Maybe its not right? I have no idea, Athana just did what Daevos requested. I agree that it should be changed though.

You discern:
You are standing in the Village of Rockholm.
This area is under the sphere of influence of the Collective of Serenwilde.Your environment conforms to that of constructed underground.
You are in the Prime Material Plane.
A greater nature elemental is infused in the ground here.

----------

King Thoril is an enormous dwarf, with thick muscles bulging from his neck,
shoulders rounded like twin boulders, and legs like tree stumps. Outfitted in
long chainmail, he has an enormous battleaxe across his knees. A red cloak
rests across his shoulders and a thick chain of gold and platinum is clasped
around his thick neck, emblazoned with rubies, diamonds and emeralds. His bushy
brown beard is hangs past his belly, but fails to hide his prodigious frown.
His eyes are like granite and glare menacingly at those around him. He holds 4
pieces of the Crown of Dwarven Kings in his hands.
Thoril Falgirn, Thane of Rockholm appears to be extraordinarily strong.
He weighs about 252 pounds.
He is loyal to the Collective of Serenwilde.

----------

A pale silver glow radiates out from this fae, accompanied by a sense of cold
and an odd mist that surrounds it. Floating inexplicably in the air, the frost
hag observes the area slowly with strange, ghost-like movements. Looking
similar to a banshee, this fae is ephemeral and bodiless in substance,
appearing as a shade almost out of phase with this realm. Pure black hair waves
lazily in the air as if underwater, hiding the face of the hag as it seems to
flow through the air, ever vigilant.
A frost hag appears to be extraordinarily strong.
She is strangely weightless.
She is loyal to the Collective of Serenwilde.

----------

Look again Revan, see a problem?

That's why people in Serenwilde need to enemy me before I kill the damn guy.

Not at all, Narsrim. Your commune guards in Rockholm should only act if they're facing an enemy, as if they're standing in the commune proper. Rockholm denizens are not Serenwilde denizens. Commune guards are Serenwilde denizens. The dwarfves were protecting Thoril since they're Rockholm denizens, not Serenwilde denizens. No problem at all.

I'm sorry that there is some expectation of people not to abuse what they can, Athana. However, that's something imposed upon all players. Furthermore, let's look at other examples of loyalty:

3471h, 4044m, 3408e, 8p, 23490w x-
ent
The following beings are in your entourage:
A sprite#112505, the mother#112374.
The following players are in your entourage:

3471h, 4044m, 3408e, 8p, 23496w x-
You have recovered equilibrium.

3471h, 4044m, 3408e, 8p, 23496w ex-
kick sprite
You leap into the air and launch a flying kick at a sprite.
You connect!
The mother springs to a sprite's defence.

3471h, 4044m, 3408e, 8p, 23496w e-

---------

The mother is the embodiment of the archetype of all mothers. Her hair is tied back in a bun and she smiles warmly to all around her. She wears a practical floral print dress with a white apron, still dusty with flour from baking. She is pleasantly plump and smells of cookies and milk.
The mother seems to be unafraid.
She weighs about 156 pounds.
She is loyal to Heir of Ellindel, Narsrim D'cente`, Moonlit Avenger.

---------

The sprite and mother share the same loyalty: me. Even if I attack one, the other responds because loyals defend loyals. That's the fundamental concept of the system. You circumvented that...

Narsrim... why should SERENWILDE guards attack people who are killing things that are... NOT SERENWILDE DENIZENS? Dwarves are Rockholm denizens, no matter what village they're influenced by. There.s no circumventing. Stop trying to make stupid excuses.

Revan,

Did you know that Thoril actually requested to have commune guards placed at him? He must be paranoid, I agree; however, he spoke out and requested them. Now, try to tell me again why the guards -he freakin requested- should not defend him if attacked!

Any attempt to argue that commune guards shouldn't assist denizens of the same loyalty is a blatant OOC excuse. Disgusting.

Tell me Narsrim.. will your guards attack someone who is an enemy to the village, but not an enemy to the commune? No. Do you know why? Because they're COMMUNE GUARDS!

Thoril is a Serenwilde loyal. Sorry, it says that on his probe. I'd rather just see this bugged and left alone, but you're on really shaky ground trying to defend it here. Just drop it.

Shiri, Rockholm != Serenwilde. Sorry, but that's the way it is. The loyalty description, I believe, is purely for cosmetic reasons. Rockholm is Rockholm. Serenwilde is Serenwilde. I'm on very solid ground, Shiri.

This is hopeless. You are going to pull whatever it takes out of your bum to try and make a defense for Athana. That's great, you are a nice guy for doing that; however, your rationale is completely void of logic. The dwaves of Rockholm are sworn to oath under Serenwilde. Serenwidle is sworn to the protect the dwarves. Thus, Seren guards would -of course- protect him. This isn't rocket science.

Let's break it down into a real life scenario:

You live in X-town and are visiting NYC. Someone attempts to mug/kill you on the street. Does the NYC police officer who happens to be lucky enough to see this happen wait until you are dead to jump in and try and defend you? I mean, seriously...

NYC Police are, amazingly, stationed in NYC, Narsrim. Good going.

Why did they die to the guards after the death of Thoril? Because they were enemied to the village or to the commune? Or both?

Then tell me what the guards are supposed to be there to protect. Each other?

And no, you're not on solid ground calling the loyalty description "cosmetic." You have no evidence to back that up with.

EDIT: Oh, and there's the whole thing where killing Thoril enemies them to Serenwilde. No, it's not cosmetic. Your arguments're really weak here.

I actually agree that the guards should attack on the first sign of hostility. And if this is in fact a bug, that I really had no idea about I'll accept the consequences. Oh well, life goes on.

Both.

Forget it. It's apparent the elementary idea isn't driving home to you guys. Bug it, and see what happens. I'll be over here laughing at your efforts.

As I have proven with my entourage example above, loyalty works on this principle: loyals defend loyals. There is no other case in Lusternia where you can attack a loyal and another loyal (of the same loyalty) will not defend it.

The problem is this case is that Thoril has multiple loyalties. When he is attacked, the only loyalty that is checked is his primary, permanent loyalty: loyal to rockholm. It should in fact check all loyalities possible.

Your elementary idea Revan boils down to this:

Commune guards will protect a corpse once a dwarf is slain, but will not defend a dwarf while being attacked. If Serenwilde != Rockholm, then they should be no more opt to protect the corpse than the living denizen.

I'd just like to add before asking to have this thread closed that those "generalizations" people seem to draw about Magnagora are certainly not without some amount of absolute truth.