The only change that ought to be made is making a demesne breakable through sanctuary. Its fine elsewise.

Pits are pretty lame inasmuch as they slow you down a lot more than a demesne. I've never had a problem getting through demesnes in village revolts but pits in every room made it ridiculous. I won't suggest any changes though or cry for nerfings because I don't know enough about them to know what would be right.

Agreed, the demesne thing could probably use the most change.

Although, how is one falling into pits when they are levitating above the ground anyways? If levitation countered pits, it could be a possibility. But on the flip side, geo demesnes are the only thing I know of that strip levetation.

I thought the pits were annoying and confusing, but they're fine. Just climb out and run. I don't think Druids(?) need this nerfed. It's how they kill. Though the levitation bit sounds useful.

Sanctuary areas should not be allowed to have an inactive demesne sitting there, should be broken/truegrounded first, imo.

I've got to say no to this, I've already been in an influence where I've used 50% reserves on campaigns alone. Even as a 1-shot 1p skill it can really drain you.
That has nothing to do with the issue at hand... and also isn't true. If you have huge hordes of people, the problem is the huge hordes of people, not sanctuary or moonbeam. Also, a few -really- good influncers *cough* speced faelings *cough* can rip through those huge hoards, and get them all shattered.
Sometimes you need just 1 or 2 safe rooms to keep the whole village locked down in a demense though.

I seriously doubt there will ever be a time when everyone is happy with demenses in lusternia's future, there will always be some group or another complaining about something.

I suggest that staff abilities like aqua staff twirl be non-aggressive. I LIVE on staff twirl! Especially annoying is hard-to-break hostile demesne outside sanced room with monolith, which is what happened in Dairuchi for a while.

I take it you've never tried to shatter someone with access to Moonbeam...

Hell no. Only mages/druids can break demenses, so if someone wanted to hit sanctuary, they would have to get someone else in to break it first.

The only two options really are to make it so you can break the meld inside the sanctuary (the better option) or make it so that if you sanctuary on your own org's demense it dissolves the meld in the room (which is slightly abusable when you have two org's work together, but does create more break points).

Why would druids need this nerfed, they do not make pits... Trackers do. Or are you saying that druids are whining to get it nerfed?? Which in that case, they (trackers) have been nerfed already and only compensated by half of what they were expecting to be compensated with...

I hate Shorlen's stupid little demesne which caused me to miss my decap on Shamrah, because just before it went through I was hurtled up into the trees...

Edit - Oh and on sanctuary, this should be a simple easy fix with no problems involved, when someone uses sanctuary in a room, it breaks the meld/demesne in that room. No questions asked. It is broken.

Many of the ideas suggested are completely ignoring the contiguous nature of demesnes, and would result in druids/mages having 3 or even 10 seperate demesnes.

No, and you know what? No.

Sancing a room should NOT break the demesne. First of all, druids and magi are the only ones who can break them for a reason. If this was put in, then I would have to argue that sancing a room should remove all traps as well, and cancel all songs, and unsummon all angels, demons, and fae who are in the room.

No.

Druids and magi breaking a demesne through a sanc, following all the normal rules for it? That's fine, and a really good idea. However, remember that realitycheck and chop are aggressive actions. How is this to be reconciled?

By making realitycheck and chop work through sanctuary/peace too?

My problem with all these suggestions isn't really that I like unbreakable demesnes so much as most of these are making Sanctuary into a demesne-breaking tool. Go into a break point, sanc, reality check, chop, break. Move into the next room and immediately sanc, reality check, chop, break.

Repeat.

Hmm, good point. I think it's a better option than what we have now though.

Maybe for you It'll make druids/mages quite worthless in many group situations, except in situations where one group has a MASSIVE number of people. No longer will one swift person be able to maintain their own meld, since the only way to hold a meld will be to use Crusade, and even then, it won't be easy.

Remember that druids fight by changing elevation constantly, which lowers the campaign, and magi fight long ranged often as well due to their untankyness and ranged skills. Psions might be effective outside their demesne, but other magi/druids certainly aren't. If we can't meld, we can't use our primary skillset. Melding takes 61 seconds for a Hartstone, and comparable time for the other magi/druids. Sancing and brekaing takes about 12 seconds, if the place is terrained or has a sapling. Re-terraining or replanting a sapling, the normal way to handle someone trying to break your demesne, is impossible, as they are very hostile actions.

The death of the Druid/Mage does not cause a meld to disappear. If the break points are protected, all the holder has to do is put up the effects once he/she returns. Second, bits and pieces of a demesne can be destroyed, but the bulk of it also can be protected if the break points have Sanctuaries.

I've played a mage for quite a long time before becoming a warrior, and so I know exactly how demesnes work. I also know that being knocked into trees periodically (druids), moved around by currents (Aquas), or having to crawl over rubble to move around (Geos) can greatly hinder the speed at which an opposing force can influence. Having an unbreakable demesne gives the side who possesses it a very large advantage in mobile, defensive, and offensive capabilities. That is the case even if everyone has protection scrolls up.

Also, Serenwilde was in a three-way fight. Magnagora and Celest were fighting each other more than they were fighting Serenwilde. So, having to fight each of them does not justify the use of Sanctuary to hold a meld in place. The demesne itself should have been enough to deal with any stragglers that walked in between each of the opposing sides.




There is a simple solution for that. Terrain and/or Saplings are removed if you or a member of your community place a Sanctuary on that spot. The enemy Mage/Druid makes it to that point using the normal rules, goes in and breaks the meld at that point. No reason to try what you stated in other posts, since each sanctuary will destroy that demesne’s defensive measures (saplings and terrain).

So, if a person places a Sanctuary in an enemied demesne, it will not break the meld nor remove the Terrain or Sapling present. It is only when your own city/commune mates place one there that saplings and terrain will be removed, allowing for the demesne to be broken by the enemy side if all other conditions are met.

Druid demesnes and aqua demesnes have a vast advantage over geo demesnes too in that they move you around, which breaks a crusade.

I don't know how many times I was demolishing someone in a druid demesne with crusade down only to have me flung into trees and the druid would just sanc while INSIDE a pit, laugh, cure, and walk out.

I propose that elevation movement should not drop sanc/crusade.

One point was incorrect about the dairuchi influencing-- Magnagorans were fighting Serenwilde quite a bit. In fact, of the fifty or so kills I alone got, all but a couple were Serens.

I agree with Geb.

(Even though rubble is way less of a pain than currents or trees since rubble also affects allies while trees and currents only hinder enemies but that's another topic)

Why moonbeam when you can just walk away much easier, and 6-12 seconds faster? I think you're just too interested in crying 'overpowered' then trying to address actual issues being talked about by everyone else in this thread.

The purpose of my meld was to keep a hostile meld from being formed, since we were vastly outnumbered fighter-wise. I was really trying to influence, often in sancs (the demesne holder being in a sanc disables the demese while they are there), more than attack with the demesne. I'm not justifying unbreakable demesnes by any means, simply explaining tactically why I did all I could to keep it in place.

The huge problem I see with this is that it makes two allied orgs working together VASTLY stronger than one org working alone. Two orgs together can create an unbreakable demesne - one org alone can't.


To be honest, I was spamming sanc every time I fell into a pit with you nearby since I was trying not to die, and being in a pit with you there is instant death, especially when I have no idea what stops climbing and requires it to be begun again (Does paralyse? Entanglement? Crosses? I know prone does...). I didn't even realize that my demesne was canceling Crusade until you said it here.

If elevation changes didn't break sanc/crusade, then it leaves aqua demesnes with an advantage no other org has, which is the ability to break crusades passively. Perhaps Crusade should stick with you on forced movement (including elevation changes), unless the forced movement takes you into a Sanc, in which then the Crusade drops?

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Oh, duh, a solution is to make it so you cannot break a demesne in a sanced room if your city/commune raised the sanc. So, Celestian sancs prevent aquas from breaking, Magnagoran sancs prevent geos from breaking, etc, but melds can be broken through sancs otherwise. The only issue then is terrain/saplings, and I suppose the best way to handle that is to have the sanc not protect them from being destroyed, unless the sanc is the same nationality of the breaker? Meh, dunno.

The only problem with this is that then two orgs could work together to use sancs to break a demesne without being stopable. Still, that's better than the alternative, which allowed demesnes to be unbreakable if you had such a two org pairing....

Come now, 50 or so kills? I don't even remember deathsight lighting up 50 times. When it did, the two I saw popping up on it the most were Flaca and Reiha for some reason.