Ignorance strikes again! Empressing an enemy to Celest to the Pool automatically enemies that person to Celest. Thankfully we Celestians either unenemy ourselves or have reflexes for another person to unenemy us, which automatically and instantly stops guards.

That's always seemed like some sort of abuse. Why would that even be in the code if it's trivial to work around?

I would like to see Angels/Demons change to stay. If only they do not attck, but just announce that so and so is enemy of Nil/Celestia, its cool imho.

So, can anyone tell me how (or help me) to get unenemied to Nil? I was enemied for killing a stupid tainted Fae and still have little idea how to remove the status. I mean, how many dozens of people were enemied to Nil just for that one event? It was never an issue before because of the demons/angels not attacking enemies, which I admit I always found odd. Good change, but unfortunate that some of us have to pay a price for it now.

Agreed. Irritating little tainted fae Its at least 150k to be unenemied but I'm not sure if that amount will work entirely. Have someone not enemied go in and parley for you or try and get you amnesty I suppose.

There should be a temporary lowering of those fines like the Glooms got to Faethorn after changes there.

This is indeed a bug. Prior to this post, summoned angels and demons had been incorrectly set with the personalities for those creatures on Nil and Celestia. This is no longer the case! As a side effect of this, you'll now notice that killing a summoned angel or demon no longer drains power from the nexus (something which was supposed to have been reserved for the cosmic versions of those creatures).

So... you've just stated that celestians have a way to get around a mandated coding addition which is Estarra's way of trying to stop you from doing what your triggers let you do anyway? Abuse FTW!

I love how Celest is automatically blamed for abuse when this sort of thing has been going on for ages.

That's the first I've heard someone say they specifically have made triggers to try and game the system. I know it's happened in the past, people stop doing it when their guards kill them the first time though.

Celest has always beckoned/summoned into guards and used that trigger. It is not illegal, since it isnt illegal to beckon or summon off prime into guards... The issue has been addressed in the past and the only reason I think they get enemied is because of the prime thing.... It isn't a new way they use to get around it. It has been going on for a long time, and sometimes its funny when some idiot does it and no one unenemies him... I think it was Barendur or someone else with a B name I saw die like 3 times for doing that one night, hehe

And Nico, of course Celest is blamed for abuse of things, they always abuse grace, enemy status issues and anything else they can find to abuse, when we do it things get changed, when you all do it they are ok (/teasing and joking)

That's a bit fairer

Might want to talk to your son about that one

The 5-month thing goes a long way to reduce the frequency of devastating raids. I'm very glad that was addressed; it gives the target nation 5 days to bring back their beings and recoup other losses, while not beefing them up to the point they'll never be killed either (raiders still have options open).

It sounds like they've sort of approved something similar to my previous suggestions--no "economic cost", and no "sliding window of opportunity", but this means that you can't effectively "hurt" a nation more than 2 times in a week.

I really like these changes. Like Tully said, they still allow you to attack at any time, but prevent people from just totally crushing someone else for extended periods of time.

I like most of the changes, just a couple concerns:

1) The pool move. First of all, it is now very, very easy to pin Celestians to the pool now. A single stonewall would make moving a group out impossible until the wall is broken. Formerly 4 was needed. Nil needs two walls to block it... but Celest can only do icewalls anyway. Also, one group would be needed to wait outside the room, instead of the four it would take before (unfeasible, though easy to move the group) and the two it would take on Nil. When breaking a hostile demesne, it could also be harder to hold the room below the pool if the enemy is organized enough to watch it, effectively making it one more hostile room a person has to run across before they reach a significant break point. I guess we'll see how it goes.

2) Is five days too long for invincibility? Kill all the lords/supernals, chances are they'll be raised in about 2 days, giving them 3 days to bring the star or necro back up the strength. If you're persistant, I think the protections could still fall... but it would take a *lot* of consecutive successful raids to pull it off. Again, we'll see. I also think the 5 day invincibility is too generous to the communes. Now, the max damage that can be done to communes is 3000 power every 5 days, which is ludicrously low considering 9000 can be done to cities in the same time with the possibility of losing more to the nexus quest (which communes still don't have). Killing their guards over the five days would probably be more costly to them now. I would suggest lowering the Avatar invincibility to two days instead of the five, though that would still put communes in a significantly better position in that area.

In response to 1.) we're aware that this change may not be perfect, and we're going to monitor it and see how it works out. It is certainly a disadvantageous change for defenders of Celestia, but the upside is that it prevents people from being swept into guards via currents. I think Elryn's assessment of the demesne breaking capabilities is fairly accurate in that the enemy will need to sacrifice a plane-wide demesne (and enable you to leave the demesne in 2 steps) for an unbreakable demesne below the PoS. It's something we will continue to monitor.

In regards to 2.), the change was made not in terms of power lost (which is arguably negligible to both cities and communes given the current status of the nexi), but was instead made in terms of the frustration of having to raise these entities repeatedly within a short time. Raising the cosmic lords and avatars is an arduous and repetitive process, and we don't want that to become a source of constant frustration for players. A similar analogy would be when the sea quest took place every Lusternian month - it was simply too often.

Finally! A way to use influence to gather power! Thank you! Thank you!



Time to give the power aides a heart attack..

I like all the changes but one: Making the demons/angels talk is HIGHLY annoying.