Well, just because they're Fire doesn't mean the mage can't blast an Ice Nova when the enemy comes in. Or a frostbolt. Or a cone of cold. In PvP, I found fire mages to be much stronger than ice mages, but only if they know what they were doing.

Druids aren't mana consuming unless all that you do is Moonfire spamming - the mark of noob. Especially since Innervate is now a widely available general spell, so even balance and feral can use it - if you're in Moonkin form, just release it, innervate and change back, still gaining a lot of mana. And I'm not even mentioning Burning Crusade when the balance tree gets a spell that adds mana regen based on your int.

Druids as tanks - that depends on the gear. I've seen useless druid-tanks, but there's also a raid guild that uses a druid as a main tank on Ragnaros, and he's doing a great job. And in Burning Crusade, they'll get that stackable aggro-heavy DoT, making them even better. Of course, Protection warriors will get Devastate for super-tanky goodness.

PvP - best classes are widely believed to be the Warlock and a shadow-specced Priest. I agree with this point of view. Mages are nasty if you don't know how to counter them, easy if you do. Warriors and rogues are average.

My list:
Human Warrior 51 (arms, used to be protection - I never regretted switching)
Dwarf Priest 46 (shadow, used to be holy - unfortunately deleted now )
Troll Rogue 30something (not really play him anymore, but was supposed to be combat/subtlety)
Tauren Hunter 20something (don't play him either, was supposed to be marksmanship)
Undead Mage 6 (played only one evening, but I didn't like the class so I abandoned him)

So my characters are still pretty noobish. But then I didn't play WoW heavily, until recently.
I also share the account with my brothers - 60 Druid (balance) and 60 Paladin (retribution, but NOT a retnoob). Both are doing great in PvE and PvP, especially since these classes are rather weak in PvP.

EDIT: Forgot to boast. Since I reached 51 on my main this morning, I finally went to Alterac Valley and got my own Ice Barbed Spear AKA Noobstick. I feel powerful now.

I played WoW for free for 10 days... AFter the 10 days I didn't feel the need to continue... I'm not sure what people get from it.

Seems the same as all the others.

I've never enjoyed any game you HAVE to pay to play.

Voluntary pay > mandatory pay.

The first ever, ever MUD I ever played was called Legends of Terris. It was free if you had AOL. Then they left AOL and started charging a monthly fee. I stopped playing.

And a game where you have to buy some software to play even before you can start paying a monthly fee to play, double icky.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJWeWMKfa3g

This video explains balance in regards to World of Warcraft fairly succinctly.

And Noola, we don't have to pay for it - there are plenty of private servers around which don't charge you to play WoW, its just that we prefer to pay what is a very small amount to play on the official servers.

Even if my video settings keep on resetting themselves to bloody higher specs and whenever I walk into a majorly populated city (undercity, orgrimmar, ironforge, stormwind) my FPS drops down to something disgusting like 4-5fps.

Yeah, thats probabbly it. Something inside of me just refuses to do the new age pricing system. I remember when Dragonrealms was pay $2.25 per hour... my parents killed me!



Really? How does that work?

My only character is a lvl 60 rogue, the game changes so much when you get into end game raiding, and you get good gear for pvp. I can pretty much beat most classes one on one in a battleground (IE when they don't know i'm there until i hit them) which is how a rogue is designed to be played.

Murphy, you should make an alt and level that up a bit, just so I have someone to grind with instead of being bored out of my skull killing boar #3391435.

Plus its always nice to have a disenchant noob.

Yes, yes they have. On the Dark Iron server (my main server), there is a Druid by the name of Hugehoss on the Horde side in the guild called Peekay. His guild holds the server firsts for just about every raid boss. First to down Ragnaros, first to down Nefarion, first to beat Twin Emps, the guild that opened the Gate, etc. They use a Druid to tank every boss fight. Only a few fights do they opt for a Warrior, Nefarion being one of them. The Nefarion Druid class call, forces every Druid into catform for it's duration, so it's simply easier with a Warrior. However it has been tanked by a Druid regardless.

When you speak of threat generation, you really are clueless, because that is the Druids strength. Warriors and Druids have some different strengths and weaknesses, but Druid aggro actually exceeds Warrior aggro, since it scales. Warriors produce aggro with set modifiers. Heroic strike, Shield slam, and Sunder are all just a set amount of threat produced. It does not scale with gear, it's always X amount on a sunder and so on.

Druid threat however works differently. Maul is a multiplier. It multiplies the damage of your maul to produce a the threat. The better the gear, the more threat produced, and thusly it exceeds Warrior threat production. It is difficult to show this on most boss fights, because generally whoever has the aggro keeps the aggro, since when you are the target, you will generally have unlimited rage, and thusly able to spam all your abilities, whereas the offtank will only produce rage for the damage they do. However, it becomes very evident on fights like Hakkar, you can tell who is producing more threat by who is mind controlled the longest and most often.

I find it amusing that you even use MC as an example, even Paladins can tank MC just fine almost all the way through, it just shows your inexperience. My guild did it frequently just for fun. I've tanked Onyxia many times personally sometimes with as few as 15 other people, tanked all of AQ20 and parts of AQ40, Broodlord in BWL (it's a multitank fight, another good example for showing the threat production of a Druid tank, since a Druid tank will often still hold aggro through the deaggro, or even regain aggro before the deaggro happens on another tank), MC except Rag, ZG, etc. I wasn't the best geared Druid tank in our guild though, a guy named Parrog was our main Druid tank, he's tanked everything and was only ever asked to tank. Here's a video of Hugehoss tanking Garr and all 8 of his adds at once (the main multitank fight in MC I suppose you were referring too, normally you banish a few adds then offtank the rest).


http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=53...&q=hugehoss

I can assure you, no Warrior has ever done that.

Well my chum it seems our experiences seem to differ. Maybe it's down to druid skill or gear, but as a rogue you know who holds better aggro because you're usually next in line to get it if you're any good, and my personal experience with feral druids is their tanking is very lacking compared to warriors. (Yes i know how to play rogue and minimise aggro, but there is only so much you can do while nuking as hard as you can)

One thing that makes warriors better is the ability to wield thunderfury, the proc on that puppy is worth 2 sunder of aggro and procs at about 30%. That video though is impressive.

One question, if feral druids are such good tanks then why are warriors used for the majority of main tankings, including deathntaxes (check em out, guild who pulls heaps of world firsts)

Warriors are better for certain encounters. Nefarion comes to mind due to the Druid class call, also Fear based encounters since there is no beserker rage for Druids (though it's easy with fear ward alliance side). Also, Druids could NOT tank untill patch 1.8. Obviously by this time the game had been out for some time, and Warriors were well established, and there is still a lingering stigma, as well as many ill-informed or inexperienced people such as yourself, especially those who take other peoples word for it, rather than experiencing it or seeing it first hand.

Secondly, few Druids actually dedicate themselves to tanking, and actually gathering the very specific gear required for tanking, since the gear used for tanking is fundamentally different in the required stats compared to other gear. Example being the Warden Staff, a level 43 epic item, that is still the best Druid tanking weapon in the game, (Silly Blizzard and their poor itemization).

Thirdly, Druids are the least played class, meaning there is relatively few of them by comparison to the loads of Warriors/Rogues.

Also, there is no "tier 3" tanking gear for Druids. In Naxxrammas there is about two Druid tank items worth using for tanking, everything else is healing gear. All the Druid tanking gear comes from AQ40 and BWL mostly, leaving it slightly behind in item levels. However, Druids suited up in the best gear have about the same TankPoints as Tier 3 Dreadnaught wearing warriors. In case you aren't familiar, TankPoints is a mod that calculates total mitigation and gives an unbiased number as a result. This number represents damage untill death. Meaning a result of 20,000 tank points, means you can survive 20,000 worth of damage before you die, after your mitigation is taken into account (armor, dodge, parry, block, etc). TankPoints is also built into CTProfile.

Here's Hugehoss' profile (Make sure you click the button to go into Bear Form before going to the melee stats):
Hugehoss CTProfile

Two similarly geared Warriors from Everlasting Vendetta (the top alliance guild on the same server as Hugehoss of Peekay):
Drolz CTProfile
Trinz CTProfile


Don't forget, Druids get the HoTW talent, which increases stamina by 20% while in bear form, which means any raid buffs that enhance stamina(Prayer of Fortitude, Blessing of Kings, Mark of the Wild, blasted lands buffs, etc) yield 20% more health.



No, generally that's the DPS Warriors who, you know, lack an aggro wipe and a deaggro.

Or the Mages/Warlocks who also lack an aggro wipe and a deaggro.

Rogues produce -29% threat by default, Mages/Warlocks/Hunters have -30% aggro for being at range (however, they don't get this if they have to stand in close on certain encounters), Warriors have -20% threat while in Beserker/Battle stance, and +30% while in Defensive, or +45% with the protection talent (same as Druids in Bear or with the talent). Rogues can completely wipe aggro every 5 minutes, so more or less every fight, also feint is about -800 damage in threat. Hunters can completely wipe aggro every 30 seconds (if a Hunter pulls aggro, he should seriously have his character deleted).

Here you go, enlighten yourself:
http://www.wowwiki.com/Formulas:Aggro

Thunderfury has been nerfed twice, procs about 10%. Not to mention, it doesn't carry any additional amount of threat, else DPS warriors would be screwed. The 300 damage just does 300 damage worth of threat, like any other damage.

Firstly: You sure about thunderfury?

Secondly: when i said "Maybe it's down to druid skill or gear, but as a rogue you know who holds better aggro because you're usually next in line to get it if you're any good" I meant that because i'm usually 2nd on the aggro meter, i'm next to get hit if the tank dies (even with feignting and vanishing should be saved until 50%) I'm very wary of aggro since i get 1shotted. That puts me in a position to be conscious of who's generateing more aggro.

I'm above our fury wars in aggro because i outgear them by enough to be ahead even while feinting.

I wish I could one hit Murphy. Or Tuek. Or Asarnil... Oh wait... I can.

Crossrealm bgs. :-)

Guys.

Lets set this up. Lusternia players in WoW unite.

A game of wsg perchance?

Crossrealm bgs, yes, but you still have to be in the same battlegroup.

It would be easy to set up.. just coordinate it via messengers or vent. And "be in the same battle group" What does that even mean? No. I haven't played good ole` WoW for awhile because I've had no reason to, but this is a good enough one. At any given time there are 50+? (correct me if I'm wrong) wsg games going on across all servers. You can join next available or queue up in a specific wsg bg, which we would do. I'm assuming that everyone who would want to play would also be level 60, err...because seriously, if your not level sixty, you've not yet entered the specific circle of hell which gives you WoW veteran status.

Each "Battlegroup" is about a dozen odd servers that you hook up against in the crossrealms stuff.

pah, i never was an honor/bg kid. Sure we can't set this up? Me Hurt. :<

looked it up http://www.wowwiki.com/Battlegroup

My battlegroup: (anyone on these?)

Battlegroup »
Cyclone (US) »
Azjol-Nerub PvE
Bloodscalp PvP
Boulderfist PvP
Bronzebeard PvE
Crushridge PvP
Daggerspine PvP
Darkspear(FTL) PvP
Draenor PvE
Dragonblight PvE
Dunemaul PvP
Feathermoon RP
Perenolde PvE
Stonemaul PvP
Stormscale PvP
Suramar PvE
Uldum PvE

I'm on Lightninghoof. Battlegroup with Azshara, Twisting Nether, Maelstrom, Dark Iron, bunch of others I can't remember.

Argent Dawn here. European.

Bloody blizzard (im not even english). They claimed that you could play with your friends from other servers when crossrealms first came out. What they failed to mention is that they have to be in your battlegroup. Ugh :|

Anyways, about burning crusade, I hear its just going to be more of the same except with new items, and some new instances. I dont see the game changing a whole lot. I also hear that the whole outlands region is about as big as the barrens.