Actually I'd rather vitae in spirit plane too since you cant get back any other way

Estarra already said they are not making the pet stronger as Druids were not intended to use ents.

That being said. I whole heartedly disagree with every one of these suggestions for the simple fact that until people start recognising their own overpowered skills. Leave Druids the alone.

Wooooo

you could still transmigrate there too if it was made local area...and that without losing experience.

And then we are back to equaling Lich

You still have an advantage (even with big losses like that) simply because you can skunk the room you put your bonded pet in. That takes away a quick scenting and if you drop a monolith in there as well, it keeps them from summoning/teleporting. I guess that doesn't really take care of a blind flowing though.

It's a start.

Overpowered skills: Trueheal, Transmigration, maybe Crowform, but with a big maybe, some things warriors can pull off. Hmm...some other things -I- consider overpowered, but I won't list them. And no, Lich isn't overpowered. Lich is -good-, like that thing Night and Moonfollowers get ( but from whom I don't know the names atm) but it's not overpowered.
Others could consider sap overpowered, another group could think that Moonbeam is overpowered with all those boni that get with that attack. But I guess the general chorus from nearly everyone BUT the druids is: Transmigration IS too good. Ecology has a lot of other nice skills in it, it shouldn't boil down to Transmigration.
Oh, and I freely admit that some other combinations can be considered overpowered too.

we are assuming there is forest. A mage comes along?

...In what context? Serrin mentioned it as being negative for the Ecologist. But if I interpret it right for the Ecologist, if he floods/taints the room your pet is in while you are in Prime Glom/Seren or a village, it's even better for you, and you can still escape without loss since they can't flow to you and kill you right away. They'd have to walk.

No.. you reform into your animal off balance and get demesne summoned instantly...

Well, some Druids are saying this about their own skills. Ialie started, and I agree, transmigration needs some limitation.

Incidentally, my earlier suggestions were OR's, not AND's. One of them, not all of them at once.

And stop suggesting local area. It would kill the skill. If Ecologists were desperately unhappy when it was plane-limited, how happy are they going to be if you make it even worse than it was?

ALOT of things need limitations but they've stayed the way they are for.. ever

If your comparing lich transmigration and you think you need to downgrade transmigration why not add in a new type of sigil which if on the ground prevents transmigration, it wouldnt effect hunters at all, cities could proof certain places against transmigration and if people are willing to spend the gold using a sigil to actually be able to kill a druid the druid can still counter by spending thier gold for a mushroom sigil.

Except that there are no mushroom sigils.

Ack true forgot disenchanting, still it does mean your given the option to stop a druids transmigrate and he can decide not to fight on that one paticular area of ground anyway, just an idea I supose

YoLF - this thread was created FOR THE EXPRESS PURPOSE of discussing Transmigration and the effect it has on the game. What do you think would be more beneficial to the Admin - a bunch of people discussing the skills and trying to find something that is fairly balanced before giving it to their respective envoys, or every envoy writing some random thing for it that the admin discard because there is too much dissention and crazyness involved in it.

The reason I went to discuss Transmig here was to come up with an idea that could be sent to the envoys.

Personaly, I'm still for the idea I presented, since the arguments against it are as follows from what I caught:

1) Divine don't want the pets to become full ents
A: Isn't it true that if a pet is bonding for transmig that it can't fight with you? If so then a buff up (via the link with your stronger form) won't make it an ent, especialy since the thing won't be running around with you. When it's capable of combat, the pet could be reduced back to normal.

2) It still allows for expless escape via spores, digging, ext.
A: Spores realy CAN be used by anyone, even though it's easier to obtain from a commune. Sap works in a reverse mentality: It requires a cure anyone can get but is much easier to obtain in a city.

As for many of the other methods of escape, the escape methods are either doable on both sides or comparable to Lich's ability to sit as a ghost and move about before reforming, including leaving a room. True, Eyesigil the right places and Lich is stuck in local area, but a druid would be stuck in the local area by default, and gods help him if the room is demesned or if a Glommy is ready with Wisp.


3) Lich and other skills aren't changed, why not Transmig?
A: Transmig and other skills aren't changed, why Lich? Lich and Transmig aren't changed, why Trueheal? Transmig and Trueheal aren't changed, why Barrier?

BLAH!

Claiming innocence by pointing to guilty people is not a viable defense. If they are all overpowered and Transmig is being put right along side it then, yes, it's overpowered and thus needs a change. We're NOT going to talk about those other skills HERE because THIS is the Transmigration thread. Start a thread on Lich and we'll talk about Lich there (though warning: It may lead to going back to Transmig, since my goal is to make Transmig equal to Lich.. lower Lich and Transmig goes down with it: For example I STILL think spores shouldn't be used when reforming in either). Start a thread on Trueheal and we'll talk about it there.

But don't use them to defend Transmig.


And Ash: Jeesh, much of your argument against Munsia involved aspects to Transmig THAT SHE ALREADY AGREED TO CHANGES TO! Transmig forced in local area, allowing the enemy to Track/Flow/Teleport/Sprint/Whatever to make the second kill, and an off-balance equal to Lich so that people CAN get to you.

Blah, nevermind it all. Munsia, whoever's Envoy go ahead and tell them about the changes we talked about and see it put into the next report. That'll do more than aruging the matter here.

So when she agreed, why did she argue about them with me, then? And I honestly can't be bothered anymore, I am going to get it anyway, if it isn't changed, I certainly won't complain.*shrug*

Because right after me and her finally agree to a change that seems to work, Munsia first has to fight off people who want to nerf the thing based on incorrect information (being able to burrow/tree the pet, for example), and then you come in with this:



Which was both a misread of one part of the idea and ignoring the rest of it. After that you argue with her about how she wants Transmig to not realy change AFTER she agreed to rather big changes (which remove the whole "Autoescape to a safe room" bit).

And to note.. THIS:


Was poor form. She corrected your comment about what a person can do in a distorted room and you come back with a comment that sounded condensending. If you meant it to be funny you need to put in some smilies ( like this one. Oh he's so cute!).

Sidenote: Making them keep their wounds/ailments is way too much, especialy if they died to, say, a behead. Being dropped in a room that's still local, off balance, and at about two hits away from death isn't worth 28 power.

In any case, it's all that which is why you're getting it. I'm defending it because this is one of those few times when an agreement can be reached and, barring an argument based on the proposed changes (the fact that they can skunk/mono a room was noted, but I'm thinking that we'll have to test that in game to see. There's always making off-balance occur for longer or shorter to fine tune it. Also there's still the fact that the biggest pursuits will happen in disrupted areas.) I think we have a winner.

Now to find a way to balance Weaponry without turning non-runed weaklings like me into useless punching bags.

The local area restriction would not work. It is not a solution.

A deepbonded pet which is killed, kills the owner. Anywhere they might be.

There is a limit as to how tanky the pet can be made. No matter how strong it is, it will be the achilles heel of any druid. Why bother fighting a raider when you can get your friendly warrior to track to the pet, and kill them without difficulty?

Imagine how it must be used on Astral. You carry your pet around to each sphere you visit, hoping that at the time you die there aren't other aggressives standing at your pet ready to kill you while you have no defences and no power. Aside from that, again any tracking warrior with a cubix can visit and search for pets in every sphere in under 5 minutes... so if anyone wants to kill you, you're dead with a pet up there.


I'm sorry, nice try, but it isn't appropriate.