I was referring to you talking about running through 30 guards as a Mugwump. Of course Titans/Demigods aren't the only problems. Here we have races that lie on the extremes, I.E. extreme constitution levels being the biggest offender (and really only). Not to mention abilities that boost and manipulate health in odd ways, such as surge. In Imperian, a level 100 person, completely outfitted in stat artifacts with say Akrabi as a race, is only like... 500-600 health if I remember right. That's the equivalent of 5000-6000 hp.

These extreme outliers and corner cases make it very difficult to balance across the average. This is a problem Lusternia has always suffered from. Lusternia likes to do things in the extreme.

Though that's really only a problem for guards.
So, instead of saying, Titans and Demigods are a problem for guardraids, you can say guards are the problem for guardraids.

Okay, that sounds stupid.
Basically, what I am saying, Titan and Demigod doesn't mean much if you aren't a fighter. Heck, even as a fighter, it doesn't mean THAT much. Only thing it helps with is writhing and tumbling. Guards are the real problem when it comes to guardbashing raids, they do really small damage.

Titans and demis have an advantage, but tanking is HIGHLY race and more importantly ARCHETYPE related.

Example, Thoros vs me.

Max health: 8425-- tracking warrrior, 116/116 plate
Thoros's health: 4587, nihilist

He takes probably only about 20% of the damage I do, perhaps less. He is not a titan, and utterly owns me in tanking ability. People associate me as a massive tank, but that is, at the moment, solely due to my circle and healing ability.

20% is merely a figure made up on the spot.

However, assuming your health is 8425, you sip for 1091 to 1637 and sparkle for 843. Thoros at 4587 will sip for 630 to 946 and sparkle for 458. This assumes no sip bonuses.

Yes it is, I could certainly get an accurate number when Thoros is available. The fact that he can tank 20 archons indefinately whereas I have no chance or surviving more than a couple rounds speaks for itself.

Athana as a telekinetic took 62% less cold damage as myself, and just about 60%less of physical damage, after significant testing. Thoros blows us both away. It's obvious that he should be tankier than me though, as trackers don't get a single defense outside of fitness (worthless) and field/fullplate.

That would be because kephera give level 3 cutting/blunt protection while still allowing greatrobes to be worn, reducing guard damage to hardly anything.

Kephera + Putre is wicked, or the Kephera racial resistance itself is a bit OP, dunno though.

Thoros had insane physical defense before Kephera - it's why he liked Viscanti for guard killing.

Kephera, with level 3 cutting/blunt resistance, put him over the top.

I also find it funny that they nerfed Dwarves but essentially brought them back. Kephera are the new dwarves. But like I said, everything is an extreme. It creates so many corner cases.

I think the problem is also with guard in general though. If their damage type was really neutral, how can such big differences occur?

If it was unblockable/neutral damage wouldn't that mean that no damage reduction modifier could affect it?

Unblockable and neutral aren't the same. Drawdown/nightkiss reduces "all" damage, presumably including neutral, but not unblockable. For example.

EDIT: The above isn't fact, just speculation, but it makes sense and could account for the discrepancy.

Incorrect.

Viscanti is -horrible- for guard bashing. . . .Your crazy.

Secondly, I have good physical defense as any race, but I have -insane- physical defense as a Kephera. In fact I can only slay guards as Kephera. . .wow.

Even as a Tae'dae I die pretty quick to guards, because my Kephera tactic revolves around hit/drop healer tarot/hit/drop healer tarot/hit/drop healer tarot.

As a Tae'dae. . . . .I die before I recover equilibrium.

Also I don't use putrefaction all the time. Putrefaction -kills- me more than helps me . . .

My total tankiness does not come from my own Archtype skills, surprise surprise. Putre is good protection but the Divine have nerfed it enough where its only good for hardcore bashing where you are going to need to tank alot of things at once for it to have good affect. My total tankiness comes from insane racial resistances that come with no disadvantages, the lame Kephera with greatrobes, Astrology spheres and other buffs that come outside my Archtype skills. As a Mugwump with all my buffs alone (demonscales, putrefaction, symbol) And NOT counting my tanking artifacts (Rune of Absorption, Rune of Shielding) I am very fragile.

Unblockable is the only neutral damage I know of though. Anything else is a 'damage type' and thus races/skills can (and often do) offer resi against it.

Just fix kephera, let them have an exoskeleton like 30/30-40/40 and let them have to molt once a lusty year.... the molt will change the exo-skeleton so they just dont get a capped exoskeleton and keep it. Also give them a disadvantage to being so damn tanky.

That sounds rather neat.

If that's supposed to compare to robe stats that would be horrible horrible greatrobes. So if the ability for them to wear robes gets removed too you'd have successfully broken the race. Congratz.

If it's additionally though I like the idea. Especially the molt thing.. hmm RP.

Otherwise I'd say do this: Let them continue wearing greatrobes BUT the stats of teh greatrobes will ONLY affect wounding reduction and the proofs elemental damage reduction (so splendor wearers don't get shafted). The greatrobe stats will -not- have any effect on the cutting/blunt resist of the kephera.

I like that more than a flat wounding resistance tbh. A flat one can either turn out too much or too little. If it's too much people will cry nerf again, if it's too little the race will suck.

OMFG I DID IT AGAIN!! *cry*

No, it is meant to make the no armor disadvantage actually be a disadvantage. It is not supposed to be as great as the robes, but hell they could make it 40/40-50/50 and that would be fine for low end robe stats. I just wouldn't like to see a molt at 80/80 or something. But as is adding lvl3 blunt/cutting resistance with greatrobes or splendor robes, and no disadvantages make kephera the best choice for tanks in the whole basin. But like I said, maybe make max stats on the exoskeleton 50/50?? Would that seem better?

Not so really... 50/50 is low end ... I agree that level 3 cut/blung + 50+/50+ from robes is probably too much, but making the level 3 cut/blunt about as much as level 1 (-maybe- 2) perhaps AND removing the ability for them to wear any armour at all (including robes) would make them utterly worthless. Their stats are ok, but definitely not worth the loss in the least (and without monks the male stats even suck).

Imagine you had that race with a level 1 cut/blunt resist and the disadvantage of -no- armour at all. Do you seriously think you'd even consider taking it?

I still stick with my suggestion above. *shrug*