Ooh, it should say that on the help file then.

It does.

I've spoken a little with Hajamin about why a maximum amount you are going to bid on an auction is not retractable, but as he pointed out it must be my inexperience in real-world auctions that is confusing me. I don't really mind in these auctions, since I only wanted to decrease the maximum amount by which I would bid by 20 credits, but since this system is going to be reused, I'd like to clear it up.

I've searched for a good description of how automatic bidding works in real life, but I can't find a good one, from Ebay's FAQ though:



Now, it still seems to me that the maximum amount to which you will bid is not actually a part of the auction until someone outbids you, and the system steps in. It's not clear if the second 'maximum bid' in the help file refers to a maximum amount your proxy bidder will aim for, or lowering the maximum bid that is actually entered into the auction.

My thinking here is basically that the proxy bidder represents someone who will sit at the auction and bid on your behalf up to a certain limit that you give them. In this case, I would have thought you could both increase and decrease the maximum amount to which they will bid if the auction price continues to rise, but of course you cannot withdraw any actual bid they have entered for you.

Can someone more experienced with auctions explain why a proxy bidder cannot be told to stop at an earlier point than what you first specify? (Without just saying, Ebay does it like that )

I guess it's to avoid making the price of an auction go up and up, then when you see there's not enough people still bidding just drop your max amount to make sure you don't get the item, because it no longer interests you.

I don't understand what you mean.

Let's say someone's max amount is set for proxy bidding to 1000 credits. The current bid is 200 credits, and increases gradually as people try to outbid you, but you're always in the lead because of your proxy bidder. Let's say it goes right up to 600 credits (and you still have the maximum bid because it's less than 1000), and then the auction rules change and you decide to go for a different item. If you set your proxy bidder to continue bidding only up to 650, what has changed from the perspective of anyone involved in the auction besides yourself?

You set a max of 1000 on an item you're not very interested in, but just because you can (or somebody gives you a benefit if the price rises).

The bidding goes up to 750, and somebody outbids you.

You change your max bidding to 750, because sudenly you found the same article on another bid, cheaper, and so you don't bid anymore.

Article ends up overpriced.

The idea is that you're not bidding more than you want to pay for an item. So, if you say 1000 that means the item is worth 1000 for you. And that you won't be leaving the bidding in the middle of it just because somethign else atracted your attention

I'm just glad this isn't Imperian, Sierus was telling me that you can bid whatever the heck you want, and you don't have to have the credits for it. Now, Avasyu said he'd strub people who abuse this, but what's going to stop some newbies from jacking the price up a bit?

An auction is designed to generate the most possible money for an item. That's its reason for existing... finding the highest price point at which someone will buy said item. Being able to make your maxbid lower would work against such purpose.

How does this matter?

Let's assume Elryn was at an auction in-person. Elryn was willing to put forth $1000 for an item that he wanted. Each time someone would bid, he would bid $100 higher. After bidding $700, someone bids $850. Elryn then decided that he doesn't want the item anymore. Even though he had initially said he'd spend up to $1000, he isn't obligated to continue bidding up to $1000. It is his money, he can change his mind. The only responsibility he has is that he must pay if he's the highest bidder.

That is different from an online auction where your agreement is the maximum bid. In a "in person" auction the agreement is each bid you make, where in online auctions the agreement is your maximum bid.

Why is it different though? The only thing I can think of is that in Ebay and similar auctions there is some communication delay in entering a bid, so it's easiest to avoid conflicting instructions by only allowing increases in a proxy bid limit.

Let's put it this way. Ebay wants to make money out of auctions. They offer you the proxy biding service, so you don't need to be there all the time. In exchange, they make sure you'll pay as much as you said you would pay max for an item, if the price goes high enough.

The idea is the more people biding, the higher the price goes. If you keep people from leaving the bidding before time, then price will go higher.

I liked how the auctions worked. I felt just a little petulant when the auctions became staggered, because I'd been hoping that the high bidders would get themselves locked up in other things and not be able to contest what I was bidding on, but that was always a long shot, and staggering the auctions makes more sense all around.

Staggering auctions both addresses Iridiels complaint (because there won't be an identical item selling for less at the same time; it may look like it, but the serious bidding on the second one won't begin until the first is closed) and better serves the core purpose of finding the best prices people are willing to pay (because you won't get the highest bidders over identical items inadvertently locked into a bidding war over a single copy while the other copies go for bargain prices).

Of course, I'm just generally in a good mood, too, considering I got the only two artifacts I was interested in for less than I expected either of them to sell for alone! I completely agree with Estarra that the vials were the best things up for sale, and remain shocked what the amulet sold for.

Honestly, I never would have spent nearly that much on refills, but I never would have spent anything on refills, because I was doing fine without potions, and just didn't want the hassle. It's not unlike the difference between flat-fee and hourly-rate internet. The security of just knowing you don't have to monitor your usage is worth a lot in itself.

Oh, well. Guess I won't be able to say I made level 80 without the help of potions now, but I'll find some way to live with that knowledge. Or maybe I'll just be stubborn and refuse to use my new toys for a few more weeks. I'm good at stubborn.

***********************************************************
Id Status Max/Min Title Winner Days Left
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1 WON 105/105 Magical Soap Shinza 0
2 WON 125/125 Spectacles of Sight Sylphas 0
3 WON 1175/1175 Vial of Neverending Healing Ialie 0
4 WON 1000/1000 Vial of Neverending Mana Tatezun 0
5 WON 1005/1005 Vial of Neverending Bromides Tatezun 0
6 WON 105/105 Magic Shovel Geb 0
7 WON 700/700 Winged Sandals Ixion 0
8 WON 505/505 Wand of Illusions Geb 0
9 WON 305/305 Wand of Ice Asmodea 0
10 WON 100/100 Wand of Fire Asmodea 0
11 WON 2005/2005 Amulet of Resurrection Ixion 0
12 WON 520/520 Boots of the Wanderer Kaervas 0
13 WON 3095/3095 Super Pet! Geb 0
14 WON 720/720 Spectacles of Clairvoyance Aesyra 0
15 WON 305/305 Magical Soap Geb 0
16 WON 215/215 Magical Soap Aesyra 0
17 WON 305/305 Magical Soap Melanchtho 0
18 WON 355/355 Magical Soap Icarus 0
19 WON 75/75 Magic Shovel Shinza 0
20 WON 115/115 Magic Shovel Soll 0
21 WON 115/115 Magic Shovel Vanthan 0
22 WON 165/165 Magic Shovel Tias 0
23 WON 100/100 Spectacles of Sight Kaervas 0
24 WON 100/100 Spectacles of Sight Melita 0
25 WON 130/130 Spectacles of Sight Shinza 0
26 WON 175/175 Spectacles of Sight Rizzen 0
27 WON 860/860 Spectacles of Clairvoyance Geb 0
28 WON 875/875 Spectacles of Clairvoyance Ixion 0
29 WON 850/850 Spectacles of Clairvoyance Melanchtho 0
30 WON 915/915 Spectacles of Clairvoyance Marsu 0
31 WON 725/725 Winged Sandals Elryn 0
32 WON 305/305 Winged Sandals Shinza 0
33 WON 205/205 Winged Sandals Geb 0
34 WON 400/400 Winged Sandals Kaervas 0
35 WON 1005/1005 Vial of Neverending Healing Tatezun 0
36 WON 905/905 Vial of Neverending Healing Xenthos 0
37 WON 635/635 Vial of Neverending Healing Exarius 0
38 WON 832/832 Vial of Neverending Healing Geb 0
39 WON 505/505 Vial of Neverending Mana Ialie 0
40 WON 300/300 Vial of Neverending Mana Geb 0
41 WON 300/300 Vial of Neverending Mana Dumihru 0
42 WON 300/300 Vial of Neverending Mana Shinza 0
43 WON 505/505 Vial of Neverending Bromides Ialie 0
44 WON 555/555 Vial of Neverending Bromides Geb 0
45 WON 505/505 Vial of Neverending Bromides Rhosyn 0
46 WON 455/455 Vial of Neverending Bromides Exarius 0
47 WON 205/205 Boots of the Wanderer Anyr 0
48 WON 215/215 Boots of the Wanderer Elysiana 0
49 WON 1000/1000 Wand of Illusions Melanchtho 0
50 WON 1510/1510 Wand of Illusions Marsu 0
51 WON 505/505 Wand of Ice Elysiana 0
52 WON 150/150 Wand of Fire Elryn 0

**************************************************************************

Auctions finally ended, above are all winners. Be happy with your artifacts, others weren't even able to bid.

NEXT!

EDIT: Question: How about enabling players to auction their arities instead of doing difficult artie transfers?
Probably not possible eh? But worth asking.

If that was possible, that would be awesome, and benefit both individuals involved greatly. Definitely be all for that.

Heh, artifact transfers exist so you can't do anything but turn in an artifact for another. Not so you can gain credits for an artifact.

And thus did Raezon become "Raezon, Shatter of Hopes and Dreams".

Outside of the special artifacts in this auction, I don't see how that would happen.

If Ialie wanted to sell her cubix, she'd never make 2k credits on it or anything above - wtf would someone pay more for it when they could just buy one for 2k? It would be very unlikely anyone would "gain" credits.

The point is, that there'd be too much "cannibalizing credits" that way, IRE is a business after all.. people have to get paid.