Daganev2007-03-08 20:21:14
QUOTE(Verithrax @ Mar 8 2007, 12:15 PM) 389316
That would render manses largely useless.
What about people just put guards in their aetherplex chambers and harden up?
What about people just put guards in their aetherplex chambers and harden up?
Because you can walk right past them?
Verithrax2007-03-08 20:44:18
QUOTE(daganev @ Mar 8 2007, 05:21 PM) 389318
Because you can walk right past them?
Then that's a problem with guards, not manses.
At any rate, I do think manses need to check perms on people following.
Daganev2007-03-08 20:50:14
No, it is a problem with manses, and the placement of aetherdocks in relation to the rest of the area. Celest has it easy, but other places do not.
It would be much better solved by giving exit as well as entrance perisions. And I don't want it to check for followers, because I want to be able to invite guests who otherwise couldn't come in, without resetting the permisions everytime.
It would be much better solved by giving exit as well as entrance perisions. And I don't want it to check for followers, because I want to be able to invite guests who otherwise couldn't come in, without resetting the permisions everytime.
Unknown2007-03-09 05:03:48
I say It should work like this:
You can set permissions on who can leave to where.
The exception to the above is that you cannot block the atherplex.
You can't follow someone into a manse that you can't enter without following.
The exception to the above is if you are following the owner of the manse.
Power minsters can tell if the following people are blocked from exiting to their city:
Members of the any of the main orgs
Enemies of the any of the main orgs
Members of the any non-secret clan
Enemies of the any non-secret clan
Individuals
You can set permissions on who can leave to where.
The exception to the above is that you cannot block the atherplex.
You can't follow someone into a manse that you can't enter without following.
The exception to the above is if you are following the owner of the manse.
Power minsters can tell if the following people are blocked from exiting to their city:
Members of the any of the main orgs
Enemies of the any of the main orgs
Members of the any non-secret clan
Enemies of the any non-secret clan
Individuals
Richter2007-03-09 05:30:31
QUOTE(Greleag @ Mar 8 2007, 09:03 PM) 389485
I say It should work like this:
You can set permissions on who can leave to where.
The exception to the above is that you cannot block the atherplex.
You can't follow someone into a manse that you can't enter without following.
The exception to the above is if you are following the owner of the manse.
Power minsters can tell if the following people are blocked from exiting to their city:
Members of the any of the main orgs
Enemies of the any of the main orgs
Members of the any non-secret clan
Enemies of the any non-secret clan
Individuals
You can set permissions on who can leave to where.
The exception to the above is that you cannot block the atherplex.
You can't follow someone into a manse that you can't enter without following.
The exception to the above is if you are following the owner of the manse.
Power minsters can tell if the following people are blocked from exiting to their city:
Members of the any of the main orgs
Enemies of the any of the main orgs
Members of the any non-secret clan
Enemies of the any non-secret clan
Individuals
I agree with this.
Except, the following someone into a manse part. I pushed for this forever, and nothing was ever done. It was BS that you could just follow someone into a manse that you were blocked from. Some people wanted to let everyone in except a few people, and some people wanted to let only a few people in and keep everyone else out. And it should be able to work like that. It's like a magic strainer. Disallowed people are the large chunks, while your allowed people are the small pieces and get in. The system should do a check on every person trying to enter a manse, and everyone following them. If it finds someone not allowed, it should either not allow them to enter, or if the system doesn't work like that, it should drop them into the peak aetherplex, like Newton does.
Callia2007-03-09 06:02:57
I've found varying levels of access work great. Only I can open the steel doors to my private sanctums, and the rest is sealed off from the fulcrux. So just following someone there does not mean you will get any further then the fulcrux. It is just about intelligent design for keeping internal security.
Clise2007-03-09 07:42:00
Ah but let's say your manse is connected to Celest which you forked out 150k gold for. A whole bunch of Magnagorans follows one person into your manse and raids Celest using your manse as a base. As a result your manse is disconnected with no refund. This is what my suggestion is trying to prevent.
Sylphas2007-03-09 08:17:50
QUOTE(Clise @ Mar 9 2007, 02:42 AM) 389502
Ah but let's say your manse is connected to Celest which you forked out 150k gold for. A whole bunch of Magnagorans follows one person into your manse and raids Celest using your manse as a base. As a result your manse is disconnected with no refund. This is what my suggestion is trying to prevent.
There isn't really much you can do to prevent this. As such, it's up to the city to decide whether to connect manses and risk it, or to just not connect manses at all.
Unknown2007-03-09 15:33:18
I think this is a very good idea, and that the perms should definitely check on followers.
Deepnight, for example, has been disconnected from Celest and Mag (which in itself is quite hypocritical, because Jewels and Attai are still connected almost everywhere, no offence to the owners of those manses) - possibly disconnected from Seren as well, I wouldn't know - and this is the only reason this has happened. People using it as a raiding base. Richter has a big sign up in the fulcrux saying not to do this, but he has no mechanical way to stop them using his manse as a raiding base. Which, quite frankly, makes no sense.
Deepnight, for example, has been disconnected from Celest and Mag (which in itself is quite hypocritical, because Jewels and Attai are still connected almost everywhere, no offence to the owners of those manses) - possibly disconnected from Seren as well, I wouldn't know - and this is the only reason this has happened. People using it as a raiding base. Richter has a big sign up in the fulcrux saying not to do this, but he has no mechanical way to stop them using his manse as a raiding base. Which, quite frankly, makes no sense.
Diamondais2007-03-09 15:40:20
QUOTE(Ytraelux @ Mar 9 2007, 10:33 AM) 389548
I think this is a very good idea, and that the perms should definitely check on followers.
Deepnight, for example, has been disconnected from Celest and Mag (which in itself is quite hypocritical, because Jewels and Attai are still connected almost everywhere, no offence to the owners of those manses) - possibly disconnected from Seren as well, I wouldn't know - and this is the only reason this has happened. People using it as a raiding base. Richter has a big sign up in the fulcrux saying not to do this, but he has no mechanical way to stop them using his manse as a raiding base. Which, quite frankly, makes no sense.
Deepnight, for example, has been disconnected from Celest and Mag (which in itself is quite hypocritical, because Jewels and Attai are still connected almost everywhere, no offence to the owners of those manses) - possibly disconnected from Seren as well, I wouldn't know - and this is the only reason this has happened. People using it as a raiding base. Richter has a big sign up in the fulcrux saying not to do this, but he has no mechanical way to stop them using his manse as a raiding base. Which, quite frankly, makes no sense.
Attai was disconnected from both Celest and Magnagora. Nice try. Doubtful Glomdoring would let Kharaen connect.
Anisu2007-03-09 15:56:18
QUOTE(Ytraelux @ Mar 9 2007, 04:33 PM) 389548
I think this is a very good idea, and that the perms should definitely check on followers.
Deepnight, for example, has been disconnected from Celest and Mag (which in itself is quite hypocritical, because Jewels and Attai are still connected almost everywhere, no offence to the owners of those manses) - possibly disconnected from Seren as well, I wouldn't know - and this is the only reason this has happened. People using it as a raiding base. Richter has a big sign up in the fulcrux saying not to do this, but he has no mechanical way to stop them using his manse as a raiding base. Which, quite frankly, makes no sense.
Deepnight, for example, has been disconnected from Celest and Mag (which in itself is quite hypocritical, because Jewels and Attai are still connected almost everywhere, no offence to the owners of those manses) - possibly disconnected from Seren as well, I wouldn't know - and this is the only reason this has happened. People using it as a raiding base. Richter has a big sign up in the fulcrux saying not to do this, but he has no mechanical way to stop them using his manse as a raiding base. Which, quite frankly, makes no sense.
Deepnight was disconnected from Celest because it houses enemies, not because enemies can use it.
Celest at this time has no official rules on setting perms preventing certain people from accessing it's dock, it does have rules on what manses can connect based on ownership and marriage.
for reference:
CODE
---------------------------------------------------------
Leader: Adee                              Modified: 2007/02/19 17:45
Name:  Manses                            Status: Ongoing
Info:
To have a manse connected to the portal room of New Celest is a
privilege, not a right. A manse is not permitted to be linked if one of
the following requirements are not met:
                                                                       Â
1.The manse may not be owned by an enemy of New Celest or an enemy
  of a guild of New Celest
2.The manse may not be owned by a member of Magnagora.
3.The manse's name and if public it's interior may not be offensive
  to the Light.
4.The owner of the manse may not be a member of the divine order of
  Fain, Raezon, Morgfyre or Shikari
5.The owner of the manse may not be member of a clan that is against
  the light
6.The wife/husband of the owner of the manse must be compliant to these
  rules as well.
The moment one of these conditions is broken the manse will be unlinked.
There will be NO refunds.
Prices to link a manse:
1. Celestian owner: 1500 power or 75,000 gold
2. Foreign owner: 3000 power or 150,000 gold
Manses wishing to be connected:
===============================
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Leader: Adee                              Modified: 2007/02/19 17:45
Name:  Manses                            Status: Ongoing
Info:
To have a manse connected to the portal room of New Celest is a
privilege, not a right. A manse is not permitted to be linked if one of
the following requirements are not met:
                                                                       Â
1.The manse may not be owned by an enemy of New Celest or an enemy
  of a guild of New Celest
2.The manse may not be owned by a member of Magnagora.
3.The manse's name and if public it's interior may not be offensive
  to the Light.
4.The owner of the manse may not be a member of the divine order of
  Fain, Raezon, Morgfyre or Shikari
5.The owner of the manse may not be member of a clan that is against
  the light
6.The wife/husband of the owner of the manse must be compliant to these
  rules as well.
The moment one of these conditions is broken the manse will be unlinked.
There will be NO refunds.
Prices to link a manse:
1. Celestian owner: 1500 power or 75,000 gold
2. Foreign owner: 3000 power or 150,000 gold
Manses wishing to be connected:
===============================
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
like I said if guards are the problem simply get your linked manses (or public linked manses) pay a fee each year to cover guard placement at your portals, put them so they track enemies.
and someone following can be compared to you opening the gate for person X, and person Y running in after X before you can close the gate. It makes perfect sense.
Manses are not a safe haven (even though you can make one with sigils and reinforced doors since moonbeam was nerfed)
Unknown2007-03-09 16:07:20
QUOTE(diamondais @ Mar 9 2007, 03:40 PM) 389550
Attai was disconnected from both Celest and Magnagora. Nice try. Doubtful Glomdoring would let Kharaen connect.
Attai was connected to Magnagora a few weeks ago, so meh.
Diamondais2007-03-09 16:13:58
QUOTE(Ytraelux @ Mar 9 2007, 11:07 AM) 389554
Attai was connected to Magnagora a few weeks ago, so meh.
Yes, it was. And it was disconnected alongside all the other manses that Magnagora disconnected.
Unknown2007-03-09 16:23:20
QUOTE(Anisu @ Mar 9 2007, 03:56 PM) 389552
Deepnight was disconnected from Celest because it houses enemies, not because enemies can use it.
I was told differently. Ah well.
Sylphas2007-03-09 20:18:05
If you want security, don't connect any manses. If it starts checking people following, and you have a way to check perms, then you can safely connect a manse. Until then, unless I'm missing something, anyone can use any manse to raid a city. It's just like any other city entrance.
The easiest solution would just be to give PORTAL EXIT a 3-5 second recovery time. I haven't tested in a while, but since guards are apparently absolutely worthless in your portal room, I'm going to assume it doesn't take eq to portal into a city.
The easiest solution would just be to give PORTAL EXIT a 3-5 second recovery time. I haven't tested in a while, but since guards are apparently absolutely worthless in your portal room, I'm going to assume it doesn't take eq to portal into a city.
Shishi2007-03-09 20:45:18
QUOTE(Ytraelux @ Mar 9 2007, 08:07 AM) 389554
Attai was connected to Magnagora a few weeks ago, so meh.
Jewels was disconnected too much to my misfortune I can't get to magnagora easily anymore
Unknown2007-03-10 02:00:15
QUOTE(Richter @ Mar 8 2007, 11:30 PM) 389494
I agree with this.
Except, the following someone into a manse part. I pushed for this forever, and nothing was ever done. It was BS that you could just follow someone into a manse that you were blocked from. Some people wanted to let everyone in except a few people, and some people wanted to let only a few people in and keep everyone else out. And it should be able to work like that. It's like a magic strainer. Disallowed people are the large chunks, while your allowed people are the small pieces and get in. The system should do a check on every person trying to enter a manse, and everyone following them. If it finds someone not allowed, it should either not allow them to enter, or if the system doesn't work like that, it should drop them into the peak aetherplex, like Newton does.
Except, the following someone into a manse part. I pushed for this forever, and nothing was ever done. It was BS that you could just follow someone into a manse that you were blocked from. Some people wanted to let everyone in except a few people, and some people wanted to let only a few people in and keep everyone else out. And it should be able to work like that. It's like a magic strainer. Disallowed people are the large chunks, while your allowed people are the small pieces and get in. The system should do a check on every person trying to enter a manse, and everyone following them. If it finds someone not allowed, it should either not allow them to enter, or if the system doesn't work like that, it should drop them into the peak aetherplex, like Newton does.
What I meant was if you following someone and they go into a manse your blocked from, you get left behind.
