Laa la la....

Edit: Or not, I didn't see the cutoff "not" in his post.

I miss nap time

Me too actually, seriously; it was so sweet to be able to say I was tired and have a sleep whenever I wanted.

You really cannot know unless said novice signs off and never comes back again that that was the only meaning for that novice, and even then you really never know.

We live in a world where novices will pop up suddenly when guilds get a new skill, or when there is an event going on somewhere that may be limited to one nation. In that case those would have to be labeled alt abuse to.

I am all for Grace being made so it can't be used in these types of quests and I'm against using alts to accomplish things your main cannot, which I argued last night also, but was pretty much told to shut up. A few of us though it would be funny to see if things changed all of a sudden if we did the same thing using grace... and it seems it did. So exactly what I suspected would happen, happened.

help seconds
15.3.1 SECOND CHARACTERS

Second characters (and beyond) in Lusternia a are allowed, but a higher standard for roleplaying will generally be imposed upon those who play multiple characters. Furthermore, using one for the purpose of helping the other is not allowed.

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Ethelon has stated quite clearly that he was using his second character for the purpose of collecting Fae to benefit *gasp* Ethelon, the Shadowdancer Champion. This is clearly abuse. I do hope the administration will step up and give a statement, because this is the sort of thing that degrades all other IRE games.

I would like to also state that in the past, Ethelon had suggested to me to create an alt to get the bird out Glomdoring (when it was there), and I should be happy that I had such options available.

At the least, a severe amount of roleplay points should be removed.

There was no exchange in items or money.

This can be said for anyone who has an alt in the same commune or city, for whatever action you do no matter if it is fighting, having a shop, or gathering essence for your commune or city you are indirectly helping your other alt character that is in the same city or commune.

How about you explain what I really said Narsrim. When, as Envoys, we were talking about making the Quest on Faethorn fair, you said it's hard for your side to do it, I said your people could use alts and get away with it. I meant this as a way I felt your side was doing hte quest already, which I told you about. You then told me that you grabbed all the birds yopurself, which after, I never brought it up again. Why do you have to twist words to make it look like I was telling you to cheat. Also, I argued this same damn point with Lisaera about alt abuse and was told it was not abuse. I proved my point and I hope the divine fix this crap.... you know, since your side has been for days now.


EDIT: removed my mean comment.

help seconds
15.3.1 SECOND CHARACTERS

Second characters (and beyond) in Lusternia a are allowed, but a higher standard for roleplaying will generally be imposed upon those who play multiple characters. Furthermore, using one for the purpose of helping the other is not allowed.



There is nothing that states a physical exchange of items must take place to "help" your other character. It states any sort of "help" is abuse.

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Whereas I would agree, it may seem cloudy if you create a second character who has similar interests as your other, Ethelon has -specifically- stated he created the character to do the quest. I think what must be considered is this (and this would have to be case-by-case):

Is Ethelon's second character doing the quest -for- himself or doing it -for- Ethelon (who was currently at that time unable to do it)? This is not an easy decision to make in most cases, but it is rather simple when someone says that they created a character for one purpose: to hide behind grace and do a quest that the other could not.

Narsrim, please man, read above. I did this with the intention of showing how wrong it was and came here right away to show it. If I really wanted to continue to do this I'd just make alts and do so. I'm trying to point out the corruption here and you are trying to make it seem like I absued seconds.

Ethelon, I made it quite clear to you at that time that i was utterly disgusted that you would even -mention- creating an alt to by pass guards to do a quest. I told you quite clearly that I had more respect for Narsrim IC and Ethelon IC as well to stoop to such abuse.

Low and behold, you turn around and create an alt to "prove" this. It is entirely possible you had good intentions, but it looks very shady. I don't understand why you, or anyone, who wished to be taken seriously would pull a stunt like this (and then complain about Lisaera). You are seriously digging a hole and it is getting deeper-and-deeper.

If it was *wrong* Ethelon, you had *no* reason to do it. Two wrongs don't make a right. There are lots of people who volunteer to ensure that Lusternia is handled in a respectable fashion. If Lisaera (and this is assuming everything you said was true) would not listen to you, there was nothing stopping you from emailing Estarra directly. There are appropriate means to handle concerns. This was not one of them.

I am curious about one point that has been missed. What would you have done if your grace had -not- been removed. Logged off? I would like to hope in a perfect world that is exactly what you would do. However, I do not live in a perfect world. Maybe one day though!

Estarra already knew of this and heard the argument I had with Lis. Sometimes two wrongs do make a right, such as in this case. Look, when your alts were doing this...it was overlooked, even though it was mentioned here. Now that Ethelon does it, it's VERY wrong, bad, bad! So, my wrong, in responce to the other wrong...has hopefully made a right? Well, that's what I'm hoping for atleast. If I really meant to do something Shady Narsrim, would I have come here to prove the point I was intending?

To make my point more clear. Your claim is you did this, just to find out if anything would happen. Not so that you could abuse something you considered an abuse already. The moment you found out however did you leave? No. In fact you left my demesne with your collected Fae and proceeded to seek more Fae, entering three more times in fact. It wasn't until I killed you that you finally remained out. You even chose to play dumb with me when I told you to leave 3 times.

You can cry foul all you want. Apparently someone realised what you were doing though and considered -that- to be abuse. AS I said Grace, and Grace of Innocense are not the same thing. The one wears off, the other gives you unlimited protection so you can abuse a quest. I am glad you got caught, personally. I hope this is watched for more in the future too.

I only intended to do it this once to see what happened. I was even planning on being annoying, but didn't expect the grace to be removed, was just going to piss off you guys off doing the quest so it would be whined about here. didn't work like I though, but something happened. And to make this clear, I don't mean to imply here that Lisaera was the one who did this... it could have been a fluke. Or maybe the divine made the quest take away grace now... either way, I hope this fixes things.

I think you came here to flame Lisaera - end of story.

However, I'd love for you to name one of those "alts" that got away with it. I defend Faethorn daily. I have yet to see anyone there who was not an active, fully ranked Moondancer/Hartstone/Serenguard.

Thank you captain obvious, look, you said exactly what I've been saying. To be clear also, Grace was removed before I did anything other than pick up a honeycake.