful soulless god is waiting to break free. If that danger was more noticeable, maybe some people would stay back from time to time and think that there's something else to worry about, something that's more important then Taint vs Light war. And what to do about it. And I don't mean 2 days of the wild event where everyone goes crazy like in that nasty animation in funnies and logs off totally burned out, but more like adding the feeling of creeping danger, with twists and sparks of action from time to time.

I have always wonderd waht will happen if all nodes on astral will be dreined to null, will Kethuru break free? As nodes are close to null maybe its time for Kethuru to show that he is just waiting for time to break free, i would made rules to not overdraw nodes, nodes could go back to motes/halo and some people could go play with them then just constant thinking how to raid Celest or Celestia

I think the admins will make the game balanced. I could see one of the souless gods destroying Magnagora and its nexus if it became too powerful, then leaving the former Magnagorian's to pick up the pieces somehow. ;-)

Or maybe not.

To be honest, some of what's been said here deals with the problems that people expect when role-playing. Some interpret Serenwilde as being anti-city, thus antagonistic towards the cities. Others interpret it as good vs. evil. And the players tend to argue with others who interpret it differently. Some interpret Celest as being intolerant, others as peacenicks.

For instance, Estarra stated that some rare Viscanti were noble figures. Yet New Celest prevents them from being noble paladins. From what I understand, that was chosen by the players, not in the core guidelines, unless a god was involved. Celest could always choose to remove that. Serenwilde could always choose to ally themselves with Celest, or to break ties.

One question, is the bad guys being more powerful here a spill-over result of Achaea being dominated by the good Shallam, and fans of evil in IRE games coming over here, thus making it more attractive to make evil more dominant here?

Glomdoring coming out did NOT make the game good vs evil. The players made it good vs. evil. When Glomdoring came out is was Celest/Serenwilde vs. Magnagora vs. Glomdoring.(Celest and Serenwilde have been allies since I was in Serenwilde)

Glomdoring kept pushing Magnagora away even though Narsrim and company kept chopping totems lefts and right. Magnagora kept trying to hand Glomdoring villages, and Glomdoring said No, We are going to to this ourselves. Remember the no taint on Ethereal crap? Magnagora finally got fed up and said screw it.

Glomdoring and Magnagora didnt become allies (making it taint vs non taint) until Celestwilde starting pushing them together.

Hell, Glomdoring even said Hey Serenwilde You're a commune too. Let kick the evil cities assess together. The problem is Serenwilde cant see past Glomdoring being tainted to see that it is still a commune. Serenwile even allied with Magnagora early on and its tainted AND a city and you are telling me that they cant ally with a flippin commune?

"You're both called the same thing - start working together, damn it!"

Exactly.

If there is a perception that there is too much unrelentless conflict, are there any solid solutions (rather than just treatises on why we poor admin do such a shoddy job)?

Off the top of my head, my suggestion is we can make it so Supernals, Demon Lords and Nature Avatars are invincible except during certain planetary configurations. (Don't you love astrology?)

What if there were quests that could be done daily to make them stronger. It would cap at a certain point and and lessen until it reached the level they are currently at. This way if the Supernals die it has nothing to do with any one organization being griefers, it would just be the city not caring about their Supernals/Demon Lords/ Nature Avatars. It could be something that even newbies could do so its not monotamous(?) And they wouldnt feel like they have to do it because it takes quite an effort to kill them as is...


P.S. I miss Crow