First off, I ask that this thread is heavily moderated, any posts that are 1) whining 2) insulting someone 3) off topic I request deleted. Now, onwards!

Buffs
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Ok to start it off I would like to address the ever evident problem of too many buffs. With Karma + Tosha + Catas + TFs and everything else I think that there is way too many for our own good. Currently I see them as combat breakers, classes that have no business tanking like mad can tank like mad, and those that are meant to tank insanely are twice as bad. Stats are boosting way too high and the difference can be seen. Yes these are indeed accessable to everyone but even so, they still pose a huge problem. I am sure some people can give great examples with this, Diamante, Kharvik, Kaervas, Narsrim ect ect. My proposition, as always is to nerf Toshoa to 10% if anything, and remove karma buffs. Change favours to have different effects based on the god but nothing extreme.

Demesnes
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More or less look at Murph's thread, I said what needed to be said there.

Speed
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It is still my opinion and the opinion of many others that hex speed, and mugwump speed in general is too much. I still maintain the stance that they should have a level two bonus, maybe get a new stat point or two in turn, nothing huge though.

Karma
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Also, I still beleive karma is a failed system and no one curses effectively, in turn I suggest that if you have status on someone you can do something that lets your champion kill the said person without gaining status.

The rest should be addressed in envoys, so I won't comment on them until I see the reports. I am sure you can guess what I am talking about though. Anyone who wants to add or debate these things feel free, but please construct it intelligently and NO whining please, or personal attacks.

ya the buffs are kind of dodgy cause they all stack, I bet I could get 6k+hp with them all at the 53rd circle...
Is mugwump speed REALLY that bad? Honestly? I know everyone is campaigning me to go mugwump, and it is like top choice for the nasteh eq bonus, but...its not like every mugwump in the basin is a top notch killer right out of the box, only that alot of the top names are mugwump.
love-mimi

Buffs
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Buffs become a problem when it is not feasible for everyone to achieve them. If everyone can, for example, get a knowledge blessing then there is no major downside because EVERYONE can get it. This isn't true with TFs, etc.

Demesnes
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Demesne summons and wisp need some more looking into, but that's the root of the problem

Speed
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First, people largely complain about Mugwumps and Hexes out of utter ignorance. The base speed for a Hex with normal equilibrium is 1.0-1.1 seconds. Mugwumps have a level 3 equilibrium bonus, which is a 30% increase. Thus, a Mugwump with Hexes is going to fire off at ~0.8 seconds. The speed bonus is so insubstantial, it means jack because the base equilibrium is already so fast.

The only time the speed bonus comes into play is with abilities like moonburst, staff, etc. that have a base equilibrium of around 4.0-4.2 seconds and come down to around ~3.1 seconds.

It is also worth noting that the original Mugwumps had a level 2 equilibrium bonus when the level 2 bonus was over 20% (close to 30%). Thus, reducing Mugwump speed to level 2 now would make them SLOWER than they were initially. If his happen, then all other races should get all upgrades they received nerfed too.

Karma
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Karma is fine. Is does discourage PK combat, and the suggestion you ahve would only increase PK combat - which doesn't help at all.

The thing is with hexes you can draw 6 or so, and shoot them in rapid succession with less then a second inbetween, that is insanely fast and quicker then deadeyes(I can confirm it when an apostate friend gets on). Now, the thing is I clearly remember Lisaera said that the person who invented deadeyes had crack injected into their eyes, but now we have hexes that fast. It is just my personal opinion, and that of many others though.

Also Karma does nothing, I have not worried about being cursed for months, I would much rather see karma done away with completely and a new system put in that encourages champions to actually be champions(rather then the odd rescue or tele into fight someone).

EDIT: Unless I hallucinated that Lisaera quote, which I am rather sure I didn't, but if it is the case I apologize. Give us curseward or something against hexes and it will be fine, but currently they are too much.

Does it matter?

You have herb/pipe balance, purgative balance, and salve balance. You can usually heal 2-3 instantly and recover those balances in around 1 second. Furthermore, EVERYONE in Lusternia has access to abilities that heal afflictions on top of the plethora of others that do so.

Hexes started off absolutely useless (it was frequently discussed as the most useless skillset) because before whammy/double whammy it wasn't possible to do any damage to a target because it was possible to heal them faster than they could be delivered (which is still the case). The only ability in Hexes worthwhile initially was allhex, which then again, can be cured pretty fast (focus mind, focus mind, eat pennyroyal, sip allheale, etc).

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And you are wrong. That's not what Lisaera said at all. Lisaera said that deadeyes was wrong because it ignored racial balance. You could have -3 balance penalty and STILL dead eyes at the same speed as everyone else. This of course skewed Apostates, because they all ended up taking uber tanky races, but didn't have any real penalty for it. That can't be compared to Mugwumps who have terrible constitution and the most extreme weaknessnes.

I cursed you a while back. Whether you worry about it doesn't effect the fact that the system does work.

I removed it and was back up to 99% karma in one run..The only thing that karma effects are young players, and even then it is nothing majour. With a bit of help and one little karma run you can remove it and be on your way like nothing. I still recommend Karma being removed completely and people being able to use something so the champion has the persons name and can kill them without gaining status.

If you expect anyone to take you seriously then don't . There is no place in Lusternia minus hours and hours of bashing where you can get 125+ karma at the snap of one's fingers.

EDIT: Watch your language. ~Shiri~

It took me 30% karma Narsrim, that is nothing. Honestly, you can gain karma like nothing doing quests. Karma is way to easy to gain, I mean wasn't it you who said you were walking around with 3 blessings and had no worries about karma? How can you honestly defend that.

When I was killed by a group of Mags and got suspect on all of them, I didn't even bother cursing them since it would be too easy to remove them. Well, maybe not for Ravlok who had like a bajillion suspects, but with the system of vengeance for the 10th (?) kill, it's probably worth it more to keep the suspect. Plus, that person can't harm you for another 30 days. If you curse someone you put yourself in danger of being killed again.

im just upset about ravloks insta beheads...make it liie pureblades set up ones thats probably the only real moan i have at the moment..surprisingly happy for once..

Uh, thats wrong.
If he doesnt worry about it, doesnt that prove that the system isnt working? I mean, you did the curse, but it didn't matter. How does that help?


Its like if Avenger was changed so that the avatar just poked the target, rather than killing them. You could say "I cursed you a while back. Whether you worry about it doesn't effect the fact that the system does work," and everyone would say your completely wrong, because its not doing anything.

I agree about the karma thing. I know I can get 4 blessings and still have 100% karma, and Narsrim you were telling me you can do the same. I think it is completely unbalancing combined with other buffers like ones that quests give. Here you can be a mugwump mage or guardian, a completely untanking race and in most cases class too, and be as tanky if not tankier than a knight. Karma blessings and quest buffers are allowing for people to get well over 10k+ health, that shouldn't be. When you see a divine in the arena they dont even have that much freaking health.

As for demesnes, I also agree they need some kind of change. As seen on both Nil and Celestia.. if a group of people decide to meld the entire plane there is really not much people can do in defense. Once you enter that demesne even if you shield right away you are instantly summoned into a large group of people and basically screwed. In every wargames I played it was always just demesne camping until finally someone got bored and entered anothers demesne where they probably died.

The system is working just fine because you have the option to not curse someone and keep suspect. The curse aspect is supposed to be a way to "get back" without doing anything.

Right, if you have focus mind. If you don't, it's pretty much an instakill.

Curses really only hurt people who have excessively long suspect lists. Personally, I hope Umbrawn curses me, because it'll take a ton of karma with no big loss on my part. Also, it affects your ability to retain those nice buffs. I think karma did its job well. Avenger is the main protection, karma offers a means to get back at the people who really toe the line.

Mage vs Mage freeforalls are terribly exciting too. I remember that one with me vs asmoth vs laxinova. Lasted over an hour, I burned through 10k willpower and 50 reserves before it was over. That one was better then the one when I beat Kaervas (who wasn't sitting in a demesne like a pansy like most of the other mages were), only to be down to me vs a druid, neither of whom could beat the other in the opponents demesne. So eventually, I just got bored and went into the druid's demesne, and natually died.

Awhile ago, someone suggested decreasing the skill cost of the skillsets Resilience and Magic. Good idea. Also, I think that gedulah should come earlier on in Highmagic, (green for Lowmagic) to deal with these overpowered locks, whether it be from hexes or the warriors (slitthroat + slickness)

Secondly, we could have hexes ignore racial speeds.

In regards to racial speeds, I don't have a real problem with them, except for faelings. They need a few more penalities to balance them out because right now, they're the best warrior race. Shadowlord faelings, that is.

Buffs! Yes Narsrim. The karma system 'works' technically, but everyone knows that a victim is better off maintaining their victim status than to open themselves up for another kill. I've removed karma curses with ease and if anything, they anger me and provoke me to target that individual again.

I still contend that the karma system cannot determine whether or not a kill is justified. I lose karma for kills. What? So, I should -never- raid? Killing is simply wrong, period? In that sense, it does NOT work. Not really.

Quest blessings are another additive for boosts. They're excessive. Divine favors are -retarded-. Luckily that's being looked into. I believe that the Tosha blessing should be reworked to bless one person at a time and reduced to 10% as someone here suggested.

Astrology spheres should only be used on one's self. Buffer spheres, at least.

Taking it a bit further, I'll say say that only smiths should be able to rune their weapons/armour. Want higher stats? Take forging! Or buy runes.

Well said, Torak.

Buffs - definitely, one of the key areas that Lusternia could improve in is reducing the extremes. Almost everything has been taken to an extreme here, so that minor differences become insignificant. Reducing the possibility of blessings, favours, skills and artifacts to modify essential characteristics would be a big plus.

Demesnes - As much as the admin loves the concept, I think they need a major revision. Slapping on fixits and minor adjustments to summoning doesn't address the real problem with them. They will either be too influencial in combat, or too frustrating for the mage/druid to use at range.

I think speed is fine after the bug was fixed.

Combat offense - I think that once tankiness is brought back within sensible limits, the general offense and corresponding defence of all classes could use a rebalancing. It seems that knight combat especially is designed to be all over one way or the other in less than 30 seconds... and there is not really a good distribution of unique and interesting tactics between the various archetypes. Maybe weapon runes are the only problem, I don't know... but I think it does need looking into.

For me, knight combat isn't over in the first 30 seconds.

I find, personally that knight combat can last a long while especially knight vs knight. When i spar against daevos, neither of us can kill each other and it ends in the arena timing out.