Considering that my sources of information are large and varied and you don't know what they are, I'll let that slide.. However, whenver I have quoted a website I have stated thier personal bias and point of view, the website that Penelope quoted is made to look like a generic peace website, however if you look at it closely and see where its comming from, you will see that it is indeed NOT a non-profit org, and is an islamic website. I don't mind if you state where your comming from, but I'd rather not have people pretending to be people they are not.

Where exactly did I mention the mistreatment of Israel and Jews?

The moral equivilancies you like to make are rediculous. Its like comparing the Jews for Jesus missionaries with the Inquisition.. They just arn't comparable save to say that they were both "christan groups" who's goal it was to spread "christianity"

Again, let me state clearly that there is large distinction between people who live in civilized countries and governments that are run by warlords and dictators which are there just because if they were not, every segment of the population would be out there killing eachother. Just look at the "demonstrations" they put on... Kill burn destroy, thats all they appear to know how to do.

I would LOVE to see one peacefull arab protest, just one.

I don't think I can be particularly blamed for an arab saying that goes back 1,000 years that basically says "Enter my house so I may stab you when you leave"

The opinion over here is that we were lied to by the british and american goverments conning us into going to a war with paticularly dodgy motives.



No sweety, as Mr Simpsion the cartoonist said, bush is putting us out of business you just cant make up satire as stupid as some of the stuff he actually does.



I wouldnt say worse but the general opionion over here is that yea he's a warmonger and cares nothing for personal freedoms or human rights.

They are being completely hypocritical if they are saying that the reason they attacked sadam as purely ethical or for a "preemptive strike" Which is pretty stupid in the first place, there are far worse threats to the civilized world than him in fact some of the worse threats have been funded and are still supported by certain western governments

You are such a bigot. I am disgusted how you always try and make anything Arabic or Islamic in nature automatically "bad." Furthermore, I suppose there are no such thing as Islamic non-profit organizations either.

I'd also like to see just how you even came to the realization it is an islamic website. Do you have some special sixth sense for it?

Yeah, the countries lead by dictators and warlords KNOW they're lead by dictators and warlords.There have been several, your view of them is just obscured by the fact that it's a lot more beneficial for the media to show "arabs" rioting then being peaceful. Nothing like enforcing a sterotype.Wow, judging people by their sayings? That's rather entertaining.

"Wasn't surprised that the driver was an arab." What, do you just attribute everything that goes wrong to an arab? It rained on your picnic, it must've been an arab. A bird crapped on me, it must've been an arab. I was too stupid to realise I shouldn't walk behind a car, it must've been an arab's fault.

People like you enforce the view of Americans being bigotted assholes.

Iraq has oil. And it looked as though it would be a push over.



Absolutely spot on.

Each year, on the 12 of October (Day of the death of our local 40 years fascist dictator and mass murderer Francisco Franco) there's a demonstration by ultra-right fascists conmemorating his death. This demonstration is acompanied by riots, racist insults, destruction of public equipment (and private equipment as well) in the main spanish cities. Also, of course, there's the anti-fascist ultra-left comitee rioting and demonstrating as well while the police tries to keep them apart.

In exchange, I've seen arabs in demonstrations against the terrorist violence both of ETA and AQ, and also against the Irak war that the general population didn't support.

I could almost say that even in the most peaceful demonstration in spain, in each of them, there's a riot at some point or the other, destroying things and stuff like that, most of the times by people who are there just to cause public alarm (they go to all demonstrations, independently of the reason behind it, and just attack the police).

Does that mean that all spaniards are unable to make a demonstration without a riot? Or even better, all white men? Or that we have our fair share of idiots?

I've seen plenty.

Daganev.. I -really- think you should sit out of any thread that involves any mention of Islam. We all know what you think.. and we all know that you aren't amenable to any sort of exchange of views. So just take a step back and leave the real world threads alone.

That's actually a good idea. Real world threads mentioning Islam or Islam related stuff or any other racial/cultural stuff or international politics.
They're only a few after all.

And just to clarify, I looked over that website, and I can't find any super secret Islamic indicators (although I suppose it is worth noting I have no special training nor have read any literature on how to detect hidden Islamic-ness).

Daganev brought the whole anti-Islamic/Arabic stuff into this thread. It is a common trend where if he doesn't agree with something, it is of Arabic or Islamic origin... and only he can detect it *peer*

You know daganev, your statements, especially those about Arabs show how intolerant you are to other cultures.

Oh and as to peacefull protests by Muslims, I was with the peacekeeping troups (although i was in a medical facility rather then barring streets) that where meaned to defend NATO HQ in Brussels when the anti-war in Iraq protest was there. And there wasn't any violence involved. Infact it was a lot more peacefull then many other protests where.

And now I'm going to get some lunch with my Arab coworker since he always makes me laugh.

Watch out Penelope, making you laugh could be part of a dire plot to take over the breakroom

No one dares say anything negative about Jewish people, even if the comment is true or partly true. When Steven Speilberg directed a movie on the reaction to the murders of Israeli athletes in Munich more than 30 years ago, commentators like neo-conservative ideologue Charles Krauthammer complained that Spielberg had sided with the Palestinians, which is a nono.

Spielberg was criticized even though his movie was not remotely racist. Other have had their careers destroyed, and recently a historian who denied the reality of the Holocaust (a bigoted position, no doubt) actually went to jail. (J. Mohawk, Indian Country Today, 2006)

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There seems to be a rather common mindset among a great portion of peoples (though certainly not all), not just from singular posters on this forum, that anything not specifically Jewish supported is 'Arab/Palestine/etc' supported and endorsed, and must be considered bad. And it has hurt a lot of people.

I'm going to say the same thing I did in our latest debate on the issue, and I rather doubt it will be liked, but it honestly needs to be said.

'Get Over It. Stop acting the same way you accuse those you hate of being. Yes, terrible things happened to your culture, it's happened to plenty of them at one point or another. It doesn't give you the right to take things to the extreme you have, to the point you are ruining lives because someone doesn't immediately jump to defend your culture and people, rather than try see the situation through the eyes of everyone involved.'

I'm rather tired of being, and seeing others accused of being Bias towards the 'other' view in that sort of situation, simply because I refuse to be biased to the view of my accusers, and try to look at things from both sides. I'm sure everyone else is, as well.

I voted for Bush, but only because he won the coin toss at the voting booth.

Are you saying Americans dont riot? If so I suggest you read up on the Tulsa Race Riots

Phht...I conquered the breakroom last week and designated it the Queendom of Pendalopolous. I'll be anexing the warehouse next week and hope to seize control of the managers' office this week in a hostile takeover.

Yeah, back in the 60's there were a lot of riots. Also, there was a really big one in L.A in I think the 80's.

Too long, didn't read.

But my opinion is that Sadaam had to go. Read up on some of the stuff he did, it was terrible. Read up on him, and his sons, the whole regime. Is it worse now? I don't know. Are people being dragged out of their houses at night and killed, along with their family, because someone spoke negatively of Sadaam? I don't know either, but I imagine that it's either stopped, or much less now.

I'm all for going after the bad guys, but... I don't know, this war has been long and costly, and usually someone "wins". Maybe we're expecting too much too soon, because wars take years, many times. In this age, we can all publically express our opinions easilly to a large audience, and there's a whole lot of bitching going on right now.

So really, I have no opinion. I hope the good guys win, the bad guys go down, and our fate once again, is in the hands of the politicians, because most Amercians (or, humans perhaps?) are too blind/ignorant/stupid to grasp the whole situation.

I think it was April 26th 1992. The Rodney King affair if that is what you are referring to.

I just remember hearing about riots in L.A, I guess that was the one I was thinking of.

If tomorrow you were asked to give the deciding vote in whether the United States would go to war with:

China, Cuba, North Korea, Iran, Syrria, and countless other countries, would you vote yes? If the answer is no, then I argue that what Sadaam did is therefore irrelevant. There are lots of bad people in the world. He certainly did nothing "special" compared to most of them.