Shamarah2006-08-22 21:32:29
I like how everyone screamed OP when Aquas did 1.8k staffcasts but warriors doing 2.8k and pinleg is apparently fine.
Hazar2006-08-22 21:37:50
Ahem. Ixion doing 2.8k and pinleg.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Shamarah2006-08-22 21:39:09
QUOTE(Hazar @ Aug 22 2006, 05:37 PM) 323072
Ahem. Ixion doing 2.8k and pinleg.
Thank you.
Ixion is a warrior, and he has repeatedly claimed that anyone can achieve his levels of damage with the right combination of artifacts, post-nerf weapons, and race. What's your point?
Sylphas2006-08-22 21:47:48
QUOTE(Ixion @ Aug 22 2006, 03:51 PM) 323052
I also fought Terenas yesterday with post-nerf, un-Greatruned, un-forging runed, tempered wounding swords, and with only 1 venom type. We timed out, but he was still in hurtsville.
I don't think anyone is trying to say you're not a good fighter. Maybe I'm reading this wrong, though. I'm sure you could pick up gimp weapons and still give the vast majority of people a bad day, but that's not really the point.
Geb2006-08-22 22:40:38
QUOTE(terenas @ Aug 22 2006, 08:07 PM) 323044
That's my point. All the stats mean something to one class or another. Narsrim is just simply giving his opinion on what the three stats he thinks are the most important to them, to which I disgress.
I fought Ixion just last night, the damage is undoubtedly high no question but I don't think the problem lies in pre-nerf weapons but as some people have pointed out are the buffs and Elemental runes.
Yes, the buffs and elemental runes help, but his weapons having the damage stats they have also adds to the equation. Remember that damage stacking causes each increment change in character stat, damage boosting buffs, and weapon stat to have more effect than normal.
Now we can focus on reducing abilities that everyone can acquire, but will not push them to his damage level; or we can focus on getting his pre-nerf swords brought in line with everyone else. The first option lowers the damage of all warriors that may decide to go his path; the latter only lowers his damage to be back in line with the maximum of what any other warrior can aspire to achieve.
Arix2006-08-23 00:07:28
The only reason half of you seem to be complaining about Ixion is because he isn't on your side, and therefore should be nerfed so he can't kill you as effectively.
Sylphas2006-08-23 00:10:39
I disagree with his swords, and I'm in his commune and married to his daughter (who hasn't been around in like a week. )
Arix2006-08-23 00:14:23
what I meant was, that is how it seems to me
Geb2006-08-23 00:47:42
QUOTE(Arix @ Aug 23 2006, 01:14 AM) 323152
what I meant was, that is how it seems to me
Then you evidently do not pay attention to what many people have done in the past. Plenty have stated that something was overpowered, even when it benefited their own group. Some mages came forward and admitted that mindblast was overpowered. Aquamancers got dilute nerfed, agreeing that it was only good as a griefing tool. So on and so forth, showing that your statement is in fact wrong. Just like me making a statement that only those who have him on their side support him would be wrong too.
Arix2006-08-23 03:40:49
I was only stating an opinion. It's no less wrong or right then any of the other opinions stated by people on the forums
Xavius2006-08-23 04:00:13
QUOTE(Arix @ Aug 22 2006, 10:40 PM) 323207
I was only stating an opinion. It's no less wrong or right then any of the other opinions stated by people on the forums
I'm sorry, but that egalitarian notion that all cultures/opinions/ideas/desires are equal is crap. It is less right than some of the other opinions stated by people on the forums. Some people have a valid backing for theirs.
Forren2006-08-23 04:06:34
QUOTE(Arix @ Aug 23 2006, 12:07 AM) 323148
The only reason half of you seem to be complaining about Ixion is because he isn't on your side, and therefore should be nerfed so he can't kill you as effectively.
Um... no?
Ixion's damage definitely needs looking into by the administration, regardless of affiliation.
I've also brought up Nico's wounding with the champ helm on the forums. He's Celestian.
Nico2006-08-23 04:17:40
QUOTE(Forren @ Aug 23 2006, 12:06 AM) 323216
I've also brought up Nico's wounding with the champ helm on the forums. He's Celestian.
Yeah, you !! ZOMG nerf BUBBLE!!!
Just kidding, I've stated my own concerns with champ helms too. Sometimes people do argue for nerfage for selfish reasons (some of the complaining about champ helms came from people who were silent when their fellow citizen Murphy had em), but it's not everybody. This really is a glaring case of OPness.
Ixion is a good fighter, but that combination of, well, -shtuff-, makes him into a ZOMGWTFBBQ machine.
Forren2006-08-23 04:25:55
QUOTE(Nico @ Aug 23 2006, 04:17 AM) 323220
Yeah, you !! ZOMG nerf BUBBLE!!!
Just kidding, I've stated my own concerns with champ helms too. Sometimes people do argue for nerfage for selfish reasons (some of the complaining about champ helms came from people who were silent when their fellow citizen Murphy had em), but it's not everybody. This really is a glaring case of OPness.
Ixion is a good fighter, but that combination of, well, -shtuff-, makes him into a ZOMGWTFBBQ machine.
I'm pretty much against most of the added bonus of champ artifacts now. Champions really shouldn't need them beyond rescue and the lack of a karma penalty.
And yeah.. bubble is the only way I can survive your wounding.
Diamante2006-08-23 05:54:32
Coincidentally, the only person with damage swords comparable, if not better than Ixion's is, heh, not a warrior. :/
Shorlen2006-08-23 05:59:12
QUOTE(Nico @ Aug 23 2006, 12:17 AM) 323220
Yeah, you !! ZOMG nerf BUBBLE!!!
Off topic, but bubble should cure crotamine
Ixion2006-08-23 06:32:46
No, it shouldn't.
However, I think bubble should do something to the effect of freezing the poison in your veins, making the deathclock not tick when inside the bubble but rather commence after you come out of said bubble.
However, I think bubble should do something to the effect of freezing the poison in your veins, making the deathclock not tick when inside the bubble but rather commence after you come out of said bubble.
Melanchthon2006-08-23 07:05:31
Don't really have a problem with the 200+ base d stat weapons out there. Aside from mowing through low level people and mid levels with elemental weakness and bad con, they aren't that great. You can still make the best damage weapons in the game. Read that again. They aren't what Ixion is using, or what most people think they are, for that matter. But people latch on to these pre-nerfs for some reason, even normally very intelligent and insightful people. There are more important things to address in Lusternia.
Geb2006-08-23 07:22:00
QUOTE(Melanchthon @ Aug 23 2006, 08:05 AM) 323284
Don't really have a problem with the 200+ base d stat weapons out there. Aside from mowing through low level people and mid levels with elemental weakness and bad con, they aren't that great. You can still make the best damage weapons in the game. Read that again. They aren't what Ixion is using, or what most people think they are, for that matter. But people latch on to these pre-nerfs for some reason, even normally very intelligent and insightful people. There are more important things to address in Lusternia.
The weapon caps before a certain time period were considered to be overpowered such that none with their potential could be made anymore. Allowing such weapons to remain in game when they were already deemed to be overpowered does not help the situation when it comes time to try to balance out the warrior archetype.
It has also been stated before that it is not just the weapons that are effecting his damage. Though, out of everything that is contributing to his high damage, his weapons are the variables that can not be duplicated by any other knight. So they are a valid concern when it comes to discussing the extreme damage he is able to generate with their aid.
Melanchthon2006-08-23 07:37:11
QUOTE(geb @ Aug 23 2006, 07:22 AM) 323290
The weapon caps before a certain time period were considered to be overpowered such that none with their potential could be made anymore. Allowing such weapons to remain in game when they were already deemed to be overpowered does not help the situation when it comes time to try to balance out the warrior archetype.
It has also been stated before that it is not just the weapons that are effecting his damage. Though, out of everything that is contributing to his high damage, his weapons are the variables that can not be duplicated by any other knight. So they are a valid concern when it comes to discussing the extreme damage he is able to generate with their aid.
I am well aware of the history regarding weapon stats. It was Terenas and I that argued for the original caps to be put in place. It is enough that new weapons are standardized. The existing pre-nerfs are not the Excaliburs they are made out to be. They are simply very good weapons, not even the best. Ixion is unique for more than his weapons. He is a Titan with the best skillset in the game for a damage knight to have -- Moon. He is the culmination of every damage modifier possible save for another +1 str from Demigod. Of course his damage is strong, but it is not really his weapons that make it too strong, if indeed it is.
Please test what total effect a 20pt stat differential has on damage. It is visible, but hardly impressive. The issue is not his swords.