Torak, I would agree with you if a large part of combat was not having the presence of mind to do the right thing.

The reason why most people lose is because they don't have the real life insticts to remember to shield, or tumble, or to cast serpent, or to crush instead of a regular hit. I'm omnitrans, yet when it comes to fighting I tend to only remember my bonecrusher skills. I forget about atheletcis and my third skillset.. let alone environment or discippline or anything else that might give me an edge. My mind just blanks on them.

For that reason, Passive affects make you much stronger than active because you can have more of your mind worrying about healing and escaping instead of what your next attack will be.

I'll test Ciaran's wounding via two assaults to an unstanced/unparried but greathelmed head with him today and post the log and note the conditions.

To an extent, it more sounds like you need more experience at fighting to be honest. Yes passive is arguably easier to learn to fight as(A strong argument, you need to learn to work offense around it) and it does have that upper hand. But the passive alone doesn't accomplish much if anything without the proper active offense to accompany it.

Right, but if you have an army of warriors vs an army of warriors with mostly passive attacks, I believe the passive army will win. Even if the 'same players' are doing both sides.

I am sure if I was involved in combat for 3 or 4 years of playing, passive or active would not make a difference... however, these games are RARELY played for 3 to 4 years by most people within the same fighting system.

It depends really, I am talking about 1 vs 1, groups with passive > groups without. That is given.

Re-define passive offense for me. Like geomancer demesne?

Yes, or fae, angels demons ect.

Yeah anyway



It depends on if a series of stability-based qualities are to be found in the warrior team with passive attacks. It takes patience, paced thought and plotting to play a good defense..and passive offense is best wielded in a defensive state, letting them come to you and so on.

For instance, there have been four or five Serens on Faethorn holding a demesne or some such, me and Pentu will storm in. Now, if this group had the solidity to remain together and support eachother at all times we'd both get slaughtered, but I know that if I shank the hell out of Serenwilder A(the biggest and baddest seren present), he'll get scared and leave the room to heal. I pursue, slaughter him. Pentu's broken the demesne by then, the others begin to freak out and scatter. I pursue, and slaughter them all individually. In this instance, I was all offensive-active, and so was my partner. I've experience similar outcomes in several other alike situations, but it's like Daganev said: Really depends on your capacity to remember to use all your stuff, or just what all you can do.

Ciaran tells you, "I'll just kill you with my 2 assault behead anyways."

It was actually you who died afterwards to my 5 hit combo; quickening amissio amissio amissio absolve.

Lunge rleg x 4 = Thoros sushi.

and -anyone- can do that. That's the funny part. Any goon with enough might can school you, Thoros.

Hey Chang hun, isn't that a bad sign with anyone with might can school our third best fighter? (I personally rank Celestines as Amaru>Anisu>Thoros, though Thoros has gotten alot more kills out over deathsight, I think Anisu has the mad skills.)
I mean doesn't that like point at some major suckage? Hey hun, would you mind doing that to me in the arena, I wanna see how bad it hurts?
I think in the hands of someone with a nice system and decent combat ability, passive with active stack would own about anything. Two exmaples..
Celestines/Nihilists- we got Archangel/Archdemon wrath and quickchange afflicts, ONTOP of Tarot and Celestialism/Nihilism, so we can have our angel/demon poind the tar out of you, while we decide if we want to rub soulless a few times. If the fight turns bad we could always turn to amissio or something, if we had enough power that is.

This example sucks but... I have tested this, from Diablo 2 Exp.LOD
lv 99 Paladin with total defense at 1500, thorns aura at 23 and 1.2k hp
lv 99 Paladin with total defense at 1500, NO PASSIVE, and 1.2k hp
the one with no thorns beat the pizzle out of the one with thorns, because his active combat was severly hindered, though he could return 1.2k damage each hit, such effects could be negated, such as with lv 21 Zeal (goes through auras) or with lv 22 Vengance (thorns only triggers the first phys strike, not the elem strikes)

That doesn't really help the passive/active in lusty argument, but I would rather have a little passive with some nice active, or be virtually 100% passive or 100% passive... but in general I feel passive is better in the hands of the lamers like me, but active would seriously OWN>>>>passive in the hands of someone skilled.
love-mimi
PS: Ya..someone said give us all greathelms...ya do that, and then watch how bad mages/celestines rape you warriors...our head is like a tactical weakness, kind of like your weakness to being tied down with web/hangedman/aeon/hangedman/web/aeon/sleep/hangedman etc etc etc.

For a long time, I was the best fighter in the Ebonguard. For an even longer time, I was the second best.

There are bad signs like these in many guilds.

Xenthos likes to mislead people into thinking he isn't the super-saiyan of swordskill.

And yeah it is, mimi. I'm just recalling how easy it is to kill Thoros for me because he decided to be a punk in what had been at least relatively a mature thread. Then yknow, Thoros has to run his diaper-wearing arse in:

"pwnt u wtf roflroflroflroflilovetopoopmypants"

That isn't because something is overpowered. It's because THoros sucks. Anisu dosn't go down in four lunges, heck she dosn't go down in ten. Amaru? No way.

Ahhh I see, still would like you to 4xlunge me, in the arena sometime though, just so i can get a gauge as to what it is your all talkin about, as it applied to ME personally.
love-mimi

Sure. <3


Edit: How did it have to do with you personally?

mimi = Thoros!??

Thoros still has a way to go, but I know him OOC and he is a good fighters, trust me on that one (I'm not going to reveal his characters)

He also has a lot of potential, and once he transes out he will be a lot better, so quit with the hating or i'll he-bitch man-slap you.


As far as greathelms go, everyone used to be able to wear them, it makes behead a bit harder but i think it would be a much wanted solution.

Personally it would require in some cases i pull out the mangle lock on someone before nailing their head.

Yeah right, if anything you're Lockjaw, Murph.

But alright, no hating.

I don't know what you mean by 'quickchange afflicts', but. You won't really kill any good fighter with soulless. They'll manage to leave most of the time.
Also, if you want to keep up Wrath for the majority of the fight, it means you can't use power for anything else.

Everyone could use greathelms for a long time and I didn't notice any ownage of warriors. For reference, I don't want that change reverted. We get greatrobes hoods. Greatrobes+fullhelm was kind of weird.

Heeeeeeee'res SOLUTION.

Lower all pre-nerf weapon stats to maximum post-nerf weapon stats. Remove all artifacts from said pre-nerf weapons and place them in the inventory of the warrior. For a week, give them the opportunity to be refunded (in full) the credits that rune cost them, or re-attach. And for christ's sake, reduce the effectiveness of the Champion helms, they're fugging stupid. They now outrank Guardian/Wiccan champ pets in terms of stupid overpoweredness. (Except the Handmaiden. God I hate that bitch.)

firstly helms = handmaiden in my opinion.



Secondly, I personally think lowering the stats is a Very Bad Idea ™

The post nerf weapons make warriors SUCK, I made some the other day for a bit of a test, I spent like a RL day or 2 forging for some nice stats, and even with the champ helm I couldn't get anywhere on anyone decent wounds and affliction wise.

The current caps are far too low to be useful in combat.

If i got a choice to refund my weapon credits i spent with the nerf situation, I wouldn't get weapons. I would take those credits, and trade them for achaean credits and quit lusti, the current weapon caps are rubbish for 1 handers.