Unknown2005-08-13 20:25:30
I've heard a lot of different opinions regarding people who do conflict quests while graced, be that by normal grace or grace of innocence, with a focus on what happens in Faethorn these days.
A large number of players seems to have serious issues with it, others feel it is ok, the administration seems to condone and actually encourage it because it means solving the conflict quests without violence.
What do you think?
Feel free to elaborate on your vote!
A large number of players seems to have serious issues with it, others feel it is ok, the administration seems to condone and actually encourage it because it means solving the conflict quests without violence.
What do you think?
Feel free to elaborate on your vote!
Vix2005-08-13 21:14:50
Most definently abuse.
Xenthos2005-08-13 21:30:38
Reason for it: It allows novices to do something to help the entire commune, things that even the stronger players have some issues with. It brings in power, it gives them karma, gold, and experience, and raises champions, which helps give them a slightly closer tie to the commune and may help them to stick around longer.
Reason against it: There is NO way to stop them. At all. Except to annoy the heck out of them until they quit for good.
Reason against it: There is NO way to stop them. At all. Except to annoy the heck out of them until they quit for good.
Unknown2005-08-13 21:49:14
Abuse.
Vix2005-08-13 21:53:38
How could anyone -not- think it abuse? 
Unknown2005-08-13 23:35:56
I've asked the admins (well, actually I asked whether they could do something about someone who was doing the quest graced at that moment), and what they said basically summed up to "it is not abuse, it is a way to do the quest without violence". (If I am wrong, please correct me)
Anyway, just to make sure, I'm not complaining about the admin or posting this thread out of some sort of "how dare they" or "wtf" notion, I'm just curious about what other people think of the issue itself.
Anyway, just to make sure, I'm not complaining about the admin or posting this thread out of some sort of "how dare they" or "wtf" notion, I'm just curious about what other people think of the issue itself.
Vesar2005-08-14 00:01:46
I voted that it was abuse, and that the admins should do something about it.
It's one thing to be able to do standard quests graced. I'm fine with that. It's quite another to do conflict quests which harm/help an organization while graced.
I've seen this problem with other quests not involving the Faethorn, as well, and I was sick of it there, too.
It's one thing to be able to do standard quests graced. I'm fine with that. It's quite another to do conflict quests which harm/help an organization while graced.
I've seen this problem with other quests not involving the Faethorn, as well, and I was sick of it there, too.
Unknown2005-08-14 00:40:14
When the quest is so pivotal it is most surely abuse. They wouldn't let me go destroy spikes in Magnagora while graced (I don't think...) so why should people be allowed to collect Fae while graced?
Olan2005-08-14 01:00:16
They are CONFLICT quests. When you choose to do them, you are involving yourself in CONFLICT. You should not be allowed to then choose to be immune to methods of conflict 'resolution,' like being killed.
Pacifism is not something to hide behind. Pacifists are not IMMUNE to attack IRL, I see no reason game mechanics should help them. People who want to 'grow up early' and participate in conflict should have to give up their innocence and accept the consequences.
And if that rules out too many quests, maybe we need more quests that AREN'T conflict quests?
Pacifism is not something to hide behind. Pacifists are not IMMUNE to attack IRL, I see no reason game mechanics should help them. People who want to 'grow up early' and participate in conflict should have to give up their innocence and accept the consequences.
And if that rules out too many quests, maybe we need more quests that AREN'T conflict quests?
Unknown2005-08-14 07:53:18
I personally think the players should deal with it but of course that's only really possible if the admin don't condone that usage of grace.
Estarra2005-08-14 07:58:49
QUOTE(David @ Aug 13 2005, 01:25 PM)
the administration seems to condone and actually encourage it because it means solving the conflict quests without violence.
Don't be an ass. That's never what we've said.
Ialie2005-08-14 08:36:28
You guys should be ashamed, you guys made Estarra say ass.
Shame
Shame
Shame
Bloody Shite Shame!
(Wouldn't it be funny if Nejii censored it?
)
Shame
Shame
Shame
Bloody Shite Shame!
(Wouldn't it be funny if Nejii censored it?
)Unknown2005-08-14 08:44:21
QUOTE(Estarra @ Aug 14 2005, 09:58 AM)
Don't be an ass. That's never what we've said.
166377
looks like I stand corrected...
I can't give you a quote but I quite clearly remember Lisaera saying it was a good thing people were doing it that way because it reduces violence, back in the heated debate, if you remember...
Sorry if something about that is incorrect. I'm only going by what I've been told.
Shiri2005-08-14 08:54:51
QUOTE(Lisaera)
It's difficult to define grace abuse, as essentially the only way to abuse grace is to do something offensive and aggressive while graced (ie. find some way to attack or harm others, this is abuse because you can't be attacked or harmed yourself).
As an example, if someone managed to get an aggro tracking mob to follow them while in grace and ran into a populated area. Obviously the mob would stop following if said person were killed, but it would be impossible to do so as they're graced, meanwhile it proceeds to murder a bunch of people (this is a trick that was sometimes done in Achaea).
It's not an excellent example, and the truth is true instances of grace abuse are few and far between. However, I'm not going to say grace abuse doesn't exist, as I know if there is anything players are good at, it is breaking/abusing things.
As an example, if someone managed to get an aggro tracking mob to follow them while in grace and ran into a populated area. Obviously the mob would stop following if said person were killed, but it would be impossible to do so as they're graced, meanwhile it proceeds to murder a bunch of people (this is a trick that was sometimes done in Achaea).
It's not an excellent example, and the truth is true instances of grace abuse are few and far between. However, I'm not going to say grace abuse doesn't exist, as I know if there is anything players are good at, it is breaking/abusing things.
I think that's the quote you're looking for? Doesn't look like encouraging to me, but I can see why you would make that mistake because by the terms of the first paragraph doing that quest isn't "aggressive" or "hostile" and therefore isn't abusing grace. So it doesn't look like it's that bad either.
Unknown2005-08-14 08:56:14
No, it was a conversation on a different medium, which is why I can't quote too, I forgot to save a log.
