Envoy Changes

by Xenthos

Back to Common Grounds.

Terenas2005-09-15 06:02:59
QUOTE(Shorlen @ Sep 15 2005, 05:48 AM)
What does Shine actually increase, damage wise? All attack skills? I've never used it because it lasts just a few seconds.
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Shine lasts for 3 minutes, and goes through all the phases, with 8 moon phases that comes out to be ~23 seconds per phase. It is not a few seconds.
Hajamin2005-09-15 06:07:24
QUOTE(geb @ Sep 15 2005, 02:54 PM)
Do you even know the skills you work on? You can hit with 2 afflictions and damage. The affliction skills can only be used on Substratus and Id. The damage is only allowable on the Superstratus channel.

Did you play in other IRE realms before helping with the coding in this game? If so, did you actually participate in the combat aspect of the game?
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I have played on all but Imperian, and been a decent combatant in one and a top level combatant in another. Perhaps you're looking at things wrong... 2 afflictions at a time, plus all types of damage. They have to cure something, normally health. Guess what, you have an ego instant kill.

Round one:
Substratus, SuperStratus, Id (affliction, damage, affliction)
<4 seconds later>
Substratus (affliction)

Id (affliction)

Substratus, Superstratus (affiction, damage)

Id (afliction)
<1-2 seconds later>
Substratus (affliction)
...

Plus your demesne effects.
Shiri2005-09-15 06:07:59
QUOTE(terenas @ Sep 15 2005, 07:02 AM)
Shine lasts for 3 minutes, and goes through all the phases, with 8 moon phases that comes out to be ~23 seconds per phase. It is not a few seconds.
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Really? I know it used to be like that, but it seemed like it got shorter when I tested it against Thaemorn just then. I wasn't timing it, I guess. My bad.
Narsrim2005-09-15 06:12:42
QUOTE(Shorlen @ Sep 15 2005, 01:48 AM)
What does Shine actually increase, damage wise? All attack skills? I've never used it because it lasts just a few seconds.
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From testing a long time ago, these are the rough percentages that I came up with but they are probably good +/- 1 or 2%.

Waxing Crescent - +3% damage
First Quarter - +6% damage
Waxing Gibbous - +12% damage
Full Moon - +12% damage and +12% armour
Waning Gibbous - +12% armour
Last Quarter - +6% armour
Waning Crescent - +3% armour
New Moon - the moon shine dies away

-------------------

And yes, it should increase damage for anything... it used to last 3.5 minutes.
Narsrim2005-09-15 06:20:58
I just tested shine again. It lasted 3 minutes and 30 seconds.
Geb2005-09-15 06:26:51
QUOTE(Hajamin @ Sep 15 2005, 07:07 AM)
I have played on all but Imperian, and been a decent combatant in one and a top level combatant in another.  Perhaps you're looking at things wrong...  2 afflictions at a time, plus all types of damage.  They have to cure something, normally health.  Guess what, you have an ego instant kill.

Round one:
Substratus, SuperStratus, Id
<4 seconds later>
Substratus

Id

Substratus, Superstratus

Id
<1-2 seconds later>
Substratus
...
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That can only be accomplished by the cheap use of debating (which I have asked to be changed). If you were a top combatant, you would know that being off-balance for 8-seconds is lunacy, when you can accomplish the same thing in 3 seconds. You would also know that 8 seconds is plenty of time to heal the damage given by Mindblast and a demesne.

I seriously doubt your claim of being a top fighter on Achaea or Aetolia, and would challenge you if you were willing to prove it there. Seriously, you are a guy that thinks hidden paralysis and reckless are hard to detect. Do you know that they can be detected instantly?

Yes, all of that time you are stuck in one spot. Not mobile at all, not able to move immediately if you have to. It is the perfect time to fling soulless, after the stupid mage used a skill on the Superstratus channel.

It is not all about standing in one spot flinging ineffective afflictions that lead to no type of venom-lock. You do understand that don't you? The best the afflictions are used for are harassment. They will never lead to the death of any competent healer. Using an effect on the Superstratus channel and then flinging easily detected and cured afflictions is just asking to be killed.

I will tell you this, let a dumb mage use the combination you put up there. Right after he used Mindblast, I would focus body to cure the paralysis, walk out of the room (he can’t move you know). Staff his dumb arse to death. If I were a warrior, I would lunge head, lunge head, lunge head, lunge head for the win! If I were a guardian, I would use the ability to boost up my speed, and then quickly work his mana down for the win. Plenty of options to use, when you know the fool can’t move, nor shield.
Narsrim2005-09-15 06:30:40
I honestly feel that it has its place. Whereas I would agree that it might not be the best attack to use just standing around in the open, if timed with a demesne (such as the prone/stun), it could be worthwhile
Hajamin2005-09-15 06:39:26
QUOTE(geb @ Sep 15 2005, 03:26 PM)
I will tell you this, let a dumb mage use the combination you put up there. Right after he used Mindblast, I would focus body to cure the paralysis, walk out of the room (he can’t move you know). Staff his dumb arse to death. If I were a warrior, I would lunge head, lunge head, lunge head, lunge head for the win! If I were a guardian, I would use the ability to boost up my speed, and then quickly work his mana down for the win. Plenty of options to use, when you know the fool can’t move, nor shield.
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You die to 2 staff casts? You have 12 power to lunge 4 times? You can drop someone from full mana to half in 3 attacks? Atleast you didn't say soulless this time, as that ofcourse has an 8.5 second timer, not 8 seconds.
Ceres2005-09-15 06:44:21
QUOTE(Hajamin @ Sep 15 2005, 06:39 AM)
You have 12 power to lunge 4 times?
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laugh.gif
Geb2005-09-15 06:46:38
QUOTE(Hajamin @ Sep 15 2005, 07:39 AM)
You die to 2 staff casts?  You have 12 power to lunge 4 times?  You can drop someone from full mana to half in 3 attacks?  Atleast you didn't say soulless this time, as that ofcourse has an 8.5 second timer, not 8 seconds.
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Lunge only takes 2 power Hajamin. That is a total cost of 8 not 12 power. It only takes me 1.5 seconds to focus body out of paralysis. That leaves me with 6.5 seconds to move out of the room and staff. That is 3 point staff attacks for my mugwumpness. Yes, mages can die in 3 staffs if they are unable to shield. Can sneak in 4, if the person does not shield immediately upon regaining the Superstratus channel.

Knowing the guy only has .5 seconds to react, after regaining the Superstratus channel will most assuredly convince me to sling that soulless card.
Gregori2005-09-15 06:51:04
QUOTE(Hajamin @ Sep 15 2005, 12:39 AM)
You die to 2 staff casts?  You have 12 power to lunge 4 times?  You can drop someone from full mana to half in 3 attacks?  Atleast you didn't say soulless this time, as that ofcourse has an 8.5 second timer, not 8 seconds.
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2 staff casts = 2000+ damage on me, not enough to kill me, but likely I am not far from it

12 power to lunge is easy for any top fighter, you can regen 2 power in the time it takes you to lunge 3 times, giving you the 4th.

3 Amissios is more than enough to take me to half mana most times if I am also healing health.

EDIT:: See I didn't know the cost for lunge. However 12 power to lunge is still easily done. tongue.gif
Narsrim2005-09-15 07:08:56
With illusionary phantom, illusionary stars, illusionary wounds, reality, full demesne (prone, stun, damage, freezing), two afflictions (like stupidity/paralyse, hallucination/epilepsy), and 800 health/mana/ego all at once that fire off with the stun.... that doesn't sound too bad to me.

That's like 5 afflictions at once plus we are talking over 1k health damage, 700-800 mana/ego. The down time in between mind blasts isn't really that bad when you factor in a 1-2 second stun where you are getting unloaded with afflictions. Plus, phantom/reality help with amplify phobia since they generate their own. Thus, you could do like amplify/stupidity and count on those two to deliver the inital phobias.

If you wan't to get real technical, you could start off forcing someone to smoke a pipe with weed. The spam from this and illusionary stars would be unreal.
Geb2005-09-15 07:21:27
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Sep 15 2005, 08:08 AM)
With illusionary phantom, illusionary stars, illusionary wounds, reality, full demesne (prone, stun, damage, freezing), two afflictions (like stupidity/paralyse, hallucination/epilepsy), and 800 health/mana/ego all at once that fire off with the stun.... that doesn't sound too bad to me.

That's like 5 afflictions at once plus we are talking over 1k health damage, 700-800 mana/ego.
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Illusionary stars do not effect anyone with a system; you ought to know that Narsrim. Phantom gives one affliction or binding. Only binding is bothersome to anyone. Prone, stun, damage, and freezing. Well a person who knows how to heal will only come out of the situation shivering at most. Simply concentrate and sip frost. Stupidity/paralysis can easily be cured at the same time. Eat pennyroyal for stupidity, and focus body for paralysis. 1k health damage over the next 8 second period can easily be cured with regen, sip, and an active heal if you possess the skill. You timed all of that, and the person has completed his cures in two seconds after the stun was done (being generous for you). That leaves 4 seconds where the person can act against you. Not too bad, but you will not kill a competent healer that way.

Here is a better combo Narsrim. Phantoms, staff, staff, staff, demesne effects hit, stupidity/paralysis, recover 4 to 5 seconds later, staff, staff, staff or even better (and immensely cheap) debate his sorry behind if he does not have a shattered ego. Why use an ability that will lock you into place for 8-seconds, when you can accomplish the goal a lot easier and safer using other abilities?

Your way, 1000 health damage and a bit of ego and mana damage. My way, over 5000 health damage in the same time period.
Murphy2005-09-15 07:24:14
oi quit raggin on hajamin here, its not excatly fair. He put in some serious hours here and sure, he's allowed to make the odd mistake.

The decisions to nerf or boost things aren't necessarily HIS, yet he defends them like a loyal IRE admin should!

You ungrateful censor.gif !

EDIT: Watch your language. ~Shiri~
Narsrim2005-09-15 07:25:58
QUOTE(geb @ Sep 15 2005, 03:21 AM)
Illusionary stars do not effect anyone with a system; you ought to know that Narsrim. Phantom gives one affliction or binding. Only binding is bothersome to anyone. Prone, stun, damage, and freezing. Well a person who knows how to heal will only come out of the situation shivering at most. Simply concentrate and sip frost.  Stupidity/paralysis can easily be cured at the same time. Eat pennyroyal for stupidity, and focus body for paralysis. 1k health damage over the next 8 second period can easily be cured with regen, sip, and an active heal if you possess the skill. You timed all of that, and the person has completed his cures in two seconds after the stun was done (being generous for you). That leaves 4 seconds where the person can act against you. Not too bad, but you will not kill a competent healer that way.

Here is a better combo Narsrim. Phantoms, staff, staff, staff, demesne effects hit, stupidity/paralysis, recover 4 to 5 seconds later, staff, staff, staff or even better (and immensely cheap) debate his sorry behind if he does not have a shattered ego. Why use an ability that will lock you into place for 8-seconds, when you can accomplish the goal a lot easier and safer using other abilities?

Your way, 1000 health damage and a bit of ego and mana damage. My way, over 5000 health damage in the same time period.
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I think it is fair to bear in mind that you staff cast is a lot better than most. Plus, you seem to tank better than any mage I know. Most people would need the extra hindering rather than being able to whore the damage.
Geb2005-09-15 07:28:40
QUOTE(Murphy @ Sep 15 2005, 08:24 AM)
oi quit raggin on hajamin here, its not excatly fair. He put in some serious hours here and sure, he's allowed to make the odd mistake.

The decisions to nerf or boost things aren't necessarily HIS, yet he defends them like a loyal IRE admin should!

You ungrateful wankers!
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No problem with defending the company line. Still should know what he is talking about, before he comes out speaking as a representative for his company. Also, as a financial supporter, I feel I am entitled to praise and criticize.
Geb2005-09-15 07:35:13
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Sep 15 2005, 08:25 AM)
I think it is fair to bear in mind that you staff cast is a lot better than most. Plus, you seem to tank better than any mage I know. Most people would need the extra hindering rather than being able to whore the damage.
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What extra hindering are you talking about? My combo supplied the same amount of hindering as yours did. It also would supply anyone using staff or blast with more damage than your combo would. Last, it would give the person an easier out if things go bad, because the person has a faster recovery on each action he or she does using my combo than yours. The person could easily shield, web, or run if he or she needed to. In your combo, that person is unable to do any of those until he regains balance back on the Superstratus channel.

Anyone using my combo would generate more damage than the combo you put up there would. Anyone using my combo would have the ability to hinder easier than the combo you supplied would. Your combo is just all around inferior to the one I put up there.
Murphy2005-09-15 07:36:17
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Sep 15 2005, 12:22 PM)
Would someone post about Succumb? I'm curious.
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this is the second or third time you've posted about finding out about succumb. It's not being realsed except to those in glomdoring

if you want to abuse an alt do so, otherwise just wait for it to happen to you and find out like that.
Narsrim2005-09-15 07:38:27
QUOTE(Murphy @ Sep 15 2005, 03:36 AM)
this is the second or third time you've posted about finding out about succumb. It's not being realsed except to those in glomdoring

if you want to abuse an alt do so, otherwise just wait for it to happen to you and find out like that.
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Second or third? I asked you once. I posted once.

1 post != 2 or 3 posts.
Unknown2005-09-15 07:39:06
QUOTE(Gregori @ Sep 15 2005, 02:51 AM)
2 staff casts = 2000+ damage on me, not enough to kill me, but likely I am not far from it

12 power to lunge is easy for any top fighter, you can regen 2 power in the time it takes you to lunge 3 times, giving you the 4th.

3 Amissios is more than enough to take me to half mana most times if I am also healing health.

EDIT:: See I didn't know the cost for lunge. However 12 power to lunge is still easily done. tongue.gif
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Thaemorn and I were testing Lash, I needed my health down a bit, he cudgeled me twice, and I had to use waxing because it almost killed me (and ya, I had clotting reflexes so the bleeding wasn't the main problem) I just have far to little health unsure.gif


Edit:ah ya but anyway, it seems Lash healing was increased from 200 to 270, a nice little minor change, but won't really effect anything fighting wise.