bah, i hate being bad at saying what i mean, i've felt this way all along

I say:
Remove the stun from knockdown.

This places more emphasis on getting legbreaks to keep them down, and lessens the effectiveness of the knockdown/smitedown which makes bashbrains so trivial to get, due obviously to parry not being possible while prone.

whats the point of knockdown is they can't stand up straight away afterwards??

If you want to remove knockdown, then better make breaklegs and manglelegs a jab, breakleg at medium and mangle at heavy

I didn't suggest removing knockdown, merely the stun.

Wound states are irrelevant, since you get any of my bodyparts to critical with two crushes.

I'm going to assume that says, "What's the point of knockdown if they can stand up straight away afterwards?"

They can't. If they start out off-balance or off-equilibrium or whatever. Which they should be unless you've been stunning them with a billion and one other things anyway. :/

no shiri, if they are playing defensive or healing you can get them on eq a lot of times, and either way mostly they will be prone for about 1 second or less whilw waiting for balance or EQ

just about every IRE skill that makes people prone has a stun attached, knockdown will be worthless without the stun of knocking off balacne

the real problem here is breaknose, nothing more

Is that 'Murphy' can make you critical in two blows or 'bonecrushers' can? There's a big difference there.

Edit: I have a question for all those who think Bonecrusher is overpowered, except for the stun of break nose. Have you fought a Bonecrusher without artifact weapons, or the speed to quickly kill you? Even with break nose, I have trouble against guardians because they will hinder me quickly with web. Bonecrusher overall isn't overpowered, just the break nose stun we been trying to tell you. Please wait for it to be changed before calling something which isn't overpowered is.

Anyone with 190+ precision weapons.

If Murphy can, any bonecrusher with the proper weapons/runes/skills/race/etc can. It's not like Murphy has some uber-l337 Murphy aura that makes him do a bonus in wounding/damage.

ahh yeh shamarah I do

250 precision weapons

nuff said

Murphy, you do know that your post does nothing to disprove what Shamarah said?

yeh, geb i do

-heartstop-

1977h, 1860m, 1860e, 0p elrx-
SUMMON MURPHY AURA

Cwin quickly lifts up a can of Harden-up and gulps it down without a breath. With a roar, she grows into three times her size while demons clammer down from Nil to hand her gleaming hammers of gold.
51977h, 7860m, 2860e, 90p elrx-

Cwin swings a gleaming hammer of gold at you. You are sliced in the chest for a
small surface wound.
You are OWNED by Cwin.



Just HAD to.

Ok, that out of my system, I had assumed that a system is judged as balanced when compared to people with Trans skills and no artifacts, thus why I asked if any bonecrusher (read: nonartied) could do what Ceres mentioned.

I guess what I'm getting at is, since the complaints seem to come from Breaknose and Chest's stun, and since EVERYONE is agreeing that it needs to change, why the further arguments? Why not change those THEN look to see if further change is needed?

i can assume changes are being looked at, patiernce

Yeah, but it makes the second swing unblockable if you prone them even if you don't stun. That's what the skill's for, I'd think. Not keeping them down long enough to let you have another full combo that they can't block. I mean, it's a jab, and you can get it at relatively light wounds (I'm not sure what the actual wound state is, but every bonecrusher I've fought is able to get me with it on their first hit.)

its at medium

And forgive me shiri, but my offence revoles around using off timed swings, There is no good reason to have knockdown become useless, if you are defensive you can stand up right away, rendering the best part of our offence (using arms on split balance rather than DSL) inoperable

But if you're trying to fight back, you can't?

EDIT: And macros beat out triggers, definitely.

Then I guess I can get that aura and beyond, because I could easily change class and purchase the items needed to accomplish the same thing. Essentially what Shamarah was saying is that there is nothing special about it, since it can be accomplished by anyone with the same items and skillset. But, if it makes you feel big you can go on and feel like it makes you special.

don't be an ass geb, I take pride in my weapons as it took me ages to forge

stop being an asshole really. There is something special about it I feel, and I take pride in it