Orcae2006-03-23 03:02:50
QUOTE(Rauros @ Mar 22 2006, 09:53 PM) 272252
Guardians are pretty much restricted to group combat in the higher tiers. I've only known one Guardian to ever be able to hold his own in a one-on-one situation (Amaru, but he also has help from the Handmaiden).
Thorgal and Eiru were pretty good as nihilists.
Oh, Nars, please tell us the exact formulae for amissio and leech so everyone else can stop speculating?
Yrael2006-03-23 03:47:31
QUOTE(Narsrim @ Mar 23 2006, 01:29 PM) 272447
That's really generalized. Nihilists get the tail, torture (and with sensitivity, its pretty nice), etc. Nihilists also get putrefaction, which is a 45% damage reduction to cutting/blunt + demonscales (10%). Celestines just get halo (10%) so they are by far 10x more frail.
Halo is to all damage, and you've got numen, which doesn't have a health drain. Demonscales is also 10% to cutting/blunt. We both have draconis. Sacrifice is a joke, no more or less about it. please don't use that word against anyone who has ever typed "declare".
Although I do remember Guido's first edition newspaper after Amaru whinged over the nasty dirty Alger/Daevos/Someone else trampling, crucifying and sacrificing. Kwee-hee-hee.
Narsrim2006-03-23 04:11:30
QUOTE(Xavius @ Mar 22 2006, 09:54 PM) 272456
Halo's 20%, just FYI, but Narsrim's right. Nihilists do just fine, even if sacrifice is more or less a joke.
Halo = Demonscales, and I believe it is 10-15%. Hajamin posted what it was at one point because people were coming up with absurd bonuses that just weren't there... it may be 20%, but it seems to me it was lower. I'll try and find it.
Yrael2006-03-23 04:17:25
No, halo is not demonscales. Demonscales is to cutting/blunt. Halo is to everything. Halo is 10%. I think Demonscales is 15/15 or so.
Narsrim2006-03-23 04:22:21
QUOTE(Yrael @ Mar 22 2006, 11:17 PM) 272516
No, halo is not demonscales. Demonscales is to cutting/blunt. Halo is to everything. Halo is 10%. I think Demonscales is 15/15 or so.
Hajamin told me in person once that demonscales was the same exact thing as halo when we were testing something he wanted to check out.
Yrael2006-03-23 04:24:34
In that case, I'll take my damage reduction now, kthx. Perhaps he meant to, but never got around to it? I checked then, I took the same damage from Xerine (within 20 points of each time) everytime he cosmicfired me, twice with, twice without demonscales.
Narsrim2006-03-23 04:31:49
QUOTE(Yrael @ Mar 22 2006, 11:24 PM) 272520
In that case, I'll take my damage reduction now, kthx. Perhaps he meant to, but never got around to it? I checked then, I took the same damage from Xerine (within 20 points of each time) everytime he cosmicfired me, twice with, twice without demonscales.
And did you test to see if Halo effected cosmic fire?
Yrael2006-03-23 04:37:05
That's what we used for the test. I already know it affects physical damage.
Xavius2006-03-23 05:11:26
The AB for halo quite clearly states that it affects all damage, and it worked as intended when I last had it. Never had dragonscales, so I can't say much there.
Halo's 20%. There are complaints from the forums in days past about the discrepancy between the two.
Halo's 20%. There are complaints from the forums in days past about the discrepancy between the two.
Yrael2006-03-23 05:12:25
Syntax: CHANT DRACONIS
Cover your body in numinous draconic scales, adding a layer of protection
against magical damage.
Perhaps that's what you're thinking of, Narsrim?
Narsrim2006-03-23 05:30:07
QUOTE(Xavius @ Mar 23 2006, 12:11 AM) 272529
The AB for halo quite clearly states that it affects all damage, and it worked as intended when I last had it. Never had dragonscales, so I can't say much there.
Is it really that hard to post a log? I mean, I see no need to continue arguing on assumptions.
Xavius2006-03-23 05:31:08
Well...actually, as a Blacktalon enemied to Celest, yes. 
Narsrim2006-03-23 05:32:21
QUOTE(Xavius @ Mar 23 2006, 12:31 AM) 272536
Well...actually, as a Blacktalon enemied to Celest, yes.
In any case, I think at most we will find that the damage reduction on physical damage from demonscales ~= halo's reduction on damage. It really doesn't matter.
The point is that demonscales + putrefaction >>>>>>>>> halo and as such Nihilists are defensively >>>>>>>> Celestines.
ferlas2006-03-23 09:21:48
QUOTE(Xavius @ Mar 23 2006, 02:54 AM) 272456
Halo's 20%, just FYI, but Narsrim's right. Nihilists do just fine, even if sacrifice is more or less a joke.
Nilhists do fine but compared to celestines they are much less powerful Is what I said. The damage reduction both classes isnt that much different, I can search out a log of a celestine with full defs taking ixions swords in the combat logs forum. Both classes defence is decent but celests offensce is far more powerful. And as you said sacrafice is a joke so they are down to soulless and wrack for killing moves which is much less than the killing moves a celestine can do, absolve is just generally better than wrack despite the power difference, souless is the same and inquisistion gives celestines more options to work with.
Narsrim2006-03-23 09:39:48
QUOTE(ferlas @ Mar 23 2006, 04:21 AM) 272592
Nilhists do fine but compared to celestines they are much less powerful Is what I said. The damage reduction both classes isnt that much different, I can search out a log of a celestine with full defs taking ixions swords in the combat logs forum. Both classes defence is decent but celests offensce is far more powerful. And as you said sacrafice is a joke so they are down to soulless and wrack for killing moves which is much less than the killing moves a celestine can do, absolve is just generally better than wrack despite the power difference, souless is the same and inquisistion gives celestines more options to work with.
You have no idea whatsoever.
Nihilists have an additional 45% resistance from cutting and blunt. That is nearly half damage. You may find a log where it is about the same - because putrefaction isn't up.
=====================================================================
Nihilists can also kill through raw damage. With sensitivity and omen, cosmic fire does good damage. Furthermore, it boosts how much damage/bleeding torture do. With omen and sensitivity, Thoros said his Nihilists alt could pull 1000-1200 bleeding per cast. Two hit of that is pretty nasty.
ferlas2006-03-23 09:52:24
K ill get the log of the celestine tanking ixion in a few hours you get the log of the nilishts causing a lot of bleeding then killing someone decent with it?
Just give me a moment to find it.
Just give me a moment to find it.
Yrael2006-03-23 09:52:38
Then Thoros is lying, because 450 bleeding is the highest I've ever gotten, at night, with a blessing for 19 int, and sensitivity (Hexed) and an omen up, with 1600~ odd damage. He's obviously talking about multiple tortures.
Drago2006-03-23 10:01:18
QUOTE
5935h, 1403m, 2646e, 10p, 18974en elrxkp-
Yrael points at you and shoves a hideous archdemon towards you. Wicked steel implements appear in
his claws as he jumps on you, then begins to carve deeply and slowly into your flesh. You scream and
convulse in abject agony during this obscene
torture.
4491h, 1403m, 2646e, 10p, 18974en elrxkp-
As soon as you begin the ritual of Puella, small aches and pains vanish from your body until you
feel purified and whole.
5352h, 1358m, 2646e, 10p, 18984en lrxkp-
You take a drink from a turquoise vial.
The potion heals and soothes you.
5935h, 1358m, 2646e, 10p, 18984en lrxkp-
You bleed 376 health.
5559h, 1358m, 2646e, 10p, 18984en lrxkp-
Yrael points at you and shoves a hideous archdemon towards you. Wicked steel implements appear in
his claws as he jumps on you, then begins to carve deeply and slowly into your flesh. You scream and
convulse in abject agony during this obscene
torture.
4491h, 1403m, 2646e, 10p, 18974en elrxkp-
As soon as you begin the ritual of Puella, small aches and pains vanish from your body until you
feel purified and whole.
5352h, 1358m, 2646e, 10p, 18984en lrxkp-
You take a drink from a turquoise vial.
The potion heals and soothes you.
5935h, 1358m, 2646e, 10p, 18984en lrxkp-
You bleed 376 health.
5559h, 1358m, 2646e, 10p, 18984en lrxkp-
QUOTE
5935h, 1426m, 2646e, 10p, 19154en elrxkp-
Yrael grabs some glowing glyphs and throws them at you.
A prickly, stinging sensation spreads through your body.
5935h, 1426m, 2646e, 10p, 19154en elrxkp-
Yrael takes a drink from a bloodstone vial.
5935h, 1401m, 2646e, 10p, 19154en elrxkp-
Yrael pronounces that you are under an ill omen, and a sense of imminent foreboding descends upon
you.
5935h, 1401m, 2646e, 10p, 19164en elrxkp-
Yrael points at you and shoves a hideous archdemon towards you. Wicked steel implements appear in
his claws as he jumps on you, then begins to carve deeply and slowly into your flesh. You scream and
convulse in abject agony during this obscene
torture.
3055h, 1404m, 2646e, 10p, 19174en elrxkp-
You take a drink from a turquoise vial.
The potion heals and soothes you.
3981h, 1404m, 2646e, 10p, 19174en elrxkp-
As soon as you begin the ritual of Puella, small aches and pains vanish from your body until you
feel purified and whole.
5159h, 1359m, 2646e, 10p, 19174en lrxkp-
You bleed 345 health.
4814h, 1402m, 2646e, 10p, 19184en lrxkp-
Yrael grabs some glowing glyphs and throws them at you.
A prickly, stinging sensation spreads through your body.
5935h, 1426m, 2646e, 10p, 19154en elrxkp-
Yrael takes a drink from a bloodstone vial.
5935h, 1401m, 2646e, 10p, 19154en elrxkp-
Yrael pronounces that you are under an ill omen, and a sense of imminent foreboding descends upon
you.
5935h, 1401m, 2646e, 10p, 19164en elrxkp-
Yrael points at you and shoves a hideous archdemon towards you. Wicked steel implements appear in
his claws as he jumps on you, then begins to carve deeply and slowly into your flesh. You scream and
convulse in abject agony during this obscene
torture.
3055h, 1404m, 2646e, 10p, 19174en elrxkp-
You take a drink from a turquoise vial.
The potion heals and soothes you.
3981h, 1404m, 2646e, 10p, 19174en elrxkp-
As soon as you begin the ritual of Puella, small aches and pains vanish from your body until you
feel purified and whole.
5159h, 1359m, 2646e, 10p, 19174en lrxkp-
You bleed 345 health.
4814h, 1402m, 2646e, 10p, 19184en lrxkp-
Narsrim2006-03-23 10:04:21
Well Thoros was obviously on crack, but none the less: 1200 damage + 345 bleeding isn't bad.
ferlas2006-03-23 10:11:00
Its about 30% total damage + 300 bleeding to his health for 5 power and against no curing, that dosnt seem that good to me
