Is that.. a joke?

Psh, I could only find that as a tactic for the celestians to use to kill someone

edit: I remember one time when Magngora was raiding celest, I was amissio once by Elaria and then Aesyra and finally absolved by Amaru, unavoidable in team combat!

Relax surge.

Sip mana.

How is a (20% + 1000) mana drain an unavoidable absolve? Here you are missing one of the distinctions. Cruficy/trample/sacrifice would kill a Demigod with a perfect system. Amissio amissio absolve wouldn't even kill me.

I don't have surge up when I fought celestines, and they did 800-1000 per amissio

Perhaps in single combat it wouldn't kill you, but in team combat so many variables could be included into stopping you from moving or drinking mana. My point is, team combat changes the way teams have to think to kill the strongest fighters.

edit" I have 3000 mana and all a celestine will need is 1500 mana before i'm dead from Aboslve. Two amissios will bring me down to 50 percent mana and I wouldn't knew what hit me

Shiro, the whole point is that unavoidable is utterly unavoidable.

Any sort of amissio situation like that could be escaped by a variety of different quick-escape plans.

I agreed something might be done, however I brought up an example of team combat making things harder then one on one.

I'm not going to "take sides" here and I am particularly uninterested in the argument about whether there are other combos that are like this one, but I do think it'd be good if people were reminded what the point was. It's not that a combo is "cheap" or "effective" but simply whether there is no counter to it.

There are lots of combos that are hugely effective, and maybe very cheap, starting from having two newbies constantly webbing while a third person attacks, and working up from there. Maybe you like that those things exist and maybe you don't.

But almost every one you can come up with, no matter how effective it is, has something someone could do to avoid it. Some skill they might have trained up to get, some reaction they would have to do quickly enough, some counterattack that they could use to disrupt it, some artifact that gives them a way to escape it.

Those who are saying that the above sentence should have the "almost" removed, that every combo should have at least some tiny option for escape if you are sufficiently prepared and react just right and quickly enough, I can sympathize with that. And that remains true even if someone claims that another completely-inescapable combo exists -- just means there's others that also need fixing.

So what we really need now that I haven't seen anyone address is, was there some way that Amaru could have escaped, if he had some skill he doesn't have, or had reacted a different way than he did, or if one of his companions had done something differently than they did? If there really is no answer to that, then this combo needs adjustment. If there is an answer, but it's very hard, not available to everyone, etc., then we're fine.

That's a simple enough question and there's nothing vague and slippery about it like "balancing team combat". It's just the principle that everything should have a counter. That principle runs through 99.9% of IRE's design, and I think that proves that it's a principle with precedent that should be followed. So maybe if we can focus on that question instead of the whole "cheap!" red herring, this thread can be useful.

Amaru, you keep dramming about unavoidable, but it isn't unavoidable, just bloody restore.

I can't even apply mending while crucified, do you really think I can restore? Last time I checked restore even takes balance, which you don't have while writhing from a cross.

In that case, because you're not writhing off the cross, they can just... trample again. Sylphas showed that the restore equilibrium time with 4 limbs broken is 9 seconds. I'm sure that's longer than the trample balance time.

Heh, trust me... if there were a way to escape this, I'd shut up and do it. I wouldn't have made this thread.

Dude, you don't writhe from the cross, you restore, THEN you writhe from it.

You can restore while crucified.

And Shamarah, if they have to stand there crucifying and trampling half an hour while you're restoring, it can hardly be called an instakill anymore.

IT IS NOT UNAVOIDABLE.

He'd trample again, surely? Restore is just the slowest ability....

Edit- I'll look into that.

IIRC trample takes 8 seconds, restore takes 9.

Trample is 5-6 with no modifiers.

See, if you have to trample and restore back and forth for ages, it's no more unavoidable than shieldstunning or bellow-whoring while the second man beats on you.

I'm just kind of disgusted that the ones whoring their own cheap tricks everyday, make such a fuss when they face their own medicine. Yes it's cheap, annoying, and hard to avoid, though not impossible, but so is your own stuff, which you happily use in any situation you can.

oi, stop nerfing my crucify without adding in a change to make it usefull, have some objectivity.

Also, hiner/trueheal/soulless is also very very very very very CHEAP not to mention you have a damn blackout pet that hits before your angel effectivly masking every angel afliction you give plus a good length blackout. Not being offensive but dude you have to lose the treuheal offense combo.

*poof*