well, I know I will be trying, as always, to create and expand the avenues of RP. I have added several things already that may or may not take off, just have to wait and see. I haven't lost all faith in the commune, and I hope that we are not cutting off an arm to spite a finger.

I think all we can do is ante up and kick in. I have a few purely for consideration suggestions I am going to forward. As an off peak person I'm going to ramp up my interaction with novices.

I know we are not going to get a Divine now but I still think some sort of contest to select a pure RP admin for Glom would be a big help. Get as much of a consensus as possible and combine that with Estarra's own demands for how she wants to see improvement. Give that Divine a clear defined mission statement to use as a big stick against road blocks.

It's fine to post the log.

When my alt tried to get into Glomdoring, it took a couple of hours. I enjoyed the RP (kudos to Kundu, Xenthos, and Druken, but I was slightly irritated OOC cause I was ing hungry and wanted to eat), but not everyone will express the same appreciation when they try to join. Hopefully changes and comprimises can made without feeling Glom's going to lose their RP style.

And I see 12 other users waiting for the log, where is it?

Well, how can I resist that, then.

I for one will be heading back to Glom, as soon as I tie up my loose ends in Mag... Glomdoring is where my heart resides, and I don't want to see it get killed off.

But seriously, we help our novices when there are people to help them around, and we -are- welcoming, to those who show lotalty... There are limited amounts of things we can change.

The only problem with novice retention is not having the people around to help in off-hours. That was not the subject of the discussion, it is more the atmosphere of Glom once you graduate and get to know the place.

Wow, thankyou Shamarah! <3

And I'm surprised at how intelligent and mature the discussion was, even though I disagree with the prevalent view about the elitist attitude as the cause and I think saying that the problem is entirely political is naive, from a game designer point of view. Still, almost everyone there spoke exceedingly well, and barring the one or two slips into election bickering I don't really understand why that group of players doesn't get along a little better.

Oh, and whoever was the Norns, good on you for asking the question no-one could answer!

I was going to answer it, but I was still manually logging at that point and couldn't find time. *shrug*

Very different views for how Glomdoring should be, I'm guessing.

Interesting log.

I think you're right, Arel. I just don't understand why the core issues of identity and consistency are brushed over all the time, no matter how many times it is pointed out.

And... a cop out? What does that mean? I just don't fathom how you can watch the situation for two years and not come to the same conclusions, and at least analyze those deeper issues with an open mind. I don't think you can spend thousands of dollars and hours on a game and then quit over minor RP tweaks you disagree with - I certainly didn't. I would -love- to come back and invest as much as I did, but no matter how often I try, I always get so disillusioned with the same patterns that keep popping up. I really do think Glomdoring fundamentally altered the foundations of Lusternia's RP integrity, and while a lot of that has been repaired with time, I think its folly to continue the same path and expect different results.

I guess the only conclusion I can come to is that many of Lusternia's influences are coming from those who enjoy hard roleplay (complete separation between player and character - acting a defined role like in a play, with next to no immersion), and I just don't.

Meh, maybe I'm wrong, and it is as simple as switching people around, let's hope so.

Although it gives me no end of satisfaction that no matter how much I am dismissed and put down, the opposing view just hasn't worked.

I dunno, I really don't think Glomdoring's RP as a problem, nor is the 'forcing' and 'change' that Daganev described.

However, that log was really..depressing. Cutting Glom off from Monks and the portal is like taking someone off life support. Good luck, guys.

At the end of the day it's people's attitude that's the problem, and leaders who do nothing but argue with each other. The RP of Glomdoring has nothing to do with it, it's just that some people don't seem to care anymore. I just hope that our efforts don't end up being wasted because of some selfish people.

Too many kings and not enough pawns.

Anyway, we have an IRL month?

Hmmm... Gonna be gone for a few days.. But after that it's time to get busy.

To those who play in other orgs, make alts and play them, so we don't get shut down! If you can't beat them, cheat!!

//that last bit was only semi-serious... But really, come check us out and give constructive criticism please.

Thanks for the log.

I have mixed feelings about the meet itself though. Lots of problems discussed, but not really any solutions. The idea of replacing those five is interesting. I have nothing against any of them IC or OOC and I've liked the ones that I've talked to on AIM, Bellators, irc, etc, but maybe replacing them could be a good thing, even though I doubt the problems can completely be blamed on them. Sometimes you can put great and productive people together and have nothing useful come of it. Replacing leaders gives the opportunity to start a lot of things fresh, but at the same time there is a good chance that anyone replacing them would either not know any different from the ways Glomdoring has been lead, or will be afraid to make the drastic changes that are needed. It really is terribly unfair for those five, but it is just a game, and the game can still be played without an elected position.

Meh.

Yes, there is in general, a problem with organizations that are publicly known for being secretive and manipulative.

Yes, very few people want to do that for fun and thus don't join them.

That is my understanding as well.

Removing Newbies might actually be a good thing, then the aspect of Seduction and Beauty within Glomdoring can be emphasised more, since there will have to be effort to bring people there.

That is by far the most asinine thing I have ever heard on these forums.