Well, lets start off with this disclaimer... these are ideas, and with that in mind, I don't expect any, or all, to be taken as they are presented here. Even if they are, not all of them should be, as combined they may be to much, not that us druids wouldn't mind being overpowered a bit, might get Hartstone fighter numbers up again.


So, onto the point.

Druids are faced now with an issue, and I speak mostly for Hartstone. Right now we are faced with the fact that we are not offensively capable as we should be. Yes it is true, we can be powerful and deadly, but anyone with anywhere near a decent system is only going to be slowed. We have trouble keeping enemies in the demesne, at least I do, but that comes from being used to far larger demesnes. We have trouble actually killing unless we sap them to the point where their healing is just far enough off that a lucky shot can finish them. On top of this, out of the mage/druid grouping, we have the hardest demesne to fight with, having to fight at two elevations constantly, the trees and the ground. While this is not a problem, the ecology skill set is crippled in the trees because smudges do not work up there. Dreamweaving is a power hog that can be useful, but is still iffy at best, and then runes... well enough poeople have been ranting about runes. Now I am not saying buff all of these skills, I am saying they should be looked at. Small things will make a huge difference.

We will start with the 'third' skill, and then make our way into Druidry. (Stag I actually have no problem with, although I would like a few more defs in there, but that comes from me just wanting a longer def list.)

Ecology: I will probably have the most commentary here as this is the one I am currently using. There are only a few things that I think would greatly affect this skill. First off, make smudges work in trees too. Since druids should spend more time in the trees fighting then on the ground, this seems to be a logical change. Next, let us target smudges so that they follow the person cast on. I think a 'targeted' smudge should cost 1 or 2 power. It is frustrating with the burn time, a good fighter sees the smudge, and leaves the run or shields. Sometimes you get lucky. Also, I would like to suggest the burn time on the smudges be random... either short, medium length, what they are now or longer. This should help the whole 'run away' and come back aspect.

Familiars, I'd like to do more with these, but it is stupid to bring them into a fight as it has the great potential of hurting you far more then benefiting you. Perhaps we should have some kind of mutual benefit that if they are near, we get damage resistance, extra health, extra mana, something so that we have a reason to drag them along with us instead of locking them up in the guild hall to keep them safe and having 10 badgers in the gathering room.

Dreamweaving: Didn't spend much time with this... the power cost should go on creating dream motes. They are not really powerful enough to warrant that cost. (Perhaps the blackout one is, but that can still have a power cost.) Instead, perhaps have a power cost for entering dreamform.

Onto Druidry, for Hartstone... don't know Blacktalan at all.

First off, our demesnes I think need a minor... very very minor boost in output. I am not saying add 500 more damage per 10 seconds (which aint all that much) I am talking something that was suggested in another thread. Give out things like hemophilia so the massive bleed damage druids do can be used. Our unique point, and strongest 'attack' can be cured with 800 mana, an enchantment, and an herb before it does squat. Also some kind of useful 'instant' kill should be in place here... but as that was debated in detail in another thread, I will leave at that here.

These are a few basic ideas, thoughts and such?

First off, you should've waited until the envoychange to druids before posting this, they already announced a new skill.

Anyway, let me move to your points.

Ecology: It's already very nice for out of demesne fighting, and in a demesne it's good enough as well, you don't really need to add or take anything away, with the right poison you can kill enemies easily, and if you treebane someone, echo and time it, you can hit them with smudges easily, as well.

Dreamweaving: Dreamweaving is a GREAT skillset for druids. Blackout mote, deepsleep, epilepsy, all those skills are simply awesome. 5 deepsleeps and anyone sleeps, an easy target for sap. With Blackout you can shut off their curing for a few seconds.

Runes: It isn't too bad for druids, an impatience rune when swarm hits can be effective.

Stag: Great skills as well, you should use stagstomp more, gore seems nice too. Facepaints can't be disregarded.

Druidry: Of course, your demesne is subpar to Blacktalon, but you have Darkseed, which is very nice, you have pathtwist which is nice for some nifty tactics (pathtwisting into guards, anyone?) and you get your cudgel there. But true, your demesne is one of the worst, I'd say.

Gore is bleh. Anyone in range of the instakill on it is sapped or crap, and are dying either way regardless. It's nice, but I never once saw a use for it, especially with the power cost on it.

Gore is not very useful... and stagstomp is used a lot. (Also, the impale at less then 50% health implies us not moving before they writhe off... so if we don't have a buddy, not useful....)

Like I said, Stag I have no problem with.

I also didn't mention anything about massivly changing skills, just little minor things that will give druids a little more versitility.

The Bane idea is not a great idea either because it requires an absurd amount of coordination with how our demesne work..

Treebane them, go down, drop smude and vine them...just try to time it with treelife. Not that much coordination.

Use stagstomp right after you sap or vine, utilize fetishes/berserkerfetish a little more.. Druids really aren't that bad off. your demesne is a bit subpar, but it can still hinder and paralyze.

You seem to be missing the point... it takes me 2.5 seconds to make a smudge, treebane has eq balence (not sure on the number will check when orientation is over) plus the eq balence of the vines... by the time the smudge goes off, they are back in the trees...

Then make the smudge beforehand and then drop it?
Okay, let's say you make the smudge.

2.5 seconds making the smudge
4 seconds neutral equi.
4 seconds vine.

10.5 seconds.

Just vine them before you treebane then, or don't use treelife and work entirely with raise cudgel.
The point is, why do you whine instead of trying to use your skills? Ecology is fucking sweet, same for dreamweaving.

I am not whining... if I was whining I would not of spent the time to present my ideas in the manner I did. I presented ideas I thought to bring us up a little on par with the mages, which right now are superior to druids. Now don't mistake me, I don't want to be identical, and I don't want to be stronger then the mages... I do want the communes to have similarly powered demesne users.

Ecology is great, and I love it. The Fetish is good most of the time... it has a few toxins that are not all that useful, but more or less it is good, even without berserk. I love smudges, but against a half way decent fighter... smudges a massive pain in the ass to pull off. And yes your plan for the smudge would work... but how many good fighters stay webed/vined for 10 seconds? Do you?

You get my point now?

From what it looks like the new Druid skill will let them kill without Sap if it's the one the Envoys are excited about. Just wait a little bit longer and see how it all plays out.

Actually, Gore from a high strength race is pretty badass. As a Tae'dae with 19 str on the test server, I was doing 1.6k through Greatrobes.

Notice people I did not talk about the druidry group to much because I was sure the new skill would be there. But that is one skill... I was throwing out ideas for the others. One instant kill isn't going to suddenly make druids par again, just bring us closer.

Meh, the only thing that's a difference for us is the third skillset. Druid demesnes are for afflictions, mage demesnes for damage, basically. You afflict nicely, sap helps that. We do damage nicely. Psionics isn't that great either, I only have it for bashing. I'd rather be dreamweaver to be honest. Same as a druid, dreamweaving is basically the best choice, I'd say. Ecology is a bit complicated to deal with, but it has its uses.

Runes is better for a Blacktalon.

Actually I'd still say Dreamweaving is better, just because of deepsleep and blackout.

Personally, I feel Hartstone have fallen to be the weakest of the Mage/Druids. Blacktalons have a far better demesne.

- Crows is -far- superior to Squirrels. Crows has a 33% chance to give blacklung, blindness, or bleeding. Squirrels has a 100% chance to give like 75 bleeding.

- Pathtwist is a joke. It does not work unless the target tries to walk from a room that is part of your demesne to outside of it. If you leap/tumble or in any form of magical/special movement (beam, teleport, burrow, tumble, etc.) it fails costing you 5p - at which point it has to be recast.

Spiders, however, are damn nice. They have a 33% chance of giving chills, sensitivity, or clumsy (very nice afflictions) with a 30-50% chance of striking TWICE instead of once per tic (you can shrug the venoms though, but there are times when you will get both to hit).

- In the end, you end up with potential like this:





When you top this off with Dark Spirits (which seems to fire a mental-ish affliction back at a target on a damage attack about 30-40% of the time), it is a potential of 7 afflictions (assuming demesne hits after Dark Spirits fires) PLUS an infused rune/mote.

Hartstone have a potential of 4 afflictions (shrooms, pollen, swarm plus Ancestral Curse) PLUS an infused rune/mote.

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Back on topic, I feel Druids blow outside of their demesnes hence I have changed my decision to try out Hartstone. While I would argue that both have potential in their demesne, given the nerf to sap (0.5 delay now instead of 1.0 delay), buuuuuut the potential is far below most other classes as there is only one effective combo (sap).

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I agree with the suggested changes. I think the smoke from smudges should fire off to targets in trees. I agree the power cost to making motes should be removed (perhaps replaced with a high mana drain like 2000 mana per mote). And finally, I would suggest that Squirrels be changed to do the following:

Squirrels: 33% chance to give dizzy, 33% to give a broken nose, 33% chance to give bleeding.

And for my super special Druid upgrade to make them sorta decent outside of their demesne:

Honestly, they should just scrap Pathtwist like every other summon skill and replace it with a demesne ability like Blacktalons' Spiders. On that note Wiccans really need something for Willowisp.

WE REALLY DO.

Haaaartstone/Serenguard needs a way to unimpale themselves after using Gore. Its so silly that they can't. If they could, a high strength hartstone could actually use it pretty effectively (18 strength does like 1300-1500 dmg, if I recall)

Hrm. I think we can no longer say we are not offensively capable.

Sure, outside of forest we may be useless, but we're pretty darn scary inside the woods now.

I guess your the only person to use it hoping to be effective in combat. The other one who use it is Munsia, but she uses it only when she want to have fun with her Preys. Like Narsrim said, Its useless.

If you do ever get caught in pathtwist, you will move in a random demesne area, hence a druid wont be able to use it effectively also since he doesnt know where his target is. He could use flow but by the time his eq recovers from it his target would have escaped.

I think if it gets chaged to mana cost instead of power it will be a usable skill.
Or 1-2p but make it so the target goes to the center of the demesne not at a random area. (beneficial to runists who fuse)

Just a thought

EDIT: this post made me a novice in the board rankings! yay! about a million to go to beat shiribot