Though I'm very busy dealing with all the little bugs that crop up when a project goes live, especially one of this magnitude, I thought I'd best get this thread started off now so you can all put your initial impressions up.

Basically, there are a LOT of variables in this system - I'm willing to change and balance everything from essence costs, to equilibrium delays, to number of sanctified rooms required for powers, to durations of powers (currently everything is at one hour). Please do test to check you know what you're talking about before you post, and don't post ideas for new shrine powers at this time.

I really like the system so far. One thing I noticed that is changed is that offering to sanctify doesn't give karma. Didn't it used to? If so, could it be changed to give karma again? It was a nice incentive to keep shrines up.

Do the sanctified rooms require the same amount of essence to defile when fully as a normal fully sanctified shrine? If so, it's going to be essentially impossible to actually take down a shrine with the area around it completely sanctified.

Something funky happened while we were raising a new shrine. First off, erecting a shrine now seems to be interruptable...had rebounding going at the time that I tried to erect, and smoking the pipe right after I erected interrupted the whole process. It still sapped my willpower though

That wasn't that big a deal. What happened later was odd though. We recharged my willpower, I erected again. The shrine rose, and people started offering to sanctify. Then, I nodded. Again, I got the message "You cease erecting a shrine."

Aw crap...But then, we were able to continue sanctifying it to full power. So I'm assuming that it was just a bug or something?


Oh, one thing that I'm not sure on, haven't tested it personally, cause, well, I'm not about to go defile my own sanctified rooms. But the help scroll says that any room connected to two other sanctified rooms cannot be defiled? Well...on Celestia we have that nice diamond of rooms around the pool, each is connected to two other sanctified rooms. Does this mean they're all impossible to defile? Cause that'd be nifty an' all, but I doubt that was the intent.

Can we make the colors of sanctified rooms adjustable? War rooms look too much like taint.

Well, I just tested the shrine defilement thing, and I was right, those sanc'd rooms around the pool on Celestia are invulnerable to defilement.


Also, a question...if we were going to raise multiple shrines in the same area, and then start sanctifying rooms around them...what happens when the two spheres of sanctification meet? Currently it's just sanctifying each room based off what shrine sanc type is next to it, but what if two different types are next to the room you want to sanctify?


Confusing, yes, lemme illustrate. 5 rooms, A, B, C, D, E, arranged east to west in alpha order. Room A has a War shrine, room E has a shield shrine. I move to B, offer to sanctify, making that room sanc'd by the war shrine. I move to D, offer to sanc, and it's a room sanc'd by the shield shrine.

What happens when I move to C and try to offer to sanc that room too? I think it needs a specification in the command line, or something different entirely. Otherwise i'm going to get really mad when I'm 1 room away from accessing specific order powers but can't expand it cause it's too close to other shrines.

Yeah, I keep thinking some smartass forested the Necropolis.

It's a case of the Achaean Forestal Panic of Logosmas like when the forestals thought the red holly berries were forest fires.

That was hilarious.

I froze many a grove back then.

I think 15 rooms is too many, personally. Having to defile the equivalent of 15 shrines before having any effect, while others can resanctify... it seems a little difficult.

Items imbued with 100% esteem make this easier, but it still seems like a lot.

The way I understood the announce post it souned like you can have as many sanctified rooms in an area as you want, but the most powerfull skills require 15, is that correct, or incorrect?

I dunno, right now I'm testing some of the order powers...

Celerity took 5 rooms, and 50k essence.
Protection took 5 rooms, and 20k essence.


Kinda essence heavy on the celerity. Wanted to get timestamps of how much faster it is, exactly, but dun have the time to figure out how to do that right with zmud. Protection is nice though. Makes em whiff a lot more, maybe 1 in 4 attacks gets affected and whiffs due to protection.

Whoah, ok. Just finished testing my shield shrine, and I expect it's similar for the other shrines too.


Personal powers

Protection - 20k essence - 5 rooms sanctified requirement
Celerity - 50k - 5 room sanctified requirement


Area powers

Herald - 50k - 7 rooms
Pacification 100k - 10 rooms
Armour 200k - 15 rooms


Wow. That's a damned lot of rooms for the good powers. I expect the hierarchy of area powers for healing shrines will be Lifeforce>replenish>allcure, and war will be Wrath>Gravity>Distort, with similar room req's and essence costs. Anyone know if travelling through pillars still counts as a room nextdoor?

Since it requires 15 rooms for the big effects, its totally a LOT harder than I thought it was... in fact, instead of too easy... it might be too hard.

And if you think about it, the shrine location means crap now. You want the fringe to be at a protect place because its the first place they have to defile.

Hmmm, I'm gonna have to push for a lowering on the requirements for # of sanctified rooms for the order powers. I mean, 15 is a LOT of rooms, and having to power all those up so the fringes can't be defiled at whim is going to take a lot of time. Especially since it seems that sanctifying takes a bunch more essence now.

I like how it'll force the order to pick and choose which shrines/powers to use in critical areas, Like, Celestia has 25 rooms total, not including supernal rooms. Oh, and it's 15 rooms PLUS the shrine room. So one fully power war shrine will limit the other shrine to 9 rooms total, which allows either a shield shrine capable of herald or a healing shrine with allcure.

Interesting, yeah. But then if we get raided, all they have to do is offer a couple heavily imbued bottles and bam, our war shrine loses the ability to Wrath.


Oh, and the 2-room connection invulnerability to defiling needs to be fixed. I've already figured out a way to raise a 15 room connected shrine on Celestia that would never be broken, since every room is connected to at least 2 others.

If you lower the room requirements too much, then once an area is fully sanctified it would be too strong wouldn't it?

If you have all 25 rooms focused on just war, then the raiders need to defile 10 rooms before they can weaken the affects.

Max number of rooms sanctified per shrine=15.

Already tried adding more, so no, they wouldn't have to defile 10 rooms first. Just one.


It just seems to me that this system, while a lot of good things happened, just made it so that

1) No more worldburn *teardrop* (I used to love burning away an entire raiding party, especially if Raz gets a couple squishes in too)

2) Instead we get wrath, which I'm guessing is pretty much the same thing, maybe toned down a bit?

3) But now, whereas before, Mag raiders could rush in, fully defile a shrine and then have 5ish rooms of safety from worldburn, they can now rush in and fully defile a single room, and remove Wrath from the equation completely. Of course, we could just grab a quick corpse, and re-sanc another room and then Wrath em, but if Celestia's jammed up with shrine rooms, I dunno if it'll be feasible.


So it just seems like it's similar to the old system, but now we have more vulnerable spots, and the powers cost a lot more? I'd love the combo of Wrath + Distort, but that'll drop Terentia a cool 250k essence...



Couple questions. Does breaking the room requirement while a power is under affect remove that power? Like say I had Wrathed with 15 rooms already, but then they somehow manage to defile a room fully, dropping it down to 14 rooms. Does wrath go away?

Also, does Distort prevent cubix'ing? I wanna test, but sadly, I don't have a cubix to play with.

You can try, maybe it was allowed in the coding, but inside the each pillar is a -different- local area.



26, actually.

Two concerns. One, we've created an unbreakable War loop in Ethereal Glomdoring. And two, you can defile from the trees (and presumably the sky as well).

Edit: And I'm really tired from a massive lack of sleep over the last couple of days, so sorry for not giving much more information... I'm pretty much wiped at the moment. :/