Unknown2005-11-06 16:00:30
Jebus, magelock is a novice skill? NERF immediately. We cannot stand for this. ALL NOVICE SKILLS MUST BE CRAP.
*cough* Yes, I just had to get that out.
*cough* Yes, I just had to get that out.
Narsrim2005-11-06 16:01:58
Mage lock can lock any door. There is no way to counter this. Guards cannot even force the door open.
You can basically seal off a room forever with mage lock. My ideal wisp traps always have an Aquamancer helping because no one can get in or out of the room without flow/wisp.
You can basically seal off a room forever with mage lock. My ideal wisp traps always have an Aquamancer helping because no one can get in or out of the room without flow/wisp.
Saran2005-11-06 16:03:57
could no aquamancers help Narsrim fulfill this dream, we'll never hear the end of it
*imagines*NERF Aquamancers and Moondancers shouldn't be able to help each other... it's... er... um... ... ... Not good rp (yeah thats a good one stick with it)
*imagines*NERF Aquamancers and Moondancers shouldn't be able to help each other... it's... er... um... ... ... Not good rp (yeah thats a good one stick with it)
Daevos2005-11-06 16:03:57
Get a warrior to handle the door.
Narsrim2005-11-06 16:05:05
QUOTE(Daevos @ Nov 6 2005, 12:03 PM)
Get a warrior to handle the door.
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In the situation we described, we are talking about multiple guards being in the room too. Are you going to bash a door with 20 guards in it and a demense? You are the one who created this misplaced scenarios - at least keep the context.
Daevos2005-11-06 16:07:18
Wasn't talking about the situation, I was responding solely to your argument that magelock has no counter.
Narsrim2005-11-06 16:08:53
QUOTE(Daevos @ Nov 6 2005, 12:07 PM)
Wasn't talking about the situation, I was response solely to your argument that magelock has no counter.
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Well, that's not even an accurate counter. Some doors (reinforced whatever) cannot even be bashed.
Plus, there are those beloved examples of say: magelock, demesne summon, chasm. You can't get out of that.
Ashteru2005-11-06 16:13:46
QUOTE(Saran @ Nov 6 2005, 03:56 PM)
alright yeah i lied a little about going to sleep
first half, the entire scope of wisp is equal to the ammount of appropriately forested rooms in an area, if an area is all forest and contains 100 rooms we can use wisp on anyone in those 100 rooms, from what i have been told taint/water negates this and as such a mage can create a safe haven for themselves, or a druid of opposite allignment. Please remember that to wisp a tainted druid in their demesne i would probably have to be in their demesne already and i've no way to force them out. if they reflex some way of setting up an effect to make me leave the room my fae go with me. thus they are once again safe
Second half is about if you've say, annoyed the nil out of a moondancer to such an extent that they want to hunt you down and kill you, it seems it should be easier if they just rage you rather than trying to hunt you into a forest room, and simply leaving the area negates both on any night bar the full moon for moondancers.
and in response to the last bit... exactly. without druids to forceforest a room we would have wisp restricted to what? glom, seren and ethereal?
still what is the difference between getting your friends into a room and wisping someone to you, compared to setting up a demesne where you know people will be arriving on astral as well as having your fighters ready to take out any arrivals? if your arguement is that it's your only weapon then my arguement is that the fae are ours but when someone got creative with their use, people got upset. :shrugs: a demesne setup with that sort of planning could allow you to monopolise the event given enough warning
first half, the entire scope of wisp is equal to the ammount of appropriately forested rooms in an area, if an area is all forest and contains 100 rooms we can use wisp on anyone in those 100 rooms, from what i have been told taint/water negates this and as such a mage can create a safe haven for themselves, or a druid of opposite allignment. Please remember that to wisp a tainted druid in their demesne i would probably have to be in their demesne already and i've no way to force them out. if they reflex some way of setting up an effect to make me leave the room my fae go with me. thus they are once again safe
Second half is about if you've say, annoyed the nil out of a moondancer to such an extent that they want to hunt you down and kill you, it seems it should be easier if they just rage you rather than trying to hunt you into a forest room, and simply leaving the area negates both on any night bar the full moon for moondancers.
and in response to the last bit... exactly. without druids to forceforest a room we would have wisp restricted to what? glom, seren and ethereal?
still what is the difference between getting your friends into a room and wisping someone to you, compared to setting up a demesne where you know people will be arriving on astral as well as having your fighters ready to take out any arrivals? if your arguement is that it's your only weapon then my arguement is that the fae are ours but when someone got creative with their use, people got upset. :shrugs: a demesne setup with that sort of planning could allow you to monopolise the event given enough warning
218189
What are we talking about right now? That wisp ISN'T unfair?
Sure, I can make you leave the room if you wisp me to you...although your fae will be hitting on me as well, which will make my reaction slightly slower, if I was unlucky, my demesne effects just would've hit one second before you entered, leaving you 9 seconds unharmed.
The rest...I dunno, I just don't see your point, sorry. Maybe I am just too tired or whatever, I just don't see what all that has to do with wisp being able to completely screw Druids, nor what it has to do with the original topic...
Narsrim2005-11-06 16:15:54
I still vote we change wisp to give one of three hidden afflictions: hypersomnia, clumsy, or blindness (if not blindness, dizzy) and give druids demesne summon. Screw the complaints, I want offense.
Unknown2005-11-06 16:22:33
QUOTE(Avaer @ Nov 6 2005, 03:56 PM)
Now give an example where there are only Druids defending the first mine, and only Mages defending the second, and they actually have demesnes.
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Let me summarize.
Daevos' examples:
- Guardian/Warriors are the only defenders. They can't summon unless from an adjacent room. Clearly, raiders have an advantage in avoiding summons. The defenders also don't have a direct means of getting to the raiders instantly.
- Wiccan/Warriors are the only defenders. Assuming wisp works as it did, raiders need only drop monoliths (or change terrain) to avoid summons. They are also vulnerable to raiders flowing in, if they haven't taken precautions. Assuming wisp works as it does now, both raiders and defenders get slaughtered, no defence.
Wiccans are more dangerous, certainly, but the danger is manageable. If wisp is still broken, Wiccans are godlike whether defending or raiding.
The converse examples:
- Mage/Warriors are the only defenders. Assuming a demesne is previously prepared, or can be prepared quickly, defenders can easily hinder raiders. Raiders must change terrain (but now demesned terrain) to avoid summons.
- Druid/Warriors are the only defenders. Assuming a demesne is previously prepared, or can be prepared quickly, defenders can slightly hinder raiders. Raiders cannot be summoned at all. Assuming it is hartstone, if the Druid can flow to the attacking group and remain alive, he can try and pathtwist the leader, if that is clear. If the raiders do not notice and continue to follow the same person, there is a chance they will end up in the demesne centre if they try and walk out of the demesne.
Here, mages are more dangerous, by far.
What's the problem with all of these examples? They're ridiculous. Such situations should only be compared on the assumption that there are members from all three guilds available.
Unknown2005-11-06 16:35:31
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Nov 6 2005, 04:15 PM)
I still vote we change wisp to give one of three hidden afflictions: hypersomnia, clumsy, or blindness (if not blindness, dizzy) and give druids demesne summon. Screw the complaints, I want offense.
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Psh, I don't want it. I want groves instead of icky mage demesnes.
Saran2005-11-06 16:36:44
QUOTE(Ashteru @ Nov 7 2005, 02:13 AM)
What are we talking about right now? That wisp ISN'T unfair?
Sure, I can make you leave the room if you wisp me to you...although your fae will be hitting on me as well, which will make my reaction slightly slower, if I was unlucky, my demesne effects just would've hit one second before you entered, leaving you 9 seconds unharmed.
The rest...I dunno, I just don't see your point, sorry. Maybe I am just too tired or whatever, I just don't see what all that has to do with wisp being able to completely screw Druids, nor what it has to do with the original topic...
Sure, I can make you leave the room if you wisp me to you...although your fae will be hitting on me as well, which will make my reaction slightly slower, if I was unlucky, my demesne effects just would've hit one second before you entered, leaving you 9 seconds unharmed.
The rest...I dunno, I just don't see your point, sorry. Maybe I am just too tired or whatever, I just don't see what all that has to do with wisp being able to completely screw Druids, nor what it has to do with the original topic...
218205
hehe, i didn't say it wasn't completely unfair. if you bring a full entourage of fae into a demesne, i'll of balance from wisping, my main defense to be in a tree with you enemied and a sylph. if a hexer then add in hexed room, but still i'm in your demesne and as it was pointed out to me by someone a sparred, once setup demesne effects are passive so you just need something to get through once, plus crone isn't always good with the afflictions you want.
hehe i'm just saying however your demesne effects work i generally only stand a chance if i can get someone with waning and vines before they can meld (yah need to be a bit fast) once in a demesne i'm dead, though yeah that is just me i suck at fighting druids but thats mainly 'cause i don't as i hate wasting money on a spar where i just wait for a timeout or run in recklessly
oh and about being off topic, thats mainly 'cause it degenerated a while ago.
Saran2005-11-06 16:38:48
QUOTE(Avaer @ Nov 7 2005, 02:35 AM)
Psh, I don't want it. I want groves instead of icky mage demesnes.
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yeah groves were more fun, though i think that would be more of a 4th archetypey melding of the two magical classes in an org type thing. i.e summon fae/cherubs/imps that guard the demesne while your away.
plus that was more fun having your own piece of land
Geb2005-11-06 21:26:20
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Nov 6 2005, 04:57 PM)
On a side note, Magelock is overpowered. You want to talk about ridiculous novice skills, there is one for you. Do you realize that if I were an Aquamancer, I could invade Magnagora, find a one with one exit, and just keep the door locked? You couldn't touch me with a mono down.
Also, you can reset mage lock. Do let's say it lasts 120 seconds (not sure what it actually lasts) if you cast mage lock at 65 seconds, it will last for another 120.
Also, you can reset mage lock. Do let's say it lasts 120 seconds (not sure what it actually lasts) if you cast mage lock at 65 seconds, it will last for another 120.
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You do know there are ways to remove magelock? Another mage can remove it with relative ease.
Xenthos2005-11-06 21:33:31
Narsrim has sooo many mages following him around every moment of the day.
Shamarah2005-11-06 22:09:14
Dont warriors also have barge to break down doors?
Geb2005-11-06 22:34:27
QUOTE(Xenthos @ Nov 6 2005, 10:33 PM)
Narsrim has sooo many mages following him around every moment of the day. Â
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The point is you do not state there is no counter to something, when there is a counter to it. Now if he had said he personally has no counter to it or wiccans have no counter to it, then his statement would have been correct. Saying there is no counter to it with out qualifying the statement, gives the impression that there is nothing anyone can do to defeat it. That statement is false.
Munsia2005-11-07 02:49:52
Aquas need upgrades but considering Geomancers getting duststorm and you have to be trans environment just to see inside the demesne to move around. ontop of stun/rubble/ and fear of being demesne summoned Geos can hold down thier demesne pretty well solo. Though the same cant be said for aquas
Unknown2005-11-07 02:52:57
With trans environment, it still hides exits.
Not that I have a problem with it.
Not that I have a problem with it.
Munsia2005-11-07 02:56:00
.... So Geos dont have any room to complain about anything really. They get better effects then any of us with protection scrolls as well. Now. Lets hear aqua complaints