Give me a 2 power attack that goes through every defense then.

..... but you'll make it even harder then it is to kill anyone 1 vs 1... so not fair. Change scarab back to 8p too then since darkseed didnt get changed. Nerf all runes to do half of what they do now. Nerf Demigods. Nerf titans. Nerf tf's.
Nerf Fetish. Nerf Smudges. just saying the word kill deems you a griefer you shall be pacified for 15 ig years get over it already.

Hey, I don't agree with lunge going through shield. I hope that it's changed. I'm also hoping that assault is changed to a power strike. :>

I know you don't agree with it, but come on. Druids have one way of killing people for the most part, and it has been proven time and again, that people who know what they are doing can pretty much escape that happening.

I wonder how many hours of forging it took for Ixion to get his broadswords.

I also wonder how many credits in runes it costs to get them to do so much damage.


I wonder how many credits it took to build that demense...

It's called time and dedication to make a demesne and learn to stay alive. Now for a warrior like Ixion how hard is it after getting this stuff to oh say. lunge lunge lunge lunge lunge swing?

Cool, give us passive hindering.

So you're saying that getting 700 credits for the two elemental runes isn't time and dedication? Or spending the $230 RL dollars isn't dedication? How about the 800 more credits for the +10 stat runes? or the 1800 if you go for the +15's? That isn't dedication?

Meh thought you was an aquamancer..

Passive hindering for a warrior.. you have... oh wait I got I don't need to reply now

Trying to say "I spent x amount of dollars so therefore I am more dedicated" is stupid.

I have spent numerous amounts of dollars to get my skills, and even if I did buy the -only- artifact that is available to increase my damage, I couldn't come close to a warriors damage output.

You have passive hindering - poisons and deepwound afflictions.

As a warrior, with a single round, you can do do raw damage, deepwound damage, and deal up to four afflictions. You can do this completely unblockable.

A druid, in a single round, is going to deal negligable damage, and if in a demesne that requires quite a large ammount of setup time, deal a few afflictions - most of which require cures that can all be administered at the same time. All of this is blockable by shield. A good ammount of it is also blockable by a protection scroll.

So.. how is Gregori asking for an unblockable cudgel attack (which does 'meh' damage with a side of bleeding) anywhere near giving warriors passive hindering?

And aren't you a paladin? Isn't Heretic/Infidel/Inquisition passive once landed? Don't Serenguard get Dark Moon or Ancestral Curse? Don't Ur'guard get Contagion? So that's even more passive effects right there.

Not that i'm saying warriors are without flaws.. but your request compared to his is just plain silly.

Where did I say the word MORE Gregori? I didn't. But the way Munsia structured her argument, she made it sound as if somehow having to set up your demense (which only requires what, one trans skill?) is somehow more "dedicated" then having to forge (or pay for the forging) weapons with the right stats and then attach the appropriate runes to them. MY double lunges certainly don't drop anyone down to anything near the amount of health as Ixion's.

I don't know about how you guys game, but I think that someone whose might and level are as high as Ixion's SHOULD be able to pulverise someone whose might and level are much lower than their own.

But hey, anyone should be able to trans 3 skills and be able to wipe the floor with a warrior right?

How is it stupid:

* i have to hit you for deepwounds to matter.
* i have to /keep/ hitting you for deepwounds to stay if you're any good at curing: and I have to do it through the crazy hindering guardians and wiccans are able to do
* if I miss a beat - and note here I'm a 16str paladin with non-whorish weapons - then you're able to catch up with my curing
* trans resilience turns my damage into a bit less and turns that "up to four afflictions" into "kind of two". Nothing I can trans makes demesne afflictions hit me any less
* heretic/infidel/inquisition require you stay the heck down and not run away. I'm not getting sliced legs in any rush with post-nerf weapons so its not inconcievable that you've run away
* contagion doesn't aeon you
* does moon/curse web you? I don't recall it ever doing so

So no, my request isn't as silly as you think. After playing the three Celest archetypes I'm quite happy to stand here and say that lunge isn't overpowered if you're not wielding whorishly overpowered weapons. Demesne effects can be devestating if you time them right with things like sap, as we've seen. I fought Ceren and had him just web me the whole damned fight - if we were in a team, thats my offence shut down right there.

And just so you know - us non-disgustingly whorish knights, the ones without 20 str, pre-nerf weapons and/or artifact runes, we can only lunge a few times before we're out of power. Its not exactly difficult to hinder us enough to heal. I mistakenly thought my lunges would be devestating when I first went paladin - I watched a mugwump geomancer dreamweaver thingy, bout 10% of my might, tank my lunges. Straight out. I wasn't using 180 damage broadswords, just average rapiers.

You're thinking "warriors hurt a lot with lunge" and what you immediately think of are the ones that hurt: Ixion, Daevos, Murphy. Think of why first.

And you are thinking "oh my god Sap kills" and forgetting that most of the time it is bad curing that kills, bad preparation.
People advertise dieing to sap and suddenly it is overpowered, doesn't matter that 1 person can't cure it, but 10 others can, because the 10 others don't run to the forum and say "Holy Cow, I cured Sap with no trouble at all!"

Hey, I didn't say sap should be changed. I took offence at the whole lunge thing.

How is this passive? If I stand there, they'll automatically start being afflicted by poisons? Or do I have to actually *gasp* attack them for it to happen? If it's the latter, it sure as heck isn't passive.

Maybe I wasn't too clear myself.

My comments are mostly about the attacks made on lunge.

I think morik said it all pretty clearly.

We don't equate all wiccans to Narsrim and try to get them nerfed. So why equate all warriors Ixion, Daevos and Murphy?

Alright, no more name calling, girls.

First, let's clear out the silly arguments. I mean...Ekard talking about clotting in sap is just foolish. Let's clot against a Moon Serenguard who has me under aeon, too. Oh, man, and mactans is some nasty stuff. I'm going to sip fire before I sip sanguine to cure scalping. Whew, that was close. Also, let's not start with "Your skill does this!" "Yeah, but your skill does this!" Let's look at the end results.

K, now mages tend to have a damage-per-second rate similar to that of "damage" warriors. This, by and large, is a balanced state. Warriors deal afflictions, damage, and wounds (which in turn leads to more damage because of applying health or more afflictions because someone decided to suck it up and hope) all at once. Mages have the effects stacked from the demesne, but beyond that, they need to sacrifice damage to continue to afflict.

Druids, without the benefit of sap, have a damage-per-second rate similar to that of a thorn beast. The balance here is bleeding. I mean, never mind that I'm never going to drop someone in three point staffs. I'm not jealous that every fight I have to enter into with the mindset that I'm going to be here for a while. But yeah, the only kill option for a Hartstone (and given the consistently buggy Crow skills, the Blacktalon are currently in the same boat) is bleeding. So, I have two options. I can either run you out of mana and pray that you aren't a surged warrior, or I can do something to mess up your ability to use a skill that has no balance cost whatsoever. On top of this all, the Hartstone demesne is a piddly little thing compared to either of the mage demesnes. Stacking bleeding with the mage demesnes' stuns wouldn't be so bad. Personally, I feel that the Blacktalon demesne is also subpar compared to the mage demesnes, but I'll let someone without the skill make the call there.

Well, the gods, in their infinite wisdom, saw fit to give us a reliable method to deliver the one affliction that can interfere with clotting: aeon. Unfortunately, they also saw fit to give this skill a heavy power cost. Cure it twice and we're back to trying to run you out of mana so we can start trying to run you out of health. Wow. Overpowered. You'd've died to a mage a long time ago in that situation.

You want a defense against sap? Fine. I want my cudgel to do 1000 damage and 600 bleeding each shot and my demesne to stun at all elevations. I want my damage per second to be above that of a warrior like the other mages get.

Yes, people do in fact do this.

You begin focusing your mind on your motor skills.
3583h, 822m, 4200e, 10p elrbp-

The end of Ashteru's cudgel forms a knotty burl and he points it at you. The burl pops and ruptures, shooting a barrage
of splinters into your flesh.
2215h, 822m, 4200e, 10p elrbp-
You must regain balance first.


It offers the following defences:
Physical cutting: 103
Physical blunt: 92
Armour Status: 100
It has the following dwarven runes etched upon it in coal:
A dwarven rune shaped like a castle has been etched in coal.
A dwarven rune shaped like a mountain peak has been etched in coal.

Discuss.