Permadeath would work under one condition: The OOC credits you buy transfer to your new character after the old one dies.

And again, what makes the XP loss truly needed in a game like this, other than the old "Dying MUST be hard" argument?

In all honesty, call it 'griefing' if you want - Erion lost 30 some levels because of Serenwilde during the glom thing. He rarely complained. He swallowed his pride and kept going.

You learn to live with the XP loss. Or, you avoid fighting entirely. Or! You change to a guild with a skill that avoids xp-loss. Lich/Transmigration are my bestest friends - ever.

Guido lost a total of 40 to 45 levels himself to Serenwilde, and I did grumble here and there, especially at the beginning, but eventually you just abandon all hope of being decent statistically and go with the flow.

The only time you're going to lose a lot of XP is when you die without conglut off-plane, you die on prime while raiding, or you get randomly jumped in a neutral prime area. Losing it on raiding and off-plane is fine... those are supposed to be dangerous activities.

The funny part is that so many systems are in place to discourage random jumping, yet it is in that situation that the victim suffers the most. I would much rather die three or four times fighting for a village than get my ass kicked once on the highway.

I can see no xp loss, only if they raise the level cap to 500 or something. So inorder to become a god you have to play for a year straight or something silly.

I also think there's too many titans and demigods already, and there'll be more soon I suppose.

I'd rather like to see the whole PRAY FOR SALVATION ordeal removed so you don't continually lose experience points if you get disconnected and die. And instead, some sort of short but interesting (at least at first) little quests to make in order to come back to life (like I heard it is in Imperian).

no, leave the horrid dead quests to Imperian! And pray for salvation has just been made so we can immolate/rezz/resurgem/sacrifice, the experience loss to prevent you from waiting days for someone to do this.

If you set your timeout correctly, you'll never get horrid xp loss because of getting disconnected

and permadeath wouldn't work, we most likely had 2 or 3 titans/demigods and the rest all under level 30 because the titans don't want another to ascend

True on the perma death Anisu, that would cause ugliness. It'd also ruin the whole Avenger system we have.

True, it would increase the number of demigods, BUT not by that much compared to the numbers comming now. The system for bringing them already has to be looked at.

On the other hand, dying TO a demigod on the highway won't make you cry so badly. Avenger and the folks who hate PK will help keep the game from turning into a PK fest in prime. Off-prime a good number of players up there can aleady Conglut.

I haven't bashed for IC years, and I still have fun in Lusternia. Diku MUDs revolve around killing things; Lusty is an RP world that revolves around roleplay. Quests, influencing, roleplay, politics and a lot of other things are also part of the game.

I think that conflict should stay as it is, with minor tweaks to keep horrible abuse from going on. Maybe even create more points of conflict, specially ones that involve little or no PK (More villages that are peaced when they revolt, for example.) Some kind of conflict that would be entirely RP based would be incredibly welcome, too. Quests get repetitive fast, and PK/bashing conflict relies too much on skills. Maybe verbally trying to convince a denizen, (NOT using the Influence skillset) would be interesting, and would let conflict go on without people dying? As I see it now, conflict is good and fun, but there is far too much emphasis on combat and bashing, and not enough on roleplay and politics. Direct org vs org combat would be great, too, since individual players wouldn't suffer so much.


This might take more admin attention than is availiable, but maybe, instead of praying, you could be thrown into a room with the Fates and you have to bargain for your life with them? You could offer them Karma, Power, or anything. Order members would be able to call on their gods for ressurection, and those who can't offer Karma or Power would spend life essence, losing more XP to come to life. The idea is that you'd roleplay it, bargaining with the Fates, making promises, and so on, to justify a cheaper price. Would make death a much less annoying experience for people, since they'd be able to choose what they lose - XP, Karma, Power, gold, that forged sword with obscene stats they have lying around - and they'd get a chance to bull the Fates into letting them off easily.

Iridiel says "But Fates, I've been a good merian girl, that issue with sushi was a mistake, I won't eat family again, let me go back!! I promise endless ritual sacrifices of naughty novices to pay for me going back to the Basin. My fans would be dissapointed if I didn't come back! You cannot do this to them!"

maybe not totally REMOVE the XP loss for PK, but lessen it a HEAP.

Lengthen the time for praying to 5 minutes, and if you die again in rapid succession have that time increase.

Keep the enemy territory xp loss, but maybe if you are in neutral have it the same as conglutinate but you have to pray. The biggest thing is losing the hours of bashing work. someone like Aesyra (before she got demigod) it would've cost her a good day or so of straight bashing id i'd made her pray at lvl 98 or whatever. I personally believe if someone acheives something like a level, they shouldn't be able to lose it.

Personally I'd rather lose experience than defs, but I think I'm alone there. I just love if I die in Imperian how I get to keep all my defs. And they don't even cost power there!

Anymore huge changes..or changes like that, would kill what's left of my desire to play Lusternia. Loss of xp loss= Bad. In fact, it's stupid. It'd make conglut pointless, dying as a lich pointless, etc..etc. I'd never bash if I never worried about losing experience. Losing experience often pushes you to try harder in game. Peacing people for raiding too much is also silly. There have been so many instances in game, where one side crushed the opposition constantly, going beyond what would have been considered necessary. Would we peace or delete everyone, in such a case? Oh no, Yrael's stealing too much. Peace him. Delete his char. What would be considered going over and beyond what is necessary during wartime? Better yet, do we really feel that the admin should step in and control the flow of lusternian rp? I'm sure that we'd see a large amount of complaints once divine punishments are flying around and players on all sides are hit. I don't really have an answer to Estarra's question. I don't think that Lusternia's filled with horrible characters. I see really loyal characters that stick to their side, in game and even here, on forums and have been here for a really long time. The Glomdoring players that come here to complain about loss of players due to SW aggression should really look closer at their own internal structure. Narsrim posted about it and I couldn't have worded it better. Okay, whee. I'm done.

I'm not going to say what. I'm not going to say who. It's related to this topic, and I need to say something just for my own sanity.



Please do something about this...I've just about taken all I can.

Well, Shayle, the fact that it even needs to be asked 'how should we deal with grief players' should be a rather big clue that something is in the process of being considered to take care of the problem.

If it is any consolation, remember - people always get their camuffins, one way or another. It's just a pity some people can't or won't restrain themselves, so those camuffins might have to be from the administration.

...

Wow, it has been a while. All I saw was Kharon and then Tanjinn didn't matter. I do remember several attempts to get back in though, all of which ended horribly. I couldn't phase so I was pretty useless unless you count doublestabbing with a bare dirk (or whatever we did to give kai).

I'd love to see a complete removal or lessening of the experience lost from death. It causes unnecessary annoyance (and stress, depending on the player) that could be solved by just extending the praying time.

So long as it was PK deaths...

I think it would be cool to be able to walk around and explore the realm of the fates.. look at pieces of the fabric and in general hang out in the void or whatnot. I loved those imperian dis quests.

If you are speaking of who I assume you are, can you explain why it is considered griefing?

I am honestly curious where the admins expect us to draw the line between roleplay and OOC concerns. Fair enough, we shouldn't drive others away, but that in itself is a subjective decision made by the 'victim'; they decide they have had enough there is no milestone 'griefers' pass where they know that their actions will have set consequences. We all have varying levels of tolerance and we all consider these actions differently, so I just can't see a safe place to say "stop doing X now or Y will happen to you" without opening the floodgates for players to manipulate the adinistrators in pleading for them to intervene on an OOC level.

I don't think I explained what I was asking very well, but I can't see how to reword it at the moment. Let me know if you don't understand what I am attempting to say and I will go back and try again later.

ANNOUNCE NEWS #462
Date: 11/8/2005 at 0:49
From: Roark Libertas
To : Everyone
Subj: PK Change

There is a change to excessive PK that should impact only a very small
number of people. If you are on 5 people's suspect list and manage to
get on a 6th then you will go straight to vengeance for that 6th victim
and for each successive victim over and above that. Note that PK CAREFUL
ON does not stop this. Engaging in PK while below this threshold acts as
before, no change.

Penned by my hand on the 23rd of Avechary, in the year 132 CE.
4475h, 4375m, 4146e, 10p, 15660en, 16475w lrxk-
** Important announce post... **

I speak in general terms, Quidgyboo - and if the statement holds true, generally. While I may have my own personal thoughts on the matter, I don't discuss them here, as I find that unprofessional.