Well, he asked me to post it, I did.

Just some thoughts:

1. It would make more since for Flow to be in Wicca than Druidry if we are going to change it. The mechanic of flow is that you embrace the spirit of the forest and flow through it from one location to another. Go figure, the spirits of the forest also have a name: Fae. I see no reason, however, to move it.

2. The mass group transportation has got to go for teleport and summon skills. It shouldn't be possible in any shape or form to either transport and army (like with Flow) or summon an army (like with Demesne Summon).

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As Thorgal has suggested, I wouldn't mind Via working in an Urban area if the person was not enemied to the urban area it was being used in. Thus, no one could Via to you in your own city, village, etc to get you. However just like I'm suggesting with Flow, it should take only the caster and not the 200 people following the caster.

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And as for Flow, I'd like to point out that Bonds in Night does stop it, so there is actually another limitation that has to be considered. While it may be expensive to use, if you are trying to hold down an area, bonds with brumetower will do it nicely.

Aye. I'm just responding to the suggestion.

Moonbeam is nothing like Flow really, aside from being a movement skill. Taking Flow away from Wiccans would be a huge nerf to their travel ability.

Well, but at least you'd still have one. *shrug* And it wouldn't be that bad if it would be made continent-wide.

All Geomancers and Aquamancers have is really only in their demesne, summon and travel, both with a powercost and pretty screwy.

I think every class should have at least one transport ability without powercost, so the powercost from Bond unite should be taken away, let druids have flow without power, Moondancers get Moonbeam continent wide, Sacrament users get Via.
Aquamancers and Geomancers get a skill that lets them travel through earth/air.

Maybe move flow into Stag/Crow and give Night a skill ike Moonbeam. Voila, every class has its own travel abilities.

Leave flow where it is.

Perhaps remove the ability to flow with entourages (except others who have flow) as you are shedding your physical form and moving in spirit, it's difficult to follow that.

Beckoning someone should bring in their entourages- after all, they are walking, everyone following is still following.

You can't remove all forms of following through induced movement, those that are PHYSICAL movement *should* be followed. "Hey, guys, I'm walking off. You're following me, right? Hey, well, just for a change, don't this time!"

It seems a little odd to compare Via to Flow. Doesn't any such comparison completely ignore the following balance? -


Cities:
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Cities in general are better at bringing enemies to them: Two examples being:
- demesne summon
- beckon

Cities can demesne summon any raiders into guards and a statue. This allows a single mage to defend an entire village by pulling raiders into guards+statue while the remaining defenders arrive. Consequently, city defenders don't need to arrive as quickly.

This relies on a mage to demesne and watch the village. However, raiders are at a disadvantage because most will die if summoned into a statue + guards.

Via is in addition to all of the above.


Communes:
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Communes in general are better at going to their enemies: Two examples being:
- flow
- moonbeam

Commune summons are stopped by monoliths. Hence the need to go to the raider, with additional defenders in tow.

Unlike demesne summon, the raider chooses the location, which decreases the support defenders will have from guards and (especially) statues.


Summary:
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In both of the above cases, the raider can avoid the summon/flow by:
- Removing himself from the environment
- Removing the environment (melding)

All of the above assumes that instant summons are left as they are.

If instant summons are re-addressed as Daevos suggested, then the above balance would also have to change.

If you see an angel beckon your friend, and he walks off towards it with a glassy stare, you'd have to be an idiot to follow him.

*Ooooh....shiney Angel...*

Bob? Bob? Oh my god...bob is walking into his sure death! I have to follow him!




Anyway, isn't it an issueable offense if you demesnesummon into guards? I really don't know..

Uh... beckon is often used to remove one or two people from the mass of their friends, so you aren't facing the entire group all at once.

Besides, that's more like "If you see an angel beckon your friend, and he starts to walk off towards it with a glassy stare, you'd be an idiot to let him keep walking."

Keep the powercost for totem/nestreturn but have it work from a plane away.

Except one realism argument helps balance things, and one makes a skill useless.

Every totem on Ethereal is going to be taken, and none on Prime.

Think it's better just removing the power cost, honestly.

The Case for Consistancy and Logic

Flow should only work between connected locations. Why should you be able to travel between Serewilde and Paavik unless there are forested rooms connecting the two.

Also you should be able to flow out of entanglements. As such you should also drop all physical items when you flow. You may be scattered by the forest breeze, but your pack, armour, boots, rings, etc. stay behind. Exempted items might include Golden Sickle, Athame Dagger, Torcs, etc.

No one may follow you. Only fae type ents should stay with you. No pilgrims, cows, etc.

Flow should work to the Ethereal plane (like a freebie tesseract).

Flow should only be stopped by afflictions that would prevent you from leaving corporeal form.

An eye sigil should block you from flowing into a room or out of it.

You must be blended to the forest to flow.

everyone who uses flow to escape will find his pack and things robbed...fine by me.

Using flow is a choice of last resort (second to last if you count spores). If you don't want your things to fall to the ground, give them to a lephrechaun for safe keeping. You may not be able to flow with items, but the lephrechaun has proven he can.

Actually I thought of flow always as like....a subway or something...an easy way to get somewhere...

But of course, this would be a nice drawback to it, since it's so low.

Flow, in essence, disjoins spirit and body, and sends the spirit roaming through the Ethereal plane, where it then reforms on the Prime Material, body and all.

Dropping all physical items is a term we like to call "Griefing".

Losing ent is pretty cruddy, especially things like pilgrims, cows, etc. All you're doing is making us teleport nexus - Spending a few more seconds on the road. The problem with ents and flow is that people hate a large mass of people coming in, everyone but one on eq.

While an eye sigil would be nice, if such were made, logic dictates Liching souls should not be able to leave an eye sigiled room, either.

Blended? That's just kind of a strange, pointless requirement.

Seconded!

And, as to Wisp - Wisp's power cost may be razed, if it returns to it's original state. That is, world-wide, and goes through monos. As that is the nature of Demesne Summon, correct? You can summon them from any room in your demesne to any room.