Acrune2005-12-15 00:00:37
QUOTE(herox16 @ Dec 14 2005, 12:03 PM)
Actually I think Ekard is the Closes one to getting titan in Celest.
236454
And I'm after him.
Unknown2005-12-15 06:33:38
Since people seem all to happy to write up reasons for me.. I actually didn't want to name mine since I'm tired of all the flaming but meh, flame away:
1) Stagnancy like...
... ALWAYS the same kind of conflict. Same quests you can do, same things you can do to hurt another org but you can do a quest only so often before it gets utterly boring. No -changes-. Where did that dynamic go that we all felt during open beta?
... ALWAYS the same orgs hitting each other. ALWAYS the same winners and losers. And due to some fundamental design of Lusternia it's not like it would make much sense for any org to change their stance on things even slightly.
... 95% of the 'conflict' in Lusternia is org coflict. There is no -personal- conflict. Once you step out of the portal you are labelled as hating that org and being allied with that one. It's impossible to play a Celestian who raids Seren with a Magnagoran, or a Glommie who allies with Seren to destroy the bad bad cities. No it's Seren + Celest vs Mag + Glom.
There is no room there to make your own decision of whom you like and whom you want dead, you are forced into a common stereotype. You even get killed for being in that org even if you -never- in any way participated in all the conflict. Sure that might happen in other IRE realms too but here it is -extreme-.
... ALWAYS the same enemies and allies. You always fight the same people and there is never a chance for you to talk to them on even terms or just quest or anything. Sure they are your enemies, but does that mean you can't respect them as such? Kethuru was the only exception to this.. a realy great event.
... and Kethuru was also the last nameable event. Nothing else afterwards has really affected the whole Basin anymore. All events after were just to introduce this skill or that goddess etc. Nothing seems to happen just for the sake of happening.
EDIT: Addition to stagnancy: Lusternia is all out war, it might fizzle down sometimes but it -always- comes back after a few days. The problem is the emphasis of not being rogue here, you have to be in an city or commune at least to be able to use all your skills. And if you are to -have- to defend if raided. There will come a point with your char when you cannot decide on your own anymore what you want to do and what not, things will be forced upon you taking up all your time. You have the choice between putting up with them or logging off and maybe even quitting.
Players aren't listened to. There's a cliff becoming bigger and bigger between the playerbase and the staff. Yeah we bitch a lot, but usually there's at least -some- truth behind it all. Ignoring everything is not the way to go.
Another things is the total bias of the playerbase. Defending a skill that might be unbalanced just because many in your org use it and you want them to keep PWN'ing the others doesn't make it in any way acceptable. It only destroys the fun of all those that try to straighten it out again. And a game after all is played to have fun, if you want to turn godmode on you can do so easily in all that single player games.
What bothers me the most is that that hatred for other characters IC carries over to the ooc forums.. it's the same people here bitching at each other, their dislike and hatred IC makes them dislike each other ooc as well.. and that's sad at least.
In overall there's just too much stress and negative feelings here for me... too much stagnancy and too many things that are just 'wrong' one way or another.
1) Stagnancy like...
... ALWAYS the same kind of conflict. Same quests you can do, same things you can do to hurt another org but you can do a quest only so often before it gets utterly boring. No -changes-. Where did that dynamic go that we all felt during open beta?
... ALWAYS the same orgs hitting each other. ALWAYS the same winners and losers. And due to some fundamental design of Lusternia it's not like it would make much sense for any org to change their stance on things even slightly.
... 95% of the 'conflict' in Lusternia is org coflict. There is no -personal- conflict. Once you step out of the portal you are labelled as hating that org and being allied with that one. It's impossible to play a Celestian who raids Seren with a Magnagoran, or a Glommie who allies with Seren to destroy the bad bad cities. No it's Seren + Celest vs Mag + Glom.
There is no room there to make your own decision of whom you like and whom you want dead, you are forced into a common stereotype. You even get killed for being in that org even if you -never- in any way participated in all the conflict. Sure that might happen in other IRE realms too but here it is -extreme-.
... ALWAYS the same enemies and allies. You always fight the same people and there is never a chance for you to talk to them on even terms or just quest or anything. Sure they are your enemies, but does that mean you can't respect them as such? Kethuru was the only exception to this.. a realy great event.
... and Kethuru was also the last nameable event. Nothing else afterwards has really affected the whole Basin anymore. All events after were just to introduce this skill or that goddess etc. Nothing seems to happen just for the sake of happening.
EDIT: Addition to stagnancy: Lusternia is all out war, it might fizzle down sometimes but it -always- comes back after a few days. The problem is the emphasis of not being rogue here, you have to be in an city or commune at least to be able to use all your skills. And if you are to -have- to defend if raided. There will come a point with your char when you cannot decide on your own anymore what you want to do and what not, things will be forced upon you taking up all your time. You have the choice between putting up with them or logging off and maybe even quitting.
Players aren't listened to. There's a cliff becoming bigger and bigger between the playerbase and the staff. Yeah we bitch a lot, but usually there's at least -some- truth behind it all. Ignoring everything is not the way to go.
Another things is the total bias of the playerbase. Defending a skill that might be unbalanced just because many in your org use it and you want them to keep PWN'ing the others doesn't make it in any way acceptable. It only destroys the fun of all those that try to straighten it out again. And a game after all is played to have fun, if you want to turn godmode on you can do so easily in all that single player games.
What bothers me the most is that that hatred for other characters IC carries over to the ooc forums.. it's the same people here bitching at each other, their dislike and hatred IC makes them dislike each other ooc as well.. and that's sad at least.
In overall there's just too much stress and negative feelings here for me... too much stagnancy and too many things that are just 'wrong' one way or another.
Kharvik2005-12-15 06:40:34
Here here! to that. Unfortunately
Unknown2005-12-15 06:53:32
QUOTE(shadow @ Dec 15 2005, 01:33 AM)
Everything said.
236635
I'm really glad this has been said. Lusternia is the only IRE game where I've felt I needed to tri-trans and more due to the fact that conflict is the main basis, and without it you're just a face in the crowd as there's no open-ended way to roleplay with everyone (Without an event such as the Kethuru, which might be another reason why people enjoyed it).
Oh well.. it's been said before time and time again. I just hope everyone comes back when things come together.
Terenas2005-12-15 08:07:20
I have to agree on the point about skills. I've been browsing the Imperian forums lately and found to my not-so-surprise that they considered our skills remarkably overpowered. Rather, it is so insane that it causes extreme disgust and burnouts for the opposing sides. Lich is plainly overpowered when put on par with Soulcage, Trueheal is just plain insane, Warriors can get excessive health (I can reach the health of a Dragon by level 80), Warriors do absurd damage against some people (Ixion's swords for over 2k), Instant-summons destroy all the fun of group combat.
There are just too many inherently overpowered skills (and artifacts such as Elemental runes and Champion artifacts) that create extreme dissatisfaction in one organization or another. It's sad but the majority of the envoys are also bias players who don't want to nerf their own classes using the reason that why should we handicap ourselves when other envoys just want to make their classes stronger? I don't see the ur'Guard or Nihilist envoys asking for Lich to be downgraded, the Moondancer Envoy asking for Wisp to be downgraded, or Celestines asking for Trueheal to be fixed.
At times I have faith in the admins to fix combat imbalances, but other times it just seems like they don't give a damn. Not to mention there are players that will abuse anything as long as it isn't hard-coded. Forcing focus spirit/cannibalize/surge, possessing people to empty vials, diluting vials, smashing shields, etc.
/rant
There are just too many inherently overpowered skills (and artifacts such as Elemental runes and Champion artifacts) that create extreme dissatisfaction in one organization or another. It's sad but the majority of the envoys are also bias players who don't want to nerf their own classes using the reason that why should we handicap ourselves when other envoys just want to make their classes stronger? I don't see the ur'Guard or Nihilist envoys asking for Lich to be downgraded, the Moondancer Envoy asking for Wisp to be downgraded, or Celestines asking for Trueheal to be fixed.
At times I have faith in the admins to fix combat imbalances, but other times it just seems like they don't give a damn. Not to mention there are players that will abuse anything as long as it isn't hard-coded. Forcing focus spirit/cannibalize/surge, possessing people to empty vials, diluting vials, smashing shields, etc.
/rant
Xenthos2005-12-15 08:10:48
QUOTE(terenas @ Dec 15 2005, 04:07 AM)
I don't see the ur'Guard or Nihilist envoys asking for Lich to be downgraded
236661
You'll see this when Transmigration gets downgraded without multiple forum threads angsting (that should really be added into your little list).
Narsrim2005-12-15 09:05:47
QUOTE(terenas @ Dec 15 2005, 04:07 AM)
the Moondancer Envoy asking for Wisp to be downgraded
236661
Wisp was downgraded and is not longer an instant summon.
Shorlen2005-12-15 09:47:57
QUOTE(terenas @ Dec 15 2005, 04:07 AM)
Stuff
236661
We have argued for focus spirit to not be forcable. I know I have argued for wisp to be downgraded. I aruged for Flow to be downgraded (but it was nerfed far, far more than I had wanted ).
The thing is, even when we argue for downgrades, we don't get them. Envoys are listened to, not us.
Ekard2005-12-15 09:51:20
QUOTE(Acrune @ Dec 15 2005, 02:00 AM)
And I'm after him.
236552
Get to weork Arcune. Mags will be haev to many titans and demigods, we need some too.
Ixion2005-12-15 09:57:33
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Dec 15 2005, 04:05 AM)
Wisp was downgraded and is not longer an instant summon.
236674
A split second delay.. oh yes it's so much worse now. You can barely notice it before it resolves.
Soll2005-12-15 09:59:29
2-3 second delay is enough to have someone chop a sapling and another person meld. Also, aren't wisps stopped by monolith now? That's more than the instant Demesne summon.
Just thought.. Do I remember correctly that landscape doesn't matter after the wisp starts?
Just thought.. Do I remember correctly that landscape doesn't matter after the wisp starts?
Daevos2005-12-15 10:01:20
And it's also more than enough time for them both to be wisped before they can recover balance.
Soll2005-12-15 10:02:04
But they'd have changed the terrain by then, so no further wisping.
Ixion2005-12-15 10:03:12
But they'd be dead, so no further melding.
Shiri2005-12-15 10:07:23
QUOTE(Ixion @ Dec 15 2005, 09:57 AM)
A split second delay.. oh yes it's so much worse now. You can barely notice it before it resolves.
236707
Where "split second" is actually "3 seconds."
Right.
Narsrim2005-12-15 10:08:37
QUOTE(Ixion @ Dec 15 2005, 05:57 AM)
A split second delay.. oh yes it's so much worse now. You can barely notice it before it resolves.
236707
3 seconds != split second.
Soll2005-12-15 10:09:02
I'm not going to make this into an argument, I'm just going to state the facts as I know them. Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.
Kaervas and Daevos enter Munsia's demesne.
Munsia tells Narsrim they enter.*
Daevos chops.
Narsrim starts to wisp one.*
Kaervas taints.
Wisp fails.
No?
These are both factors that can be ignored with mage demesnes. The demesne holder can trigger them entering to demesne summon them, whereas a druid must trigger it to tell someone they've entered, who must have a trigger on that to even begin the wisp.
Druid: 0.3 second lag between entering a first tell, 0.3 second lag between tell and starting to wisp, 3 second wait before wisp target arrives.
Mage: 0.3 second lag between entering and summon. Success/Failure instant.
But this is a thread about missing Aesyra! Have fun elsewhere! We'll miss you.
Kaervas and Daevos enter Munsia's demesne.
Munsia tells Narsrim they enter.*
Daevos chops.
Narsrim starts to wisp one.*
Kaervas taints.
Wisp fails.
No?
These are both factors that can be ignored with mage demesnes. The demesne holder can trigger them entering to demesne summon them, whereas a druid must trigger it to tell someone they've entered, who must have a trigger on that to even begin the wisp.
Druid: 0.3 second lag between entering a first tell, 0.3 second lag between tell and starting to wisp, 3 second wait before wisp target arrives.
Mage: 0.3 second lag between entering and summon. Success/Failure instant.
But this is a thread about missing Aesyra! Have fun elsewhere! We'll miss you.
Unknown2005-12-15 10:10:19
Let's not start another wisp whinging threads, kids.
Narsrim2005-12-15 10:11:02
It currently proceeds to wisp the target. I bugged it just to be safe, but there has been no comment so far that such change was not intended.
Unknown2005-12-15 10:38:26
Meh. No need for a hijack.